Wallace vs. Stock
- Thread starter aquaman
- Start date
Island Ranger
New member
The Wallas doubles as a cabin heater, with exhaust that goes outside - not in the cabin. I have one, and ordered one in our new Ranger 25 as well. For those of us that need a cabin heater, it is a great option
Mac
Mac
Well, it really depends on how and where you will use the boat. The stock stove is an alcohol unit. We've had these on other boats, and they work fine. Alcohol seems to be a little slower heating, but it is a relatively safe fuel in a boat. Unless you put an inverted flower pot on it, it's not a heater (a BIG difference if you intend to boat where it can be cold). There is some humidity put into the air with the combustion of the alcohol, as well as oxygen being used in the burning process. The Wallas, on the other hand, is diesel; vented to the outside. It can be used as a heater by simply putting the lid down - the main reason most boat folks are willing to pay extra for the Wallas. Of course, you could always add some other sort of heater to your boat... but if it's not vented to the outside, you won't be able to use it while you sleep, or for prolonged periods without a window open.
Whether it's worth the extra money is something you will have to decide. For us, it was. I don't like being cold on a boat (or anywhere for that matter). When we're plugged into shore power, we use an electric heater. But at anchor or while running, the Wallas is a real champ for staying comfortable when it's chilly.
For quick cooking, we often use a portable butane single burner stove (especially if it's hot outside). Flexibility is nice.
While some folks have had issues with their Wallas, most of the time they are a dependable quality product. It's a desireable add-on in a used boat (that you may not see benefit from until you're ready to sell). If I only boated where it is always warm, I would have to think long and hard about the Wallas... even where we are cruising in the Keys, recently we have had the need for the heater.
Good luck with your decision.
Best wishes,
Jim B.
Whether it's worth the extra money is something you will have to decide. For us, it was. I don't like being cold on a boat (or anywhere for that matter). When we're plugged into shore power, we use an electric heater. But at anchor or while running, the Wallas is a real champ for staying comfortable when it's chilly.
For quick cooking, we often use a portable butane single burner stove (especially if it's hot outside). Flexibility is nice.
While some folks have had issues with their Wallas, most of the time they are a dependable quality product. It's a desireable add-on in a used boat (that you may not see benefit from until you're ready to sell). If I only boated where it is always warm, I would have to think long and hard about the Wallas... even where we are cruising in the Keys, recently we have had the need for the heater.
Good luck with your decision.
Best wishes,
Jim B.
Yes, I must agree....it really is worth the fortune that they ask for it...
I originally had the alcohol stove that the dealer ordered in the boat...but hated it, so I installed a complete propane system...and that works super...but it is just a stove...no heat... and that heater sure would be nice on a cool day..
Joel
SEA3PO
I originally had the alcohol stove that the dealer ordered in the boat...but hated it, so I installed a complete propane system...and that works super...but it is just a stove...no heat... and that heater sure would be nice on a cool day..
Joel
SEA3PO
The Oringo is a non pressurized alcohol stove. There are two burners which are of equal intensity. Stove grade alcohol is a little harder to find than diesel/K1 for the Wallas stove. The older pressurized alcohol stoves used to be subject to fires which were difficult to control (since alcohol is lighter than water, will float and spread) The non pressurized stoves are much less likely to have this problem--but they do produce carbon monoxide and utalize oxygen inside of the cabin--plus there is a odor to the burning alcohol., The Oringo cannot be safely used as a cabin heater.
The Wallas stoves are enclosed, have blower assisted external exhaust. They are a bit more difficult to control (the alcohol responds quickly--the Wallas diesel/K1 is slower to heat up, and to cool down. One burner is hotter than the other, and they are interdependant. However the Wallas is also an excellent heater, does not produce CO into the cabin.
Is the Wallas worth the extra money? We think so, but we do cruise in places where we need a heater when anchored out. Marie prefers to cook on the Wallas than on the alcohol stove.
The Wallas stoves are enclosed, have blower assisted external exhaust. They are a bit more difficult to control (the alcohol responds quickly--the Wallas diesel/K1 is slower to heat up, and to cool down. One burner is hotter than the other, and they are interdependant. However the Wallas is also an excellent heater, does not produce CO into the cabin.
Is the Wallas worth the extra money? We think so, but we do cruise in places where we need a heater when anchored out. Marie prefers to cook on the Wallas than on the alcohol stove.
journey on
New member
OK, If you're from Lodi one assumes you're going to boat in San Francisco Bay. In the summer there, you'll need the Wallas. In the winter, you'll need it around Lodi.
Every time we took a boat north from So Cal we needed a heater. When Judy saw the option, there was no argument. We got it (@$2300.) It came in handy in the San Juans, and it's been used in San Diego.
Now for the other side. It's slow to heat, so we also have the aforementioned butane stove. Butane gets the first cup of coffee in the morn. The Wallas is reputed to be cranky, but we haven't had any trouble. It also easily overheats the boat and it's noisy, but some people use a thermally driven fan. The built in fan only blows the heat across the cabin, and if you're in the v-berth you don't get much heat. We use another electric fan.
Whatever you do don't get the alcohol stove. They don't work very well, at least in our experience. Dora Jean uses theirs for cooking, but then Steve added a Wallas heater.
The Southern Boris
Every time we took a boat north from So Cal we needed a heater. When Judy saw the option, there was no argument. We got it (@$2300.) It came in handy in the San Juans, and it's been used in San Diego.
Now for the other side. It's slow to heat, so we also have the aforementioned butane stove. Butane gets the first cup of coffee in the morn. The Wallas is reputed to be cranky, but we haven't had any trouble. It also easily overheats the boat and it's noisy, but some people use a thermally driven fan. The built in fan only blows the heat across the cabin, and if you're in the v-berth you don't get much heat. We use another electric fan.
Whatever you do don't get the alcohol stove. They don't work very well, at least in our experience. Dora Jean uses theirs for cooking, but then Steve added a Wallas heater.
The Southern Boris
There's nothing as quick or easy to use as propane, but a lot of folks are afraid of it.
I have a Force 10 Cozy Cabin propane heater for cabin heating ( when away from shore power), and a 3 burner Gaffers and Sattler propane cooking stove.
(Switch panel on left controls carbon dioxide and propane detectors as well as blower motors for cabin heater.)
The Cozy Cabin is easy to use and puts out plenty of heat on half power or less (3000 of 6000 max btu's).
Cooking on the other stove is just like home with three 6000 btu burners that start and stop instantly and adjust from barely lit to wide open.
With this type of set up, you'll need a carbon monoxide detector and a propane detector. You'll also need to install a propane tank properly and propane lines.
The cabin heater will cost about $400, the cookstove $250, the two detectors about another $160, and the tank and lines, etc., another $200, or about $1000 total.
A good ceramic electric heater is the most bang for the buck that you can spend on cabin heating when on shore power.
On my other (non-C-Dory) boat, I have a combination 120 vac electric/pressurized alcohol two burner stove. It's OK, but the electric burners are slow, just like they would be at home, and the alcohol is not as hot as propane and has to be pumped to pressureize, and refilled occasionally.
We've recently bought a portable Coleman propane powered stove that runs on disposable 1 lb cylinders to be able to cook out in the cockpit to help keep the odors out of the second boat. It has two burners, and one of them has a grille that can be used to grill steaks, etc., and that grill can be replaced with an optional griddle for pancakes, etc. It's called the Coleman 2 Burner Grille Stove, and has been changed a bit from last year.
2007 and 2006 models
I have a Force 10 Cozy Cabin propane heater for cabin heating ( when away from shore power), and a 3 burner Gaffers and Sattler propane cooking stove.
(Switch panel on left controls carbon dioxide and propane detectors as well as blower motors for cabin heater.)
The Cozy Cabin is easy to use and puts out plenty of heat on half power or less (3000 of 6000 max btu's).
Cooking on the other stove is just like home with three 6000 btu burners that start and stop instantly and adjust from barely lit to wide open.
With this type of set up, you'll need a carbon monoxide detector and a propane detector. You'll also need to install a propane tank properly and propane lines.
The cabin heater will cost about $400, the cookstove $250, the two detectors about another $160, and the tank and lines, etc., another $200, or about $1000 total.
A good ceramic electric heater is the most bang for the buck that you can spend on cabin heating when on shore power.
On my other (non-C-Dory) boat, I have a combination 120 vac electric/pressurized alcohol two burner stove. It's OK, but the electric burners are slow, just like they would be at home, and the alcohol is not as hot as propane and has to be pumped to pressureize, and refilled occasionally.
We've recently bought a portable Coleman propane powered stove that runs on disposable 1 lb cylinders to be able to cook out in the cockpit to help keep the odors out of the second boat. It has two burners, and one of them has a grille that can be used to grill steaks, etc., and that grill can be replaced with an optional griddle for pancakes, etc. It's called the Coleman 2 Burner Grille Stove, and has been changed a bit from last year.
2007 and 2006 modelsSince Boris (Journey On) opened the door, I'll add that we just don't 'accept our Alcohol Stove (stock), we love it and would order it specifically if I didn't like what was offered. I've used this same Origo model since 1988 on 3 boats including my CD-25. On the two previous models, there was no flame spreader plate or the one installed was too small, so I fabricated a larger [copper] plate about 3" dia. That allows the intense flame to heat a skillet more evenly. The current Origo has a similar flame spreader, but it is slightly too small in my opinion, I will fab a larger one someday, but is usable as is.
I've cooked every kind of meal imaginable, I believe the flame spreader is one of the keys to the effectiveness of this stove. I like the instant heat, no hassle, always works, low danger features. Heats my morning coffee/tea quite fast, then it's ready for bacon, eggs, hashbrowns and even toast or toasted bagels (3 at a time). I even have a stovetop, double burner belgian waffle maker that works fine, but does take awhile to get it up to temperature for proper waffles (~10 min).
I know, I know, I'm probably in the minority, but that's my 2c...
I've cooked every kind of meal imaginable, I believe the flame spreader is one of the keys to the effectiveness of this stove. I like the instant heat, no hassle, always works, low danger features. Heats my morning coffee/tea quite fast, then it's ready for bacon, eggs, hashbrowns and even toast or toasted bagels (3 at a time). I even have a stovetop, double burner belgian waffle maker that works fine, but does take awhile to get it up to temperature for proper waffles (~10 min).
I know, I know, I'm probably in the minority, but that's my 2c...
BobArrington
New member
The alcohol stove is not the stock factory stove anymore, they have switched to a butane cartridge model that works much better then the alcohol for cooking but not as well as the Wallace for heating.
For heat, if your planning on putting an inverter in your boat anyway, Caframo makes a very nice low amperage draw cabin heater that will work great while underway or plugged in to shore power.
As others have mentioned, it depends on how you will use the boat and what comprimises you are willing to accept - everything on a boat is a comprimise.
Wishing you safe and warm voyages on you new boat!
For heat, if your planning on putting an inverter in your boat anyway, Caframo makes a very nice low amperage draw cabin heater that will work great while underway or plugged in to shore power.
As others have mentioned, it depends on how you will use the boat and what comprimises you are willing to accept - everything on a boat is a comprimise.
Wishing you safe and warm voyages on you new boat!
Pat Anderson
New member
OK, we picked this up in December at REI, about $79 - it is the Coleman "Fold 'n Go" propane two burner stove. It is about 14" tall, 11" wide and 4" thick when folded - it stores in the same amount of space as the one burner butane stove. Advantages are two burners (duh), and it uses the one lb propane bottles which are quite a lot less expensive to use than the butane cannisters. Have not used it yet, but it ought to be just the cat's meow for morning coffee in the cockpit, and more!
squidslayer
New member
The New Butane works great !!!! It got The Whole TOMCAT Toasty Quick
Heats water fast...is super hot...self lighting.....you can pick uo a 4 pack of Butane canisters in chinatown for $2.89 !!!
Save the $2300.00 buy some good electronics
My Tomcat comes with a carbonMonx detector for safety
If its really cold the windows might steam...unless you crack a window
Go Stock
Dick E
"Shirley Mae"
255 Tomcat
Heats water fast...is super hot...self lighting.....you can pick uo a 4 pack of Butane canisters in chinatown for $2.89 !!!
Save the $2300.00 buy some good electronics
My Tomcat comes with a carbonMonx detector for safety
If its really cold the windows might steam...unless you crack a window
Go Stock
Dick E
"Shirley Mae"
255 Tomcat
Pat Anderson
New member
Dave - it certainly is slick looking, hope to break it in soon. It is amazingly small for a two burner stove, and we are really looking forward to getting a chance to use it...
oldgrowth":13lvw7mv said:Pat – thanks for the heads up on the folding Coleman stove. It looks like just the ticket for us. The one burner stove was good but could only heat/cook one thing at a time. I also like the idea of using the same bottle that I use for my heater.
________
Dave
Rob & Karen
New member
squidslayer":2te278nz said:
Dick E,
Did you just start up the stove with nothing on it? Is it designed to work as a heater? Thanks for any information.
Rob
I have to give warning about both using open flame propane to heat an enclosed cabin and using cartridge type of propane/butane stoves in an enclosed cabin. Most carbon monoxide detectors do not give adequate protection from cummulative carbon monoxide poisoning.
Although rare, there have been istances of propane cartridges leaking--both at the seals when sitting and when put into the stove. A fire or explosion in the cabin of a C Dory could ruin the rest of your life. I will not own a boat with a cartridge propane/butane stove in the cabin. I have owned a number of boats with built in propane stoves--along with good CO detectors, (never used a propane stove for heating) and a propane sniffer in the bilge. I have used propane barbeques and keep the cartridges outside of the cabin.
The C Dory web site still lists the Oringo stove--but the switch to the cartridge may be economic--it costs only a fraction of the Oringo. My personal opinion is that this is a step backward and I am really disturbed to see that happen.[/i]
Although rare, there have been istances of propane cartridges leaking--both at the seals when sitting and when put into the stove. A fire or explosion in the cabin of a C Dory could ruin the rest of your life. I will not own a boat with a cartridge propane/butane stove in the cabin. I have owned a number of boats with built in propane stoves--along with good CO detectors, (never used a propane stove for heating) and a propane sniffer in the bilge. I have used propane barbeques and keep the cartridges outside of the cabin.
The C Dory web site still lists the Oringo stove--but the switch to the cartridge may be economic--it costs only a fraction of the Oringo. My personal opinion is that this is a step backward and I am really disturbed to see that happen.[/i]
Marty-
To answer your question about the propane system costs....
Yes the $1000 is for components only. Installation could be another five or more hours at the going rate, say $85 an hour around here.
If I wasn't going to put in the system myself, I'd get a very FIRM estimate from an installer before I bought any parts. Buying the components through the dealer who installs them might result in a lower labor bill, but then....?
Actually, an RV dealer could install the stove and heater as long as they used marine components where required, such as the detectors and shut off solenoids.
There's usually a very good article on propane systems in boats in the current year's West Marine Catalogue.
Joe.
To answer your question about the propane system costs....
Yes the $1000 is for components only. Installation could be another five or more hours at the going rate, say $85 an hour around here.
If I wasn't going to put in the system myself, I'd get a very FIRM estimate from an installer before I bought any parts. Buying the components through the dealer who installs them might result in a lower labor bill, but then....?
Actually, an RV dealer could install the stove and heater as long as they used marine components where required, such as the detectors and shut off solenoids.
There's usually a very good article on propane systems in boats in the current year's West Marine Catalogue.
Joe.
squidslayer
New member
Well I didn't have anything on the Butane...but if you put a teapot...sucured by the stove pot holder safety bracket it would probably be best for safety..and hot tea!! And heat!! It REALLY kicks out the BTU's!!!
No ..it was not designed as a heater...but it sure made things toasty!!!for 0$$$
$2300.00 for the wallas is a waste....and WAY over priced.....just think of what you could by with $2300!!! roof your house...a kicker...electronics.. when you got a good butane stove for free!!
you can get a propane heater for $100
And 4 Butane Canisters for $2.89!!!!! Safe reliable heat...can't beat it for free!!
Go to my photo's "Shirley Mae" in the electonics folder to see a pix of the Butane
Dick
No ..it was not designed as a heater...but it sure made things toasty!!!for 0$$$
$2300.00 for the wallas is a waste....and WAY over priced.....just think of what you could by with $2300!!! roof your house...a kicker...electronics.. when you got a good butane stove for free!!
you can get a propane heater for $100
And 4 Butane Canisters for $2.89!!!!! Safe reliable heat...can't beat it for free!!
Go to my photo's "Shirley Mae" in the electonics folder to see a pix of the Butane
Dick
This probably says more about me than my Walles but it is my favorite feature on the boat. Living in the Northwest it is a rare outting that I don't have it on. I will even fire it up if I am just working on the boat.
I am migrating to a Ranger Tug and I have one order for it.
Safety is huge when it comes to fire. The Walles is as safe as heat can get.
The only problem I have ever had is a bad thermo coupler and that was an easy and quick fix with great support from Scan.
I am migrating to a Ranger Tug and I have one order for it.
Safety is huge when it comes to fire. The Walles is as safe as heat can get.
The only problem I have ever had is a bad thermo coupler and that was an easy and quick fix with great support from Scan.
squidslayer
New member
Seems
unreasionable ... like some people are posting... that C-Dory would install a Butane stove ...inside their boats....for cooking...in an inclosed cabin...and it would be unsafe!!!!!ANYTHING burning inside is unsafe if you don't use a little COMMON SENSE!..like cracking a window......
Don't get me wrong Wallas stoves are great...but not nessessary...
Unless you do ice fishing...or are in ALaska...you do not need a $2300 heater!!! Kerosene took down the World Trade Center! and can be just as dangerous as Butane...the Butane Canisters are small.. unlike propane... so even if they leaked are not as great of a hazard like burning up your boat up as with Wallas Kerosene...also Kerosene Stinks!!
Dick
unreasionable ... like some people are posting... that C-Dory would install a Butane stove ...inside their boats....for cooking...in an inclosed cabin...and it would be unsafe!!!!!ANYTHING burning inside is unsafe if you don't use a little COMMON SENSE!..like cracking a window......
Don't get me wrong Wallas stoves are great...but not nessessary...
Unless you do ice fishing...or are in ALaska...you do not need a $2300 heater!!! Kerosene took down the World Trade Center! and can be just as dangerous as Butane...the Butane Canisters are small.. unlike propane... so even if they leaked are not as great of a hazard like burning up your boat up as with Wallas Kerosene...also Kerosene Stinks!!
Dick