Value of Autopilot

If I was going to get another auto pilot it would be the Garmin/tr-1. TR-1 sold to Garmin last year. The Raymarine I have is great for what it is but it has its short fails for fishing and is behind the curve in technology. It does not track well if going to way points. You can only get within a certain distance from the way point before it decided it has arrived, within a few 100 feet or more. That’s great for sailing and cruising long distance in open waters, which is what it was meant to do, but sucks ( tech term) for fishing or close courters cruising.

I have had two way points set near a rock or point and the Raymarine would want to go to the next way point before getting all the way to the first way point. Well cutting that corner meant going over the rock or the point, not good. The Garmin on the other hand will not "arrive" at a way point until you are on top of it. It will also hold a course with in 2 degrees from a bearing line between two ways points. The Raymarine will drift a hundred feet or more from that line on either side. You end up with a back and forth crossing of your bearing line that drives me nuts. This is why most people just use the heading function which works a lot better.

Where the Raymarine has fallen behind in the tech wars is the over ride function. If you are on auto pilot and a log appears before you, you can grab the wheel and spin it hard to port, or starboard, and over ride the auto pilot for a few seconds. All fine and dandy but the auto pilot will reengage bring you back to you heading, which is what it was designed to do. But if you are in a large debris field you have to do this several times or disengage the auto pilot. With the shadow drive system of the Garmin all you have to do is grab the wheel and turn to a new course and let go. The auto pilot will reengage on the NEW COUSRE without you having to hit any buttons. It will do this all day only without you ever having to touch a on or off button. Don’t like your heading? Just grab the wheel turn 30 degrees to the north and let go , bam you’re on a new auto pilot course.

Whit the new shadow drive and the tighter course settings Garmin is a better unit for my uses. Added to that is the ability to troll BACKWARDS. This is great for bottom fish and river fishing Will I go out and replace my raymarine unit? NO but the next boat will be a Garmin.
 
A couple key words in several of these posts--and that is a speed of 15 knots. Some state that they will not use the pilot at higher speeds.
Second, one of the problems I found, especially in the PNW was now fast debris sneeks up on you--even at 6 knots--even faster at 17 knots--and I wonder how fast the reflexes are to recognize the danger, disengage the auto pilot and then take evasive actions with the wheel. Note that we used an electronic dodger with the auto pilot--dodger in hand all of the time by the person who is primary watch keeper--pushing the button on the dodger immediately turns the helm.

For me, driving the boat at planing speeds--is like driving the car--it is reflexes. It is not watching a compass needle (exception might be in limited visability conditions--such as thick fog--but in that case, one person on the radar, and the other on the helm--eyes on the water immediately in front of the boat--at limit of visability--and slow speed. In our boats, the chart plotter, is at the lower limit of our peripheral vision, so that it is in the line of sight as looking at the water. If an area if complicated navigation, the boat should be slowed down--same for limited visability.

The other thing I have observed through the years, is how often once the boat is on auto pilot, the crew no longer pays as much attention to the surroundings. Maybe the C Brats are different. But I have had a number of close calls---almost being run down by boats on auto pilot when the crew just didn't seem to be paying attention.

There are great places for auto pilots--but be cautious--and use the tool wisely.
 
It's been raining all day, and I have nothing to do except give forth my opinion. Which is the most fun thing. Beats pulling weeds, catching gophers, filling holes, etc.

Anyway, as has been mentioned above, all our instruments are tools and one has to learn how to use them. Then Jay mentioned coming south through Dixon Entrance, above Prince Rupert. When we came south from Alaska, we headed down Dixon Entrance, which is a deep ocean entrance, in the sailboat. We were relaxed as clams, since this was open water. I noticed that the depth sounder started reading ~100 ft, and pointed out to Judy that she'd better watch where she was going (her watch.) Next the sounder gave 50', as we're passing a sea bouy. It finally got down to 8', with a 6' keel and we turned around. Then the sounder indicated a depth of 3' and we just kept on going. Checking the chart, we should have a depth of ~200'. Finally came to the conclusion that there were water layers of different temperature, and the sounder had picked up one that came meandering to the surface. Scared the s__t out of us. So every piece of equipment we have has to be used with judgment. You're the one with the intelligence on board.

Also, when we were in the Broughtons this summer, I noticed several LARGE boats which must of been on autopilot, cause they would have ploughed right into us if we hadn't gotten out of their way. And we had the right of way. Which shows how much the right of way is worth. And substantiates Bobs comments on people who set and forget their autopilots.

Boris
 
I recently bought a S1000 from Fisheries for my 22 and it was ~$950 with the new boat discount. I don't think it was a particularly great deal, though.

I had a TR-1 Gold on the kicker of my Hewescraft, and it is a nice piece of gear, as Tom says. However, it is made for kickers, for trolling. Their main motor autopilot is the TR-1 Gladiator, which would be the equivalent of the Raymarine S1000 and a quick Google check tells me it costs about $2150. The Gold costs about the same. So both are twice as expensive as the S1000.

Warren
 
thataway":2rsi7gw5 said:
There are great places for auto pilots--but be cautious--and use the tool wisely.
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As always, Bob gives sage advice! When I'm on auto-pilot, my right hand is still on the throttles and my eyes are watching for flotsam and other vessels. If others are on board with me, I can seat them at the helm if I need to get up to do anything and I know they are kept on course with the auto pilot. They are also instructed as to how to disable the AP in order to alter course with the steering wheel and slow the vessel down with the throttles if needed due to flotsam etc. (Additionally, being on a 22', I'm not so far away that I can't periodically check on them).
 
About autopilots and knowing your boats position in relation to bottom hazards. I Have found the bottom quite a few times in the process of exploring inlet heads, rivers and during over enthusiastic wildlife viewing, but not yet while underway on a preplanned route. Spend considerable time the winter before an extended cruise making up routes leading to all the places we would like to go and to the entrances and anchorages of possible safe harbors if needed along the way. Always when I think the route is good make a final check in close up detail to check for places the route may cross a hazard, bottom or otherwise. Many times I've found this to be the case and made corrections on routes that I thought secure. When under way following these routes whether on autopilot or hand steering I keep one gps chart in close up detail and the other as an overview with both using projected course showing where the boat will be at a set time in the future at what ever speed being made. Diligently checking the charts or maybe not so diligently and realizing it has kept us from more contact with the bottom than I like to admit. I personally find that with talking, viewing wildlife or just the enjoyment of the moment that keeping on a desired course and knowing your position on that course to be much safer with the autopilot then without. Several times before we installed and started using the auto pilot in these kind of situations we found ourselves off course and headed for trouble fortunately chart checking and visual observation even if not on a conscious level caused us to get back on track in time to avert seriously bad situations.

Concerning other boats we meet in right of way situations, I treat them all like their underway guided by autopilot with no one in the pilot house let alone at the helm.


Jay
 
Hello All,

I have been lurking for a while and am now having electronics installed on a 2009 Tomcat in Juneau. I wanted an autopilot for trolling as well as for when single handling and putting the fenders out in the wind. Nice to stay on course.
 
dbrena":dhdi8i6u said:
Hello All,

I have been lurking for a while and am now having electronics installed on a 2009 Tomcat in Juneau. I wanted an autopilot for trolling as well as for when single handling and putting the fenders out in the wind. Nice to stay on course.
Click to expand...

Whoa...I noticed post number 1 for a new owner of a Tomcat. Welcome aboard! Post your pics when you can...send a PM to DaNag to set you up with a photo album.
 
Boris,
Welcome to the world to thermoclines--there are several other conditions which can cause artifacts--and lead to frightening incidents. There can also be an artifact with the layering of salt and fresh water, as we often see in our bays in Florida. The Thermoclines can also occur in deeper water, even offshore. Changing the settings on the depth sounder may help show the problem, and I do prefer a fish finder, which may show these better than a digital sounder.

When we were entering Deleware bay from Cape May, with a boat with 7 foot draft. The chart showed 15 to 20 feet, and it was going to save us about 5 miles (at 6 knots). As we came into the area where the currents of the bay met the ocean, the depth sounder began to read shallower--and then no reading! We hung on, and believed the chart. Just the turbulance under the surface was enough to loose the bottom.
 
Perusing another site I came across a post that says that the Raymarine S1000 was actually retired in 2008. There are still some around in retail inventory and it is likely Raymarine will continue to provide service for a while. But who knows for how long.
The guy who posted says this was straight from a Raymarine tech, but not stated on their site yet.

Raymarine’s new low end entry is apparently the SPX-5 which is a mechanical system that attaches over the steering column and turns the wheel (much like their old Sport Pilot), and currently under recall for early sales. It works with both mechanical and hydraulic systems (I have read mixed reviews).

I’m just posting this for anyone considering an S1000 to research this a bit further. I have an S1000, but I would be very concerned after reading this as to the longevity of support for this system.
 
Got a Furuno Navpilot 520 on my Tomcat
Best thing since sliced bread
mine is portable and can be plugged in at the front or rear helm
Real handy for running the boat. When Fishing .... trolling straight or pattern..even drifting to keep the boat straight.
...But the real help is when you are traveling in rough seas..Just watch ahead and let the autopilot fight the wheel. You go straight no sweat. Just a click one way or the other for minor adjustment to course. I also have it linked to my Furuno Navnet gps/radar/sounder. All My routes are programed and I can leave the dock..navigate the harbor ..the bay..ocean ....and NEVER touch the wheel. The navpilot turns the boat at each waypoint. Great for night trips or heavy fog or weather.
Also autopilots enhance safety. In darkness and fog or bad weather you can concentrate on the radar and gps rather than the helm. All my 5 tuna trips last year were 200miles plus....Auto pilots make long or rough trip alot nicer and less work.
If you use your boat.....its a 10
Dick
 
cemiii":1yvamjhy said:
Perusing another site I came across a post that says that the Raymarine S1000 was actually retired in 2008. There are still some around in retail inventory and it is likely Raymarine will continue to provide service for a while. But who knows for how long.
The guy who posted says this was straight from a Raymarine tech, but not stated on their site yet.
Click to expand...

FWIW I recently ordered a S1000 through Fisheries Supply and I had to wait for the factory to fill the order. The sales guy at Fisheries said he was waiting for his order to come in also. Didn't sound to me like a discontinued product because I specifically asked him if the recent financial news about Raymarine would affect the order...

Warren
 
http://www.thehulltruth.com/marine-elec ... ducts.html

Warren, I hope you are right about its (S1000) continuance. I love mine and hope it will be serviceable for a very long time. I'm posting the source. Maybe one of the dealers might comment if they have insight. I do note the poster has very limited prior posts.

I had the misfortune a while back to buy an expensive A65/DSM25 combo just a couple months before they were retired and one of the sattelites its antenna and software relied on also was retired. Though I thought I'd done my research at the time, I wish I would have had forewarning. Perhaps, why I am so cautious about this.
 
On any boating forum you have to look at the source of information. RayMarine still lists the S1000 auto pilot as a current product. There are multiple legitiment marine outlets and stores which have the product in stock (in a brief search of most of the usuals, I didn't find any out of stock).

They may not be developing it any further, but that does not mean that it is not still supported. No one really knows what will happen with RayMarine currently. But there will be technicians who will service the products for some time. I can still get some 1980's Marine Electronics products still serviced.
 
I have had Raymarine before...worked ok...but after searching forums about marine electronics like the "hull truth" and seeing how much grief Raymarine caused countless owners..I went ALL Furuno. The Coast Guard and commerical fishermens choice.
I have Furuno...UHF... NavNet Radar...sounder..gps and autopiolot....
The only part that has givin me any problem in the last three years is the Raymarine Rudder Referance Rotor used for my NavPilot auto pilot which rusted off and failed. I still give my electrons shop hell every time i see them for sneaking that peice of Cra* on my Furuno system. Also Furuno is designed in Japan..made in Japan....Raymarine is Designed in Great Brition ..made in China.......your choice! You get want you pay for!

DickE
 
My average boating weekend costs about $250: That’s 2 to 3 nights on the boat, 100 miles round trip to launch, 80 to 140 miles on the water, tunnel and parking fees. The cost benefit analysis of having an autopilot doesn’t make sense for us. :thdown
 
Well. while mentioning discontinued items. I bought a JRC 1500 chartplotter/radar/GPS combo as they were being phased out/discontinued for $1500. They still service it, and it's worked great for the last 5 years.

I also bought a Raymarine S1 autopilot and it's worked well for 5 years. It wasn't made in China, nor Great Britain, but in Romania. Every place in the world, except the USA makes stuff. If I needed an autopilot and could find a S1 on sale, I'd get it.

The point is, that just because it's discontinued doesn't mean it's bad, but can be a heck of a buy. Also, Raymarine is a reputable manufacturer, one just has to know what they're buying. Apparently, their autopilots are good; don't know about the plotters, etc. except they're more expensive than Furuno.

In addition, even Japan is shifting production to China. They don't always tell you where the parts are made. Some Japanese motorcycles are made in Taiwan and even mainland China. They still sell them as Hondas, etc.

Finally, most of our boating expenses are gasoline. At $3.00/gal it doesn't take long to add up. However it's still worth it to be on the water.

Boris
 
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