Would the 22 benefit from more weight?

P

Paddy111

New member
Would the 22 benefit from more weight?

The reason for my question is that I am a Boston Whaler owner and my 21ft Ventura is 3300 lbs without an engine. In as much as my Whaler is expensive to operate, it feels very safe. So as I consider choosing a 22 CD (for many good reasons) I want to ask, do you feel the 22 CD would be a better boat with more weight? Incidentally, I notice the 23' CD Venture is nearly 1000 lbs heavier! I wonder whether CD feels the same way? Comments? Paddy
 
Paddy, my opinion is that the 22 does not need additional weight. It might help a bit when slogging into a short chop, but I don't think there would be much benefit beyond that. Others may disagree. When I am offshore, here in Oregon, the boat just allows swells to slide right under. There is no tendency to trip because there is nothing under the boat (keel or deep deadrise) for seas to catch. So far, I have been quite impressed with the ability of this boat. Probably the most nervous I have ever been is up in BC, in Johnstone Strait and Knight Inlet. We were caught in some current and chop that had me uncomfortable. We holed up in a small bay for the night to ride things out. My belief is that the boat was fine, and that the problem was in my confidence.

Regards,

Steve
 
Paddy,

Everything is a trade off as you probably well know. More weight means more fuel, a bigger trailer, a larger tow vehicle, larger outboards, and the list goes on and on. Pretty soon you have something that is not a CD 22 rather quickly. It is called a Sea Sport......

As far as its capabilites, most of the guys that chip in on this forum are from the Puget Sound and the CD 22 works really well there. I on the other hand, take mine out into the open Gulf of Alaska. There is no protection and often times protection is hours away when one is out by Johnstone Bay where I often go to chase halibut. You had better have a lot of confidence in your boating skills (my judgement has always been questionable as I was a ranger in the 82 ABN Division at FT Bragg) and have a capable boat. In my opinion, the CD22 is extremely capable and normally when I am out in the Gulf my boat is the smallest one around.

As Steve said, one of the things that is nice about the CD 22 is it just rises right up with the seas (to include following on the stern) as they build. It is a nice feature. I have even had small breaking seas (typical whitecaps) from the stern and they too were of no issue.

I truthfully don't think that more weight is necessarily better in many, many ways. Perhaps in a strong breaking beam sea it could be, but you are not going to see my butt in a heavy sea without the bow pointed into if I can help it. And whether by design or not, even when the boat loses power, the front of the boat swings around and points itself perpendicular to the swell line which is pretty cool.

Just a question, why do you think the CD 22 might possibly need more weight?

Tim
 
I think that a little extra weight in the bow can help cutting into smaller wind chop, but otherwise the boat is better left as light as it can be with the necessary equipment and supplies on board. Trim tabs are a better solution than weight in the bow, however, for dealing with chop (and a lot of other issues) in most situations.

What has been described before, is that the very light C-Dory rides up and over rough seas like a cork, and is therefore pretty much invulnerable to all but a breaking wave that overwhelms it.

And as Tim so well states, the boat performs better when it's lighter, and is a lot moe economical in that condition as well. I agree.

Joe. :teeth :thup
 
Having owned many a Boston Whaler, 13 ,15, 17 & 22 I know how it feels to move from the "unsinkability" to the C-Dory...which doesn't boast about it...but it will float too...nose high, is a little unnerving.

But rest assured you will get over the will it float part soon after you find you go further and stay longer in the C-Dory and do it cheaper then you ever have before.

Trim tabs are a must in my openion, unless you have movable balast that doesn't talk back.

If you decide to add weight to your C-Dory, I would suggest you add it in foam...then you will have the best of both worlds.

Happy Boating.
 
Tim, the reason for my post was to compare the lighter design of the CD to the heavy feel and Deep V of a Boston Whaler. I feel everybody has answered my questions pretty well. And I certainly have no intention of being out in breaking seas but I take the point about the seaworthiness.
 
Dories were designed to be more stable when they were loaded (Dories were designed primarly as fishing boats rowed from Banks Schooners). The Semi dory has some characteristics, with a relitatively narrow beam waterline. This also gains some stability as you load the boat. But just fuel, water, gear and people are adequate to give this loading, and stability.

The bigger 25 is also heavier, but it has a wider beam as well as being longer. In my opinion it rides slightly better in a chop. All of the boats are very sea worthy. I have rescured a capsized Boston Whaler--never a C Dory!
 
Hello,
The Venture 23's have a composite foam core as opposed to end cut balsa. Thats part of the weight difference along with a little more beam and a some what of a modified v hull. They will break a light chop a little better according to dealers that sell both. The rear section of the hull is pretty much flat.The Venture and the Cape Cruisers got a number changes that were made almost as an evolution to the 22' Cruiser. If you look at the rear of the cabin were it meets the gunnels the 23's have a 45 degree gussets to prevent cracking which is seen in some of the 22's. as they come down and meet the gunnels at a 90 degree angle. Later insulation and other standard features, such as window coverings, tilt wheel, interior grab rails, forward facing seats, shore power, built in battery charger were made standard. Some feel all the creature comforts made the Venture series a little too much Bayliner like. Hard to install add on's with the insulation, interior coverings. These items also added more weight. A 23' Venture is rated for up to 150 hp. Since the 150 only weighed another sixty pounds over the 115 that was my choice. So far good solid boat, no sweating on inside which can occur with just a layer of fiberglass. I'm not sure the Venture series will ever be accepted by the old guard. It certainly had a enough positive points to sell me. I worried about water intrusion and rot with the balsa core.
The 22's are the most popular of the entire line. They are light (1925) and simplist and cheapest to run and easier to tow for these same reasons. There are some Venture series boats still around along with new 22' cruisers I would think, if you decided to go that way. Good luck in your search.
D.D.
 
Sea Wolf":3w0j5cpd said:
pretty much invulnerable to all but a breaking wave that overwhelms it.

Joe.
Click to expand...

Please elaborate.

Thanks,

Paul Priest
J.C.Lately
Sequim
 
ppriest":3qjwgnrg said:
Sea Wolf":3qjwgnrg said:
pretty much invulnerable to all but a breaking wave that overwhelms it.

Joe.
Click to expand...

Please elaborate.

Thanks,

Paul Priest
J.C.Lately
Sequim
Click to expand...

Paul-

Of course, generalizations always get one in trouble (just like this one will!).

But what I meant by that remark, is that the very light C-Dorys float like a cork, due to their very light relative weight, and rise up on waves and swells, whether in stationary or powered mode, and thus ride over the danger presented in the wave energy and water weight of heavy seas, and therefore about the only way a wave can get one of these boats in trouble is to break over on itself and dump down into the boat, which, at that point, has no chance of escaping the danger from above, at least with an open cockpit.

Now of course, we really do know that any boat can get rolled in the surf, for instance, and we definitely know that anchoring just any boat, except something like a double ender, for instance, by the stern, can allow waves and swells to enter the cockpit, as can backing down hard with just the motor alone in a dangerous sea with a pretty low or open transom.

So there you have it, several generalizations, none of them absolutely without exception, but hopefully containing the general truth about the subject they address in hopes of communicating useful information to the recipients.

Hope this helpful!

Joe :teeth :thup
 
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