Changes in the Keys

V

Valkyrie

New member
Hi Brats,

Marcia had a veterinary oncology meeting in Ft. Lauderdale last week so I went along to have fun and ride shotgun for her. We went down a few days early and tried to dodge the tropical storm hammering the Bahamas.

Once her conference was under way I spent a day in the Keys, one of my favorite places in the whole world. I was first there in the late 60's and it was more like the Bahamas than FL at that time.

I've seen some big changes over the years, but saw some that really hit home this time. One of our favorite "Keysy" spots was a little tiki bar/restaurant near Key Largo called Mandalay Bay. It was on the ocean side facing the anchorage off Rodriguez Key and had a laid back charm. I stopped there to grab a beer and some conch fritters only to find a sign that it was closed. Another sign announced that condos (whooppee!) and 12 docks were going in. We had spent countless hours there watching the boats, birds and water over many meals and drinks over the years, including our honeymoon.

Yet another favorite restaurant was closed a few miles south.

After spending some time in Marathon I headed back north later in the day and decided to check out Valhalla Beach Resort, a great little isolated motel where we had stayed, on the ocean with a nice beach and docks for $10 a night if you stay at the motel. (Wild Blue anchored off here and posted some pictures on their cruise.)

I tried to make reservations for March but they wouldn't guarantee that they would still be in operation then. You guessed it, more condos going in. Time shares with reciprocal privileges in Switzerland and other places. Gee, sign me up. Another one gone.

I guess I'm becoming an old curmudgeon, but I hate seeing this "progress" claiming what I believed was one of the best places in FL. I always thought that FL started at the Keys. (No offense intended to FL C-Brats!!)

Sorry - just had to vent.

Best regards,

Nick
"Valkyrie"
 
I read and article the other day or part of the article concerning how North Carolina is dealing with this problem. They are working on some sort of law that protects what they call "Working Water Front" establishments. I didn't get to finish the article but I think they were giving some sort of tax incentitives to established business's on the water front to protect them from Condo development and keep the water front open to the public. The problem you describe is in North Florida also.
 
Well, it turns out that the demand for those condos is driven by the foreign exchange rate. As the $ gets weaker, investing in beach front property in the Florida Keys becomes a great investment for the same overseas people that sell us stuff. They have money to burn, and those Florida condos look cheap to them. It's a booming business in Canada, Germany, and it looks like Switzerland. It gets cold in those places in the winter.

Not to worry though, a couple of hurricanes will fix the problem.

Boris
 
Brent

Sure know what you feel about Jackson Hole, Wy. First trip through there in l971 and it was wonderful smalltown, Wy. Lived about 50 miles from there for about 3 years in the early 80's was where we went for shopping and car service and still a great little town. Now its a pain just to drive through on our way to Yellowstone Lake, Yellowstone National Park.

The way of life these changes have created have spread out like a cancer and have now effected most of the surrounding areas and has just this year finally reached Cokeville, Wy 120 miles away.

Jay
 
I knew a farmer who sold some land for building lots. The houses were large and had beautiful unobstructed views. Then he rented out a field for a cell phone tower. The homowners complained and asked the farmer to come to community meeting. After hearing them complain, he rose slowly and said, "I don't have a cell phone".
 
We are dealing with the same situation here in Apalachicola . My wife Anita is a strong advocate for the preservation of the working waterfront and a spokesperson for the seafood industry. Its what sets us apart in a world of condos .
Marc
 
Valkyrie said:
I always thought that FL started at the Keys. (No offense intended to FL C-Brats!!)
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None taken
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Hell Bells, us brats in SW Florida are having a problem finding a public ramp to launch our boats these days due to the Condo development on our waterfront. At the present all we have is a lot of half built , and empty condos due to the real estate bust of 2006.

I love the keys also and our favorate place in Marathon, Coral Lagon is closed up and sold off to the developers too.

But not all is lost, we C-Brats need only give George & Penny (Wanderer) a call, they own one of those condo's in Marathon... :D :D
 
that's a bummer, It's happening all over, folks are drawn to nice places and end up loving them to death. Folks start moving in, condos go up and then the crime rate goes up and you have gang fights breaking out all over....hey, that's just like the Brat site. :)
One one hand you want to preserve the things that made a place nice, but one the other, can you just fence everybody else out....it's a tough ballancing act.
 
It's a tough situation... everybody wants to live by the water, and money talks. If you were the landowner and someone wanted to toss big bucks at you to go away, instead of making $10 per night on some slips, what would you do? And as those places go away, the ones that are left can (and DO) charge more.

There used to be a few places along the Texas Gulf coast that we consided "undiscovered"... they are quicky disappearing, too. Port Mansfield used to be a sleeply fishing village with a largly under-utilized marina; the last time we were there, the only slip we could find was outside a bar and it wasn't cheap. Our hometown of Port Isabel has several waterfront home/condo developments underway with prices for an empty lot starting at a quarter million. There used to be free ramps all over the area, and those are going away (either closed or charging $10; one marina now gets $150 per year to use its ramp). Because it's an "end of the road" kinda place, food and produce prices used to actually be lower (supply and demand)... not anymore.

It's definitely even more so in the Keys... commercial campgrounds in the lower Keys are gettng $85-100 per night for a campsite. We didn't stay in marinas very often last winter because prices were too steep (up to $4 per foot per night plus an extra charge for electricity and water). Even with the squeeze of more boats and more expense, we didn't have to work too hard to find decent places to anchor.

From the first time we went to the Keys years ago, it seems to me that it is becoming "The Keys, Incorporated" (my definition): businesses working to give you that "old Keys feeling" while charging a fortune. Much like the old song - they paved paradise and put up a parking lot. :roll: The water is still great, the sunsets are truly spectacular; "quaint" restaurants, bars, and cabins are getting harder to find and more expensive. Key West has become Key Weird (yes, it was always different, but now it seems to work at being weird). Still, I'd go back... try to avoid the overpriced places and enjoy what's best about the Keys.
 
Boatels or Boat Condos are becoming popular in North Florida. They are building a new one on the North Saint Johns by the Mayport Ferry. This one is super expensive. I have two friends that own property adjoining the boatel. The builders of the Boat Condo have offered them fair money for their property. One guy turned down 1.4 million for a 100 foot of waterfront 400 feet deep. Another trick I've seen along this area is to take the land under Intiment Domain. I had another friend who owned a fish camp and bar on the St Johns. It had been in his family for around 75 years. They took the land under ID and the city said they were going to build a park. Their building condos there now.
 
We know how you feel. We have been going to the Keys for the winter months since 2001. Each year we find another place gone or projected to be replaced with condos. Many are torn down but the developers have problems getting permits, etc. to build the new - so we lose a place to go while they pay the political game. We just cross our fingers every year that we'll have our marina to go back to and that they will still take us "little guys" :smiled
 
I was in the keys for a couple of years at the invitation (!) of Uncle Sam. That was in the early 60's.

I ended up living in Marathon for a time then. Ah ... the quiet sidestreets, the so-called rush of snowbirds during the winter months. You actually had to wait a minute or two to cross the highway then. Fishing by the old wooden bridge on Big Pine Island. Key lime pie at the Turtle Crossing.

Nostalgia ... it just ain't what it used to be.

Pat
 
ajens":khiakk0q said:
We know how you feel. ...
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Hi Andy,

Did you slip in here under the radar? Welcome aboard! I see you are from Brookings; we lived in the other end of the state (Spearfish) for 30 years... nice to see another South Dakotan here. :D

Where are you using your boat in your area? We spent a few days on Lewis & Clark at Yankton this summer, and enjoyed it a bunch. Have you had your CD-25 in the Keys? We spent a couple months there last winter and had a great time.

Well, as long as I hi-jacked this thread, do you know Stu Melby (he's a photographer) from Brookings?

Best wishes,
Jim B.
 
Sluch a shame--and perhaps even worse when we are selling these to non US citizens.

We had some house guests last night at Camp Thataway--and this subject came up. The beach front town that some of these folks live on, has solved it (to some degree) by decreeing that no dwellings shall be more than 35 feet hight. By the time you get the manditory 12 feet above the median tide level, this only leaves enough room for a maximum of two stories--and this keeps the developers away.

There is still some "Cheap" waterfront land in Florida--but it won't be available for long!
 
I can relate to this thread. I first saw the Keys a few times in the early 60's as a young lad with my family and went back in '74 after college with a buddy of mine from California who was seeing it for the first time. I remember lamenting to him about the changes I saw even back then! Silly me. Regardless, the bottom line of this discussion for me is that I am so glad that I was alive and able to see these places back then, i.e., the Keys, and Jackson as someone else mentioned; add to that Aspen and I am sure countless other places around this continent and the rest of the world. I am so glad to have experienced them back in the day. Most of us on this forum are fortunate to have been alive 'back in the day' and we experienced the way it was. I, for one, wouldn't trade the time period of my life for any other. We lament about the changes during our lifetimes, but at the same time we experienced so much before things changed. And guess what; we're still out there enjoying it, aren't we!
 
If you want to talk about change and the ruining of an area, then Cabo San Lucas is the prime example. We first visited by truck with camper, in 1973, when the road was not fully paved and the population was around 1500 honest friendly people, who wanted you to be there. Now the population is 50,000 or more, and the attitude is fly in, give us your money and go home.
 
All of the sad news about the Keys isn't surprising, but it is certainly unwelcome as we set our sights on a winter trip there. I have a question or two after I reminisce for a moment, so bear with me.

I spent two winters bumming/diving in the Keys after I graduated from college in 1970. I would work buried cable construction until the season ended to save enough for the trips. The first year I went with $750 dollars, and came home with over $200. My expenditures included $125 for a new Nikonos that I bought from Carl Gage. I think gas at that time was typically about 40 cents, but gas in Florida was 25 cents as the result of a long-term, widespread gas war. My favorite place to eat was the Pilot House on a working dock in Key Largo. A hamburger steak dinner was $1.25. On Wednesday nights it was all of the grouper and hush puppies you could eat for $2.00. After I stayed the allowed two weeks in Pennekamp. I camped each night for free in a development complete with canals that was empty because no one was buying the lots. I guess it has changed a little. When we took our kids early in the 80s, the Pilot House was still there, but it was an upscale restaurant.

Questions: Does anyone have information on parking for the truck and trailer -- especially in the Key Largo area? Any info on inexpensive docking/mooring -- or suggestions on anchorages? I am checking the Active Captain site. We are planning a trip that is high on relaxation but low on expenses. I appreciate any info and suggestions. And who knows. some of the places Brats have enjoyed in the past might still be there in February.

Greg
 
Greg,

The Pilot House is still there, but considerably more expensive. There is a wholesale/retail fish place next door that has pretty good prices. A couple years ago we got a pound of shrimp (18 shrimp!) for about $7.

One reason I headed down to the Keys was to scout out the very info that you are looking for because I am planning on trailering Valkyrie down abut the middle of March to stay for a month or so. Marcia will fly down for a few weeks and then a buddy will come down to fish.

Dockage is very pricey. One alternative, if you are going to stay in basically one area is the mooring field in Boot Key Harbor run by the city of Marathon. I stayed in Boot Key Harbor on my sailboat during the winter of '88-89 when it was only an anchorage - back in the unregulated "free" days.

Anyhow here is the info from memory (I'm at our cabin deer hunting and the literature is at home) - a mooring for a month is $170 and this tier includes a parking space. Dingy dockage is $70 a month and showers add a bit, too. I found a place to store a trailer and one for a 22 foot boat is $110 a month, or any part of a month!

Much more expensive than anchoring, but much less than dockage that can go for $4 a foot. Oh yeah, the mooring field is first come/ first serve only. There is a small anchorage area at Boot Key Harbor, as well. The dockmaster told me that they will start enforcing a no-anchor ordinance in the shallow, grassy areas now used by some for anchoring.

Hope this helps,

Nick
"Valkyrie"
 
Hi Greg,

Well, like gas prices and that hamburger steak you used to buy for a buck twenty-five back in 1970, everything has gone up. We can lament about how cheap it all used to be, but the Keys are still a good place to go. Anchoring out will keep your costs down (we didn't come across any marinas that I would call inexpensive), and there are still great things to see and experience. It's a sure bet that the weather will be better than Iowa. ;)

Pick up a cruising guide or two (my favorite was "Managing the Waterway, Florida Keys"); they will show you anchorages and on-shore amenities. You'll be more comfortable than "the good ol' days" when you camped down there, and since you already know that everything is going to be pricier, you shouldn't suffer from sticker shock. Have fun and post some photos to keep the guys in the frozen northland going.

Best wishes,
Jim B.
 
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