Suggestion Box for C-Dory Factory

Forrest,
I think all boats are a lifestyle. Boats require constant care and that is part of the lifestyle. I’m sure people fish off Ranger Tug’s and I have had a cocktail or two on my C-Dory. Most products evolve over time and I think that is the drift of this thread. To say that what Ranger Tug does won’t work for C-Dory because they are a different style of boat I think is missing the point. Dealers on threads mention being left in the dark about important information. I hope Triton flourishes. This thread was just suggestion box not meant to be nitpicking. Scott Boysen from Triton Marine on another thread said he thought it was a good thing. Here’s what he said on the Sea Sport Out of Business thread. “I like the link with suggestions, I will start reading these more and more during the next couple of weeks as you start to see us take a bigger role in this C-brats page”. So maybe this all isn’t so bad. No one wants to beat anyone up. Some people are more opinionated than others. Back away from the keypads??? Not me. Look at the Mustangs now. :D
D.D.
 
forrest":8rr8amdv said:
Bill your point is well taken , for Ranger Tugs. But what is the use of a Ranger Tug? It's socializing. You're either tied up to the dock, having a cocktail, socializing or on a slow cruise socializing with friends and family. It's a benefit to have factory involvement. It's a lifestyle. But basically Ranger makes the same model of boat that comes in different lengths and width...

... Let's all hope that they make it and continue the line of boats that we all love. No offense intended to anyone.
You all have a great day,
Forrest
Click to expand...

Hi Forrest,

It could certainly be said that the C-Dory models are the same boat in different lengths and widths. The key to getting the "best" boat is finding the boat that best fits your use. Many of us here think the C-Dory fits that bill. I'm sure the Ranger folks feel the same way about their boats. Let's see... a 25 foot boat that has a v-berth, an enclosed helm, a dinette, a galley, an enclosed head with a shower and a decent size cockpit; economical to run, able to handle a variety of weather and sea conditions; good looking and well made; able to run at displacement speed while burning about a gallon per hour or pushing the throttle forward and cruising in the mid-teens. Tell me, did I just describe a C-Dory 25 or a Ranger Tug 25? The engine/hull/fuel/under-pinnings may be different, but these boats are more alike than they are different in use.

I learned a long time ago to not disparage another guy's boat, dog, or wife (you decide the order). :roll: I have seen no evidence that any of the last three C-Dory builders understood/understands customer relations like the folks at Ranger Tug. From my perspective, this "suggestion box" needs only one item: be responsive to your customers' wants and needs. That would cover all the things discussed here, as well as providing good customer service. When I see a post from a dealer who laments about not being told what is happening with the factory, it speaks volumes.

Re: socializing... C-Brats can certainly be a social bunch - one glance at the various gatherings listed on this forum is evidence of that. For some folks, boating is about the socializing. For others, it's about heading out on the next adventure. I've certainly run into Ranger Tugs cruising on their own when we've been out on our boat. Boat use is as varied as the owners' ideals and taste.

Being responsive to customers doesn't come naturally for some folks. Those people should hire someone to help build their business. The boat business isn't just about building boats, it's also about creating demand for your product. Marketing can't be ignored if a business is going to survive. Sadly. many ex-business owners never learned that. In today's world, there is no reason to go a week without a phone number or constant communication with the people on the front lines - the dealers. 8 posts in as many months doesn't show much effort on behalf of a manufacturer. A statement that they intend to be more proactive isn't the same as being proactive. I certainly understand the comparisons and contrasts between the C-Dory manufacturer(s) and the Ranger factory folks. One is "walking the walk". I'm all for giving the Triton people the benefit of the doubt, but I'd feel more confident with on-going efforts being evident.

The best thing that C-Dory has going for it right now is this forum. Active and enthusiastic. Ask a question and you'll get some answers. Want to do some "show and tell", and there will be an audience. Care for socializing? There is probably a gathering somewhere in your part of the country. Bare bones or tricked out, we all learn from each other here. If you're a fishing kinda person, you can probably snag a seat or get a tip on a good location here. This is the ONE source of all that is C-Dory that I depend on.

How anyone involved in the production of these boats can let this amazing resource go ignored is beyond me.

Jim B.
 
Jim,
I agree you can describe the 25 C-Dory and the Ranger Tug with the same words. Although I would like to see a Ranger Tug go across the Columbia River Bar when it is rough. A 22 C-Dory can be a working boat, a cruiser, a fishing boat or all three at the same time. It’s up to the person who owns it and modifies it to their needs. Not so for the Tug.
I’m just trying to get people to be a cheer leader for Triton rather than the criticism directed to Triton for not responding to every question or concern from members of this forum. They are busy trying to survive right now. I realize that all C-Dory owners are special snowflakes and you deserve the all undivided attention that comes with owning a C-Dory. However I think we need to allow Triton to reorganize, get their feet on solid ground and answer the needs of all their customers whether they own C-Dorys, SeaSports, Skigit Orcas, Ospreys, or Tom Cats. And Jim, even though this is off topic, I still believe that Ranger Tugs are one dimensional boats. It doesn’t matter what I think as long as the owner likes it. I can have an opinion about a style of boat and it wouldn’t mean anything to the owner as long as he is happy about his purchase. My approval or lack of it would not validate anybody’s choice of a boat that fits their desires or needs. Please post all your suggestions for the factory to review. Like I said, they can take them or leave them but I implore all Brats to support and encourage the factory during these tough economic times. And that's all I got to say about that.
Regards,
Forrest
 
Hi Forrest,

I certainly agree that you are entitled to your opinion. Over the years, I have been an enthusiastic supporter of C-Dory. I absolutely agree that they are very versatile boats. Beyond that, I'll have to see some indication from ANY builder that they are responsive to their customers. To mis-quote another famous Forrest, "Responsive is as responsive does." And let's not forget the also-enthusiastic Jerry McGuire: "Show me the responsive!"

In the past 4 years, you can count the number of responses here from the various C-Dory factory folks on two hands and a foot. I found them all to be equally unresponsive to direct e-mails and phone calls. I don't know the SeaSport/Triton folks, but I have heard about the quality boats they built. When debate here has gone on about warranty, whether they are in business or not, who actually owns the molds and rights, etc, etc, the factory folks have apparently always been so busy that they can't take the time to keep their dealers in the loop, much less make a post here.

I hope Triton is able to not only survive, but thrive. No ill will on my part. BUT, to get my enthusiastic support, they will have to earn it. From what I've seen to this point, they have a long ways to go. My praise for the various C-Dory models can be found all over this forum. I have no intention of swapping out Wild Blue for ANY other boat at this time, but if something catastrophic happened to her, I would certainly be looking for an equally capable boat from an enthusiastic builder.

I don't know if you bought your boat new or used, and it doesn't matter to me. What a manufacturer needs is a bunch of people looking to buy NEW boats. And that is something that has changed here over the 4 years I've been on this forum: the lack of new people signing on, saying, "I'm looking to buy a new C-Dory, and I have some questions..." We can all sit around and cheer, "Run, Triton, run!", but until there are buyers ready to plunk down some cash, nothing is going to happen. There are people out there buying new boats... why doesn't C-Dory have a piece of that action?

For years, I have given the C-Dory factory suggestions on what I would be looking for in a new boat... and some suggestions on marketing. A "suggestion box" is only good if someone opens it once in a while, reads the suggestions, and makes an effort to implement some of the good suggestions. A response of any kind once in a while might show that they are making the effort. I've seen damn little of that.

Meanwhile, the builder of those "one dimensional" boats has orders. And responds to questions and inquiries. And continues to improve their boats as owners offer suggestions. And makes new models to meet customer desires. And those boat owners are taking their boats to the Bahamas, all over the PNW, the Gulf Coast, the Great Loop, the Erie Canal and Hudson River, Lake Powell, etc, etc. It seems to me that Ranger Tug owners are doing what I bought Wild Blue to do: using the boat.

Here's a suggestion: see what another builder who has orders is doing different to GET those orders.

And that's all I got to say about that.

Respectfully,
Jim B.
 
Hi,
I was reading a Sportfishing magazine last night and saw an ad for Scout Boats. Looks like they are doing ok. I owned a Scout 18' center console w a 115hp Yamaha which was a great boat. If you get a chance look at Scouts website www.scoutboats.com click on the new 34' center console. The virtual tour is pretty amazing. Fishing boats are evolving. I know this boat is not ever ones cup of tea but this good marketing in my humble opinion. What Scout is doing I think is where boat manufacturers need to be. Virtual tours have taken hold in home sales vacation rentals,etc, the options list is also worth looking at as they have the idea that people want these items and they seem willing to provide them. Just a suggestion here to look at whats at there. I know there is a lot going on now, but the future waits for no one.
D.D.
 
When it comes to factory support and owner relations let me just mention one name, Grady White. I had owned Boston Whalers since 1987 and bought my first Grady White Tournament 225 in 2008. I have never been treated better by any dealer network or manufacturer in my life. Their customer service and support is second to none. And yes they pay a lot of attention to Great Grady, their equivalent of C Brats. If anyone thinks I'm exaggerating, just talk to any Grady owner. I just wish they built a boat like a C Dory Cruiser 25 or Venture 26. Unfortunately their closest comparable model is the 29' Chesapeake which costs close to $200K. I really like the C Dory 25 or 26 but the uncertainty of their ownership really concerns me. Hopefully as the economy improves that problem will take care of itself.
 
Hi,
I finally got some cards to carry on the boat with the C-Dory factory address, new phone number and our names and boat model. The C-Brats website and our email address. They were free from www.vistaprint.com :D all we paid for was the shipping, about 5 dollars and change as long as you let them put their small free blurb on the back with their website address. I'll hand these cards out to interested parties in my travels. You never know someone might bite.
D.D.
 
Those who have built a business from scratch and survived quickly learned one fact...
Either you go the extra mile for your customer, or they will go the extra mile to your competition...
 
Levitation":333ddg1z said:
Those who have built a business from scratch and survived quickly learned one fact...
Either you go the extra mile for your customer, or they will go the extra mile to your competition...
Click to expand...

Yep. The business we built though hard work, attention to detail, and responding to customer needs allowed us to retire in our early 50s. It was an on-going, never-ending process. We never took for granted that our clients would continue to patronize us. We considered every phone call or e-mail inquiry an opportunity. As part of our business, I presented seminars to professional organizations on Providing Great Customer Service. We had "rules" that we lived by: never put anyone on hold for more than 30 seconds; never let the phone ring more than twice; every person that comes in the door will be greeted within a few seconds; return every phone message left overnight immediately that morning; smile when you answer the phone or greet a customer coming in the door; check and double check every order; everyone is part of quality control - if we find a weak area, correct it immediately; thank every client for placing their trust in us; do more than is expected; a special request isn't an interruption - it's an opportunity to learn another (perhaps better) way to do our jobs; promote to bring in new business (not the same as advertising, btw)... promoting your product in an appropriate place... oh, like say if you sell a particular brand of boat, participate in that owners forum for free, to build customer loyalty and brand enthusiasm.

Anyone heard from the current C-Dory factory folks in the past month or two? (sound of crickets chirping). :roll:
 
Don't know if anyone saw my message and associated thread on finding a key for my boat, but I read the last message and laughed out loud. During my quest for a key, I attempted to contact the C-Dory folks to see if they could help me out. Not a peep, not a word, nothing. I'd sure hate to be somebody owning a new boat and needing a warranty issue solved. These guys don't seem to want to respond at all. At least I finally found a place to get spare keys for the door on my boat. :-)
 
Here’s my factory suggestion. I think they ought to take the 25 and turn it into the Venture series boat and take the 26 and make it the step up from the 22 with a marine head. I say this because the 26 is a better fishing platform than the 25 and the 25 is a better cruiser than the 26. Here’s my reasons:
1)The 25 has a bigger cabin than the 26
2)The 25 seats three at the dinette, the 26 seats two
3)The raised cockpit is an advantage at the dock
Now the reasons why the 26 is a better fishing platform than the 25:
1)Full height motor well that blocks wind waves from coming into the boat while backing into the waves bottom fishing. I know they have to come in the 25 since I’ve had some come into the 26 while fishing offshore or in the straights while backing into the wind to make my line hang straight so I don’t get snagged on the bottom.
2)Not having the raised deck for self bailing gives you a more stable fishing platform. The further you are away from the surface of the water the more you are going to be tossed around. If you have crew members who get seasick this is a significant advantage to keep them upright. It also makes it easier to maintain your balance while playing or netting a fish.
3)You are able to reach over the gunnel of a 26 and touch the water. This allows you to wash your hands in the salt water (to remove fish slime, bait slime or smelly jelly) without using up your fresh water. It also allows for easier netting of your fish and allows you to reach over the side and bleed your fish easier.
4)The wider gunnels allow you to mount your downriggers to the gunnel rather than a platform custom built to attach to the stainless steel hand rail on the 25.
5)The 26 has a larger cockpit than the 25. More room to play that fish and hang out with buddies while fishing.
6)The 26 has a smoother ride than the 25. The ocean almost always has wind chop. You can make better time out to the fishing spot and not lose all your teeth.
7)The marine head on the 26 would give the fishermen who now have the 22 a place for the women in their lives to answer the call of nature and still have an excellent fishing platform that the 22 delivers.
Now these are just my opinions and my opinions should not matter as long as you are happy with your boat for whatever purpose you choose to use it for. Please don’t get bent out of shape about it. It is OK to disagree. This is not meant to disparage anyone’s boat. I’m just talking fishing platforms. I know that there are Brats on this site that have said the 25 doesn’t fish as well as the 22. I would agree with that supposition. The 26 fishes real well.
Forrest
 
Tom,
SeaSport just took over the C-Dory line within the last year. Why would you expect them to know where to get keys for a model made in 2000? It would have been nice of them to respond with a “I don’t know”, but cut them a little slack, ….please. They are just now in a process of reorganizing and moving to a new manufacturing facility.
Forrest
 
There were times in our business where we did not offer a service or product that someone inquired about... we still responded to their inquiry... right away. I find it interesting, Forrest, that you feel the need to tell others to "cut (Triton) a little slack." Business principles are important in today's business climate. Should a business only return a call or e-mail if they can sell something? And who's to say that Triton doesn't have the key information? Would you say "it would be nice" for them to respond to a warranty question on a new boat, or would that fall into a different category? Hopefully, you won't have a question of them regarding your boat, since the 2007 Venture wasn't built by C-Dory.

Any business that picks and chooses which inquiries to respond to sounds to me like a business that should be cut more than slack.

There was a time when we were still business owners that the phone company cut a line that affected our business. We discovered it when we picked up the phone and had no dial tone. Within a few minutes, I had all our business calls routed to my cell phone... because as any business owner will tell you: if there are no inquiries, you aren't selling anything!

You are right - it's been about a year. Yes, they restructured. They were without a phone or contact info for a week or so. In early May, they said they would participate more here, but the only post since then has been today in response to more rumors. I don't expect them to be on here as much as you or me, but there is a big difference between intentions and actions. We've seen this sort of indifference before, and if you've been here more than a few years, you've seen what the results were.

22, 25, 26... how the boats should be promoted doesn't matter much if the factory has no orders. You want to cut them some slack? Buy a new boat from them. I realize the economy is still in the crapper and lots of boat manufacturers don't have orders... but, some do. And those that do seem to be the ones who are responsive to their customers. Cut them some slack? Maybe they should cut their dealers some slack and keep them in the loop. Maybe they should look at who is selling boats and see what those folks are doing that they aren't.

My apologies in advance if this violates the "just be nice" policy, but it breaks my heart to see a great boat line like our C-Dorys get mishandled yet again. I don't care if they build one boat a month, they should be communicating with their dealers to see who the lucky person is that will get that boat. If they had any business savvy whatsoever, they would be showing us progress photos and talking about the cool boat that they are in the process of building. They should be returning phone calls and e-mail inquiries.

I understand from a business perspective why they didn't take on the warranty liabilities of boats they didn't build. That topic created a lot of uproar here. I don't understand why any manufacturer of ANY product wouldn't take advantage of communicating with an enthusiastic group of owners... people who could help them sell more product... just by the positive word of mouth. I think we all have seen where customer indifference leads; and those who do not learn from history are destined to repeat it.

I fully well realize that taking this stand is like screaming into the wind. My guess, Forrest, is that you've never owned a business, because the buying public DOESN'T cut you any slack. They expect your best efforts in all you do, every time... and that's what successful businesses do. Don't take care of a potential customer and they move on. Justifiably.

I love my C-Dory. I bought it new. I would say the factory got my support. Oh, that was a couple factory owners ago. How much slack should we cut the current makers (who knows who owns what these days)? How many non-responses are acceptable? For how long?

For my money, a business should be responsive from day one. Anything less than that and I'd have serious doubts about how they'd be after they have your money.

Reading your suggestions, Forrest, it appears that they all apply to one thing: fishing. Some might consider that "one dimensional."

No need to lock this down because of my response here, Bill and Mike. The premise of this thread is really good, but, as can be seen from all the factory (non)response on it, it's pretty much for those of us who own these boats. I promise this will be my last "suggestion" on this thread.

With respect and frustration,
Jim B.
 
Hi, I thought I would pipe in with my thoughts on Triton.

I would take a position in the middle.

Maybe they are in survival mode. Maybe they have cut back their staff and everybody is working harder. Maybe they will only build 45 boats per year because that is all that they can sell. Maybe they have found producing too many boats reduces their margins on every boat because more employees are harder to control (quality).
I know I am working harder and doing other peoples jobs as well as mine.

Hey, there still around and building and selling boats...

Kudos to Triton.

Customer service may be lacking in some of your opinions, but I say QUALITY is most important and they have the reputation!
 
Jim,
You have to be kidding me, last post on this thread? We need you man. I have been critical at times of the various owners/ builders of C-Dory boats. It was a short ride but Fluid Marine seemed to be on the right track. I'm trying to actually help these folks by putting their latest phone number on a business card that I will hand out to interested parties. Even car dealers offer bird dog fees to folks who shove business their way. I'm not looking for that, but the lack of involvement on the C-Brat site by the factory on a regular basis would seem to indicate they think we are strokers or worse. I know some dealers don't feel this site sells boats because we are just enthusiasts. But I bought a new boat because of this site. The guy looking for the key is just one example of how someone interested in buying a new boat can see the free support that is offered here by the C-Brat community and not the factory. Why not feed the lead of inquiry to a dealer? As a Venture owner God Bless Ross of Pacific Wanderer fame and the others who chimed in with recommendations on how to handle water getting in between the core and the floor on the 23' Ventures was another example of this sites ability to put fears to rest and how to handle the matters at hand. For owners of these boats that is heavy stuff. What I wonder about, where was the factory's input? Yeah, they didn't build the boat but I think they have built a few 23' Ventures maybe some info on what they thought could be the problem would not have cost them much and would have gone a long way to show they gave a rats ass about us. I mean why wouldn't they have a data base on where to buy things and a price list. No need to stock just have the info, take the order, run the credit card and have the item drop shipped like the keys to the customer. Something like replacement keys is an opportunity to make a modest markup and let a satisfied customer spread the word that these folks are a ok. Instead of what we saw on this site. I'm not picking on them here as much as I think they should wake up and see the value of their input on this site. People have every right to defend them but for me that seems to be a little fishy. As for Forrest's idea on the new model line, I bought a 23 Venture not a 22' cruiser as I wanted the standard options that it came with the Venture and a little more V to break a chop. I also wanted for me, at least a lower trailerable weight so a 25 for me was out of the question. My boat can run 20 to 25 mph in a two foot chop without pounding too much. That was the real reason for not going with a 22' which for some is a fine boat. I hope they continue to offer the 23' Venture as we love ours and enjoy this site and all it provides. More factory involvement would be better for everyone. Now I'm thinking about putting Tolands new boat's info on the back of the card. Maybe Scott has been kidnapped? :)
D.D
 
I think those of you who are being critical of Seasport or Triton's lack of attention to these insignificant little customer service and owner support thingies need to remember that they are still right smack in the middle of trying to come to grips with whether or not embroider a logo on the seat cushions.
 
I’m totally sorry that my post offended anyone. I actually thought I had a good idea. From reading many of the C-Brat posts I figured that most of the people who had 25s were cruisers rather than fishermen and would prefer the more plush interior that is presently incorporated in the 26’s interior. I also thought it would be nice for C-Dory to have a fishing platform with a head. The 26 really is a nice fishing platform but the plush interior doesn’t go well with fish blood, slime and smelly jelly. Maybe SeaSport could just offer a plain Jane model of the 26. Anyway you have my sincere apology. Mea Culpa It won’t happen again.
Forrest
 
based on past performance I don't see why anyone would expect any thing from the factory right now???

I had hopes that a company with there rep, and sea sport has been around a long time has a good rep, would not use this site to their advantage. You just cant get some folks to understand the usefulness of the web or sites like this.

I bought my c-dory when Jeff was still there. He gets the web and how to use it as a tool for customer service. Sea sport does not. and because of that they will not survive in the market place today.

I just don't know why after months of trying anyone here bothers to still try and get the factory to care.
 
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