How do TC fishboxes fill with water?

As I mentioned before, it seems that rain is the main source of fish box water accumulation on my boat. I think they may have raised the drain lines or something. We were in horrendous storms with 35k winds gusting to 55k and massive waves breaking over the boat, but no significant fish box water from all that. When I first got to it in the storage yard, before ever being put in the water, however, the boxes were full of water.

I am wondering if the cockpit floor structure could stand routing a drainage path back to the scupper wells and then bonding a raised lip inside the fish box wells up to the level of the lids. That would relieve some of the hydraulic pressure on the seals I'm guessing.

I think aft weight is a contributing factor to water in the fish boxes. Having the bait live-well, there was not room to install the two house batteries. I am having some golf cart batteries installed under the aft dinette cabinet. I'm a bit nervous about that extra weight, but there are too many electrical loads to get by with only one house battery.

The best answer to fish box water accumulation would be a natural, gravity based design to lessen water pressure on the seals.

As far as the live well goes, I am amazed that the person who installed it did not notice the recessed "well" area in the bottom designed for a drain fitting. They just put the drain fitting 1 1/2 inches ABOVE the solid bottom of the drain well. Did it not cross anybody's mind at the C-Dory plant that that location leaves the owner with a continual job of sponging stinky water out of the bottom 1 1/2 inch of the tank? Easily over a gallon of stagnant water in there all the time!

OK Bob of Thataway..... my chin's up.....hit me..... with the "I told you so"..... LOL

I still love this boat. The basic design and construction is great.

John
 
drjohn71a":3snkx9ph said:
As far as the live well goes, I am amazed that the person who installed it did not notice the recessed "well" area in the bottom designed for a drain fitting.
John
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John, You have stated the root cause of most of the problems we have all had with the TC. It's the mysterious "person" who should have caught or noticed this or that. It's a personell problem that we have no control over.
 
JoeC Wrote
Clearly the idiot who wrote, " how about putting fish in the fish boxes" Hasn't gone fishing for more than about 2 hours. Duh! Or, if he has, I'm not eating his fish!!!!
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Someone needs to work on their people skills.....
 
Man, this is a great web site.
This post has convinced me to stay away from TC's . Some owners seem to have no problems and others it seems to be a huge problem. I'm curious, How many of you would do it again?
I'm looking into the C-Ranger. Anyone have any knowledge about it?
Seen a nice boat in the Bahamas, made by Rosborough Boats made in Canada. Looks a lot like C-Dory. Any input on that?
captd
 
The Rosborough is a fine boat IMO. I've never owned one but have spent some time aboard one. The Canadian Government uses a whole bunch of them. One of them, which is a local boat, has a single 90 Honda -- seems a bit under-powered to me but the owner loves it.The other has a pair of Honda 150s - and the owner loves it! So what's right for the boat? Durned if I know. The boat seems to run great in the speed range I'd like to cruise -- 10-20 knots.

Just one old guys take, and not much water time -

Dusty
 
captd":2eb8rhqu said:
Man, this is a great web site.
This post has convinced me to stay away from TC's . Some owners seem to have no problems and others it seems to be a huge problem. I'm curious, How many of you would do it again?
I'm looking into the C-Ranger. Anyone have any knowledge about it?
captd
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Yes, I would do it again. Don't take the griping too seriously. Sure, the fish boxes fill with water, and there are a few other things that could have been done differently. But I have put 65 hours on my Tomcat in less than 3 months. It is fast, manuverable, and cosy. It is simple to maintain. It is stable; I have been caught in 5 foor seas with waves breaking over the boat- no problem other than having to slow down to displacement speeds. On a calm day, it cruises at 35 mph with a lot left in reserve!

It is also clear that C-Dory has been listening and fixing problems as they become apparent. My boat already had almost all the problems fixed that Bob Austin (thataway) had pointed out, and I was only about 10 hulls after his.

I believe that Dr John's posts express exactly the same sentiments.

The C-Ranger 25 is an entirely different boat. From the discussion on this site and the article in Passagemaker, it is a beautiful vessel whose true niche is in the less than 15 mph market. It also costs $30,000 more than the Tomcat. The R-21 is also a great boat, but runs at less than 10 mph.
 
Hey Hammerhead,
I can hide undersize grouper under there . long needle fish fit under there,too.
That 25 ft Rosborogh can be had with diesel, I think it said up to 175 horses.
I parked behind a Canadian in Marsh Harbour, Bahamas. He had two 150 lb dogs (had to be) plus wife and daughter in that boat for weeks. I know it was a big chore to get them ashore to go potty. Just getting them on the dock from his boat was a major operation. He had a dink on the roof and a davit to hoist it up there. It had an extended overhead with lots of dink space.
captd
 
Ditto to what Alok has said.... I absolutely love this TomCat. I think all of Thataway's notes have been fixed on my hull. The fish box pump out openings are high and clear of the water. Waves crashing over don't fill the boxes and running at high speeds does not fill the boxes. Only slow seepage from rain seems to be sucked in there by capillary action or something.

The roominess of the cabin is difficult to describe. You can be cooking and have a 6 foot 2 inch guy pass you in the hall without touching. Lots of elbow room - very nice for our 4 day cruise in the rain. That forward bunk real estate is incredibly luxurious. I put my big suitcase alongside to use as a nightstand and enjoyed hours of reading in that wide open space - no claustrophobia down there. You have to get into the berth to feel the real space inside there.

Everybody who drove the boat raved over it's responsiveness and quick planing, low drag hull design.

I have had a few problems which the factory is fixing, but I would not consider trading this boat for anything else after about 300 nautical miles of cruising in heavy seas.

If there is something wrong with the cabin/hull design, you need to tell that to the dozens of ppl who lined up to get a chance to walk that big cockpit and peruse that huge cabin while I was up in Seattle!

John
 
C-Ranger .... the C-Ranger 25 tug is simply a different animal from the TomCat. You can cruise slowly in the TomCat at 7-9 knots just fine, or you can blast your way back to safety when a storm is coming in.

I love the look of the Ranger Tug, but the tiny cockpit woud be a problem for me as well as the deep draft in the waters I'll be cruising most. The berth in the tug is cozy looking, but could not hold a candle to the TomCat's huge forward berth. Seems like the tug handles heavy weather just fine. I know the TomCat handles heavy weather just fine. The tug is designed for displacement speed cruising with occasional spurts in the mid teens. The TomCat, full loaded cruises comfortably in the early 20 knots and the mid 30 knots calm and steady - or can be dropped down to a slow, single engine, economy cruise too.

With all the wet slickers from the storms, I was glad the TomCat has the Sunbrella canvas interior instead of the fine furniture upholstery of the C-Ranger. Like most C-Brats, my head is easily turned by a classic tug/trawler profile though....

John
 
I do not get significant water in the fish boxes under way. The only solution to getting water in them when on the lift, was to put a "Camper Canvas" on--now that they are protected from the rain, I can store stuff in them (when not fishing). The gaskets seem to make the boxes difficult to open, but don't keep the water out.

As for insullation. One of the requirements was that my fishboxes be insullated--"no problem" About half way thru the construction I got a conference call from the dealer and factory--someone forgot to foam the boxes and insullate them. But "we have put about 1" dynacell in the core--it should be enough". Well, the R factor is not enough! I then had a commitment from Jeff M. That he would be sure that the boxes were foamed in as best they could, from the side access, and stern access. Since I have built a number of freezers and ice boxes in boats, I didn't see any problem: foam can be fairly easily put in remote places. Imagine my surprise when I got the boat and not one single bit of foam!
"Just forgot-sorry".....!

So now I have spent about 3K more for the cockpit cover so I don't get water in the fish boxes, which aren't insullated and will not really be good for keeping fish--unless one has a lot of ice, in well insullated ice boxes! (OK there are other reasons for the cockpit cover...but still...) Oh well.

Bob Austin
 
I sure appreciate all this discussion. Guess I got lots of time to think about it. We are leaving for Florida on Monday, weather permitting. The Hunky Dory will sell better down there in the winter.
I fished out of Fredricks 24 ft. Tom Cat down in Rincon, Mexico. And I was impressed for ride and handling. He had leaks under his rub rail. The screws had popped out and waves slowly seeped in and put his batterys and wiring below water. He had his share of problems that year. Not all the boats fault either.
captd
 
A key factor in low sitting scuppers is how much weight the owner has put into the aft area. I think you have to look at the TomCat as if it were an airplane and be very careful about loading hundreds of extra pounds back there.

My boat was full of gas, full of water, and the potty was full, and a week's provisions and two people, with no adverse effects. I think if I had put hundreds of extra pounds in batteries, pumps, etc., in the stern, it may have been sitting deeper, but no problems were noted by me in hundreds of miles run in heavy seas, heavily loaded.

John
 
As John,
We have had no problem with water thru the scuppers. We have only 3 group 27 batteries aft, and the only other items in the Lazarette areas are dock lines and a light spare anchor rode. The extra batteries were added on the Port side amidships. Even with the Genset, and a full ice chest and rolled up inflatable, plus 3.5 hp; engine,--the scuppers are still at a point where no water comes in.

John is correct that trim is important in these boats.
 
drjohn71a":2xk85dh1 said:
Ditto to what Alok has said.... I absolutely love this TomCat. I think all of Thataway's notes have been fixed on my hull. The fish box pump out openings are high and clear of the water. Waves crashing over don't fill the boxes and running at high speeds does not fill the boxes. Only slow seepage from rain seems to be sucked in there by capillary action or something.
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I agree. Also, the drains for the fishboxes are now recessed in the bottom of the fishbox so draining them completely is not an issue, at least on my boat.

Warren
 
Well- time to put in a good word for the fish boxes...

We have been running the boat pretty hard the last 3 months and it was beginning to look grungy, especially the non-skid in the cockpit. There is no easy way to clean that non-skid.

Bought a 1800 PSI electric pressure washer from Home Depot for $186, including tax. Light, completely self-contained, portable, works great. Pressure washed the boat- every inch of it. The cockpit scuppers with the built in flap valves do NOT drain well enough to keep up with the inflow. If I had no fish boxes, the dirt would just float around in ankle deep water.

So- open the fish boxes, chase the water into the fish boxes, and pump overboard with the built in macerators. Easy as 1-2-3 and the cockpit is squeaky-clean.

Now if I can just get the son to pressure wash the drive-way...
 
Here's another alternative when you're out cruising and don't have access to unlimited water and electricity: wet a clean small towel and toss it on the floor of the cockpit. Step on it. Dance around the cockpit, keeping pressure on the towel. Surprising how much crud that gets in the nonskid can be picked up this way. :D

Best wishes,
Jim B.
 
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