Care to comment

[jkidd]

Ok what's everyone's opinion on the Kong Anchor Swivel. Reading other sites some hate them and some love them. The 1/4" one has a working load of 1870 lbs and a break strength of 5500 lbs. The specs say there almost twice as strong as a shackle.

 

[Wandering Sagebrush]

I have no experience with it, but it looks like it's a quality shackle.

 

[Sunbeam]

I've never liked anchor swivels, because they were just one more thing to potentially go wrong (but that said, I have never found the need for one, either, and shackle alone has always worked fine).

Over the years I have read about a number of swivels that have had issues, but that doesn't mean the one you show does. Still, I would check its provenance.

One last thing is that I prefer not to have stainless in my (galvanized) ground tackle stream. I also wonder about crevice corrosion (because it is stainless).

In case it's not obvious, I pretty much dislike stainless anchor swivels, so please take my opinion with that (large) grain of salt.

 

[jkidd]

I've never liked anchor swivels, because they were just one more thing to potentially go wrong (but that said, I have never found the need for one, either, and shackle alone has always worked fine).

Over the years I have read about a number of swivels that have had issues, but that doesn't mean the one you show does. Still, I would check its provenance.

One last thing is that I prefer not to have stainless in my (galvanized) ground tackle stream. I also wonder about crevice corrosion (because it is stainless).

In case it's not obvious, I pretty much dislike stainless anchor swivels, so please take my opinion with that (large) grain of salt.

I can see the problem with the dissimilar metals. While I was hunting around I found one site that showed where a Kong had come apart and they lost their anchor. They speculated it had broke but it look like the screw had backed out and it just fell apart. Then I found another site where they showed a shackle that had broke at the thread section of the shackle. I course I don't know how much load was put on it to make it do that. Right now all I have is a shackle. I did see one site that recommended going up one size on the shackle so 1/4 " chain 5/16" shackle. Just looking at all the options right now. I guess talking out load and listening at everyone's opinions.

 

[Sunbeam]

Right now all I have is a shackle. I did see one site that recommended going up one size on the shackle so 1/4 " chain 5/16" shackle.

I would agree on that one. Even with the 5/16" shackle (which is the largest that will fit through 1/4" anchor chain), there is an issue with 1/4" high test (G4) chain in that there are no high test 5/16" shackles available (that I have ever found). Therefore the shackle is always the weak link (even when it is 5/16"). I use the Crosby red (or you could say orange) pin U.S. made shackles (which are still weaker than the chain, but the best option I know of for 1/4" G4 chain).

With larger chain sizes you can get high test shackles so they "match" the chain strength.

Not that I'm saying this is a problem in the real world, but just mentioning it.

 

[Will-C]

I don't know about the King Kong swivel but I bought a Suncor universal model in April from Defender ($83.99). I switched to a 25# Manson Supreme and 50' of chain. I was up in the air on the swivel but having spent most of our kids inheritance already on the boat I figured what's another couple bucks. I always used shackles but never anchored that much while sleeping over night aboard on previous boats. I like to sleep peacefully knowing I have done a little overkill in the boat emergency brake department. For me I think that a C-Dory getting bounced around at anchor and parting a swivel is somewhat unlikely. I'm sure there will be some with a different opinion. I'm not worried about it. The extra chain we added should allow us to be able to have enough scope with out having to have much more than our chain deployed as we usually anchor in water of ten feet or less. With the extra chain I thought the swivel made sense.
D.D.

 

[BrentB]

I never saw the need for a swivel connection.

This might change after reading this thread and when we start boating and anchoring more when I retire and gain more experience on the hook

 

[thataway]

I tried an anchor swivel once. I didn't see that it advent any positive to the anchoring experience. This particular swivel was galvanized, did not swivel well under load, but it did not have the defect that most of the SS anchor swivel's have. That is failure if side loaded:



This is an image which I got off the internet, and I have no idea what happened. but I have heard of others who have had similar failures. If the SS side arms are attached directly to the anchor shank there is always the possibility of being side loaded, especially in an abrupt change of direction of the wind or current. The strength of these swivels is tested in direct lineal load, not side load--which is a common point of failure.

What benefit is there with a swivel at the anchor? The one place I can see an advantage is with a Bahamian moor, and where the current changes 4 times a day, and after several days, you have a real twist of the two anchor lines. One way to get around this, is to have two anchor rodes made up the Length for that depth. An eye splice is at the boat end, and those two joined with a large Bow shackle, which then attaches to a pennant to the bow of the boat via a swivel. The first anchor is set normally, and the vessel drops back to the limit of anchor cable. A second anchor is attached to the end of the anchor cable, and is dropped and set. A swivel is attached to the middle of the anchor cable, and the vessel connected to that.

We have never really seen the need for a swivel, even after many days at anchor. If the rode, and chain have twisted, then bring the anchor up slowly, and let it "unwind".

 

[localboy]

We had a swivel and I liked it. I removed it due to all the failures I kept hearing about. Don't remember the brand, but is was US made; not China.

Now the damn rode is constantly twisting; it came off the gypsy numerous times last weekend and the line/chain jammed in the hawse pipe once due to all the twists. I need to find 300' of water and let it hang and un-twist.

As regards side-load, I've seen swivels AND shackles used together.

 

[Will-C]

Well I wonder the actual circumstances of pictured failed swivel . It would seem the anchor must have been in rocks or it was a much bigger boat than a C-Dory. I wonder if it bent the shank on the anchor? I guess the threads on the bolt or the bolt/pin would actually have to fail or fall partially out for that to bend like that. I'll let you know if ours fails. The sky is falling , the sky is falling!
D.D.

 

[Sunbeam]

...due to all the twists. I need to find 300' of water and let it hang and un-twist.

You may not be serious, but if so, check before-hand that your windlass (presuming you have one) will be able to lift this much rode hanging free. Some cruising folks I know did this (for the same reason) and found theirs was not up to the task. They had to motor into shallower water to take some of the weight off (a bit scary, but it all turned out okay).

 

[Sunbeam]

The sky is falling , the sky is falling!
D.D.

To each their own, but I have seen enough boats on the rocks due to various failures of the ground tackle, that I think considering each component is a valuable exercise.

In my case I never needed a swivel, so there was no reason to introduce an extra component.

If you are happy with yours, that's cool too.

 

[localboy]

...due to all the twists. I need to find 300' of water and let it hang and un-twist.

You may not be serious, but if so, check before-hand that your windlass (presuming you have one) will be able to lift this much rode hanging free. Some cruising folks I know did this (for the same reason) and found theirs was not up to the task. They had to motor into shallower water to take some of the weight off (a bit scary, but it all turned out okay).

It was a joke. The thought of walking out all that line somewhere and untwisting it is not appealing.

 

[jkidd]

The Kong swivel is made a lot different than the others. The anchor side twists and cams together then the clamp is put on the chain side. It is held together with one bolt. So if you put loc tight or vibra tight on it that might be all that is needed to stop it from working loose. Looking at the Kong swivel I can't help but wonder if it is stronger than the shackle. When I see the failures I can't help but wonder if simply checking things every now and then would have prevented quite a few of them from ever happening. I realize that some of the failures might not have been maintenance issues and maybe they simply exceeded the load capacities. So I'm just looking at what is out there and if there is a better choice at some point that I need to try.

 

[Aurelia]

We had a simple swivel on the 25 kit with windlass but now we are just using a simple shackle and I like it just fine. I will say you have to mind it as it passes through the roller but I am up there minding anyway without a windlass. I feel like the nicer swivels are impressive from a product and engineering standpoint but I also don't feel the need for one.

I come from a world of complex land rigging for recreational and rescue work putting my life and too many others on systems of hardware and software (rope/cable). There are always methods of keeping it simple and getting the same job done and each advance in tech (close watched back then) is generally to save a bit of time or to "dress up" a rigging mess to look more like technology than problem solving.

I see the nicer swivels as a "dressing up" for the rode. And perhaps more useful on a scale beyond C-Dorys.

I have pulled ours out and just walked down the driveway until I run out of rode, then untie the bitter end and run gloved hands down the rode from anchor back to bitter end and that pulled the twists out quickly and easily in ten minutes total work. Don't try the other direction of course. I think letting it dangle could work but it would be slower than you think, and harder to haul back in.

Greg

 

[Will-C]

I have read that a swivel can let an anchor set better or stay set because it prevents some of the twisting of the chain which eventually might try and twist the anchor from laying flat to the bottom. Ours has a swivel on one end and another joint that allow it to pivot from side to side to prevent the dreaded side load. I guess that's another point of failure for the partly cloudy instead of the partly sunny group. I just wonder if anyone with C-Dory ever had a swivel fail? I could see if you stuck and anchor where the swivel might be a point of failure if it got pulled sideways etc.
As to the dissimilar metals the aluminum Fortress anchors with galvanized chain are a problem also?
I'm not in any way suggesting everyone rush out and install a swivel but I wonder why they are even sold with the picture painted here of imminent failure? Just a discussion not trying to poke at the bear. :|
D.D.

 

[Sea Wolf]

<some edited>
As to the dissimilar metals the aluminum Fortress anchors with galvanized chain are a problem also? :|
D.D.

I've never heard of a problem with that combination, which I have.

Probably has something to do with the heavy anodizing on the Fortress anchors.

You can see and feel how slick and heavy the anodizing is if you get a few small scratches from rocks.

Also, the hard aluminum alloy chosen for the Fortress anchors may be one that is less active in relation to zinc coated steel chain and salt water.

The most informed answer would probably come from a technical rep at the manufacturer of Fortress and Guardian anchors.

It's obviously not a problem or the word would be out to not use their product.

Joe. :teeth :thup

 

[Barry Rietz]

Bob's post of the stainless steel swivel photo is the "textbook example" of not serving the clevis pin with safety wire! Nuff said...

 

[Sunbeam]

Bob's post of the stainless steel swivel photo is the "textbook example" of not serving the clevis pin with safety wire! Nuff said...

Just curious: How could you tell what happened with the clevis pin in the photo Bob posted?

Is serving the same as mousing? You'd think if that were the case, the clevis pin would have dropped out and the two just fallen apart, with no strain or breakage(?)

Side note: I have a friend who shackled on a new anchor one afternoon and forgot to mouse the pin. He woke up suddenly at 3 a.m. and remembered it (he was not aboard). As it turns out the pin had (indeed) fallen out in the middle of the night, and the boat (25,000#, full keel) had somehow threaded its way out of a busy mooring field - without apparently hitting any other boats - and gone adrift. The bad part was having to pay around $1000 the next morning to get it out of impound (the Coast Guard had found it drifting in the very busy bay); but he was still SO thankful as it could have been so much worse! I'm sure he has never forgotten to mouse another shackle.

 

[jkidd]

I guess were going to need somebody to do side by side stress tests.