Truck for towing 22 Cruiser

T

tparrent

New member
I plan to do a bit of trailering in the next 12 months with the potential for some fairly long trips.

My current tow vehicle is a4WD crew cab long bed Nissan Frontier with a tow capacity of 6500 pounds. This is my second Frontier (the first was flooded in hurricane Sandy) and it's a great vehicle for pretty much all my needs. The only drawback that bother me is its wide turning radius. Seems like that would be an easy fix for NIssan but both of my trucks had the issue and it is often commented upon in forums.

The truck pulls the boat ok although there is some surging at less than highway speed. I've never had a real problem getting up a ramp.

That being said, I seldom towed the boat in the last five years, although I did a round trip between New York and North Carolina as well as a one way from Wisconsin to North Carolina.

I've been thinking about getting a crew cab long bed F150 for other reasons but those reasons may or may not come to pass.

My question is how much difference do you feel in pulling the boat with a perfectly adequate truck (Frontier) vs a big towing machine (F150)? If there is a big difference, it could affect the timing of my F150 purchase.

Incidentally, I get a very consistent 19 MPG in the Frontier regardless of conditions whereas the F150s are rated at 25+ MPG. That surprised me.

Thanks
 
I feel eminently qualified to answer your question because I went through exactly what you're asking. I too owned a Nissan Frontier and really enjoyed that truck. It definitely towed our CD22 adequately with no issues or problems. But I was always aware that the truck was pulling the boat. And I never wanted to test the V6 pulling up major mountain passes, only hills which it handled fine.

I had been lusting after Toyota Tundras for years depite the fact that the Frontier was paid for. I purchased a used Tundra with the 5.7L engine and wow am I happy! It tows the boat like a dream. I barely even know the boat is back there. It has plenty of pulling power and it was thoroughly tested last summer during my very long trip up Vancouver Island through lots of hills and curves. Except for the terrible gas mileage while towing (9 mpg), I actually enjoy towing the boat now and have no qualms whatsoever towing the boat anywhere. So much so that I've been storing tbe boat on the trailer this winter ready to trailer to wherever.

I hope this helps. Peter
 
Thanks. Your direct experience with the frontier is helpful.

Do you find the big truck any more of a hassle as an everyday vehicle compared to the Frontier?
 
I actually park in a very tight parking garage right in the middle of downtown Seattle so I'm driving in city traffic every day. It's definitely challenging parking in tight spots and tight garages but doable. Just a little stressful everyday for me to round the corners and around concrete poles while working my way down 3 garage levels. I believe the height of my truck is 6'2" or 6'3" and I have an inch or 2 to spare in our garage. I just try not looking up while driving. :wink

If you don't have to drive in a lot of traffic or in the middle of cities, then I would think that getting around in a bigger truck is no big deal.

Peter
 
I tow with a GMC YukonXL. It has the V8 5.2L with towing package, It is rated as the GMC 1/2 ton: Similar in specs to the mid size 1500 pickup. We average about 12 mpg towing the C Dory 25. Handles the boat well on all Western grades.

We know the boat is there, but much better towing vehicle than a Honda Pilot, which we had used occasionally in the past. (Our other Tow vehicle is a 42 foot RV with a Cummins' QSL, there we really don't know the boat is back there, since it is about 10% of the weight of the tow vehicle...)

I towed my son's C Dory 25 this last summer over the Grapevine with the Yukon XL--It did overheat the transmission (I do not have 6.0L engine and larger transmission cooler, which is the max tow package). It handled the 25 fine on the level and over lesser shorter grades.

My son bought a Tundra 1794 Edition crew cab and it is a towing beast for the C Dory 25--10,500 lbs capacity--He uses it as a daily driver--normally no problem in Orange co Calif. Traffic, parking at "costco" or at is work. He loves the truck.
 
I also towed my 22 Cruiser with a Nissan Frontier. It towed reasonably well, but as Peter mentioned, I always knew it was back there. It did surprisingly well through mountain passes, which surprised me. However, I had airbags installed to level things out while I was towing the boat. After towing with the Nissan for a few years, I bought a Toyota Tundra. It was a nice enough truck, and it towed the boat like a dream, but my main complaint with it was its small fuel tank. I'd get around 9 MPH towing, so with the Tundra's 26 gallon tank my towing range was very limited.

A couple of years ago I bought a Ford F250, and after a two seasons of towing the boat with it, I can tell you that as a tow vehicle, it is far better in every way. Even with the boat loaded heavy for a week on the water, you can hardly tell it's back there. You're just in much better control with the larger tow vehicle, and I'm convinced that it's a much safer, more comfortable towing arrangement.

The new F150's seem like a great truck, and I'm sure they'd pull a 22' C Dory like a champ. Also, the great gas mileage that they get would be nice for day-to-day operations. Good luck!
 
I have been towing with a 2010 Toyota Highlander with a 6 cyl, max tow rating of 5000 lbs, which with my 22 I was right up against my max. It towed like a charm, including over the Rockies a few times. Late last year I did purchase a 2016 Ford F150 Super Crew Cab. Only towed a few times locally and it seemed to do quite well. That' was with the higher geared rear end. Locally towing I was getting around 18-19mpg. I'll be using the truck to pull the boat to Florida next month, then out to California in April, so will get a really good idea how it does then. But from what I've seen so I expect to be pretty satisfied with it. The F150 still fits in my garage, next to the Highlander, albeit tight. I'm also pleasantly surprised with it's handling just around town. While it is a bit larger than the Highlander, it reminds me of the Ford Excursion I use to own. Colby
 
I own a Gen 2 xterra and tow my 22 with it regularly, as well as a chevy silverado 1500. The xterra is a nicer, newer truck, but the silverado is a vastly better tow vehicle. If I were to have to stop quickly on the highway I know I'd rather be in the pickup.

I tow boats with all kinds of larger pickup trucks at work, and there is no getting around the physics: larger, more powerful vehicles tow better, in general.

Since the OP mentioned turning radius as an issue, I'll say that I've enjoyed very good turning radii on GM tow rigs (I have a maxed suburban, and a maxed 2500), not quite as good on our 2500 dodge rams (2), and the widest on our ford rigs (F250 and F350). With our suburban I can make a u-turn inside the ferry. With our F350 it's an Austin Powers situation.
 
What a truck is rated to tow is the worst element of the "right truck" decision. The order of priorities to me are:

Do I have enough emergency braking power to stop the thing in a tight and life threatening situation. Will it brake if I lose the trailer brakes on a steep downhill grade or emergency braking situation.

Is the truck heavy enough to deal with severe cross winds and gusts pushing on the boat and trailer. Is the truck heavy enough that on a long cross country am I fighting the wheel when an 18 wheeler goes past me at 80 mph.

Is the engine powerful enough to get me up to speed on short on-ramps or if I need to get out of the way of a hazard.

Is the rated towing margin adequate to have a 25% unused part of the carrying capacity. If you tow more than a few token miles, and you are towing at max rated capacity, it will wear the truck out much sooner than if you are towing with significant margin.

Four wheel drive isn't an option, it is a must because of slippery ramps.

So, in summary, even for a 22 c Dory, a half ton is marginal, a three quarter ton is a better bet in every department. V8 is minimum engine size. Diesel is best.

I had to chuckle that you thought a Ford F150 is a "big truck." No, my friend, it is a very light truck, little better than the Japanese brands.

Consider a used diesel over a new gasser for similar price.

My old used 2006 Dodge Ram 2500 got 16 mpg when I had the Dory on behind. I still have the truck and it gets an honest 20 mpg empty. I paid 23000 for it used with 50 thousand miles on it, 9 years ago, and it medium books today at over 20 grand with 150 thousand miles.

Just some thoughts and worth both cents.
 
I'm of the mind, bigger isn't always better. For instance, those big 18 wheelers you see, the truck only weighs about 20,000 lbs, if that much, while the trailer can weigh upwards of 60,000 lbs loaded! They stop just fine. But with the proper distance, and trailer braking also available! That being said, of course the bigger your tow vehicle, the more dog wagging the tail, rather than the other way around. But large pickups and SUV's are not for everybody. My 2010 Toyota Highlander with it's 6 cylinder out pulled (with the CD-22 behind it) many other larger rigs pulling larger toys, that I saw on the roads. And I even passed some cars without trailers, while I was towing my CD-22 up hill in the Rockies. Really comes down to how your tow vehicle is set up, and how you drive it. I now have the 2016 Ford F150 Super Crew cab, but that was because I wanted a lower mileage vehicle, as my Highlander went over 100,000 miles on the odometer. And no doubt about it, I "feel" more secure in the truck pulling the boat. But the truck is the same weight as the Highlander, due to it's new aluminum construction. I also have an 8 cylinder now, but that 6 in the Highlander was pretty peppy too, and I had no problem pulling on to Interstates and getting up to speed. The 8 actually is getting better mileage with the boat in tow than the 6 did. And I have the boat trailer set up with electric brakes on all 4 wheels. Both the trailer and truck brakes do a good job. (Unlike an earlier Excursion I had, that just didn't seem to have the same stopping power, but I was towing a 10,000 lb boat behind it.) I say it really depends a lot on your driving style. If you are going to tow at 80mph, then you best have a tow vehicle where the "dog is wagging the tail". I think one really needs to decide on just how they are going to use their vehicle. Like a C-Dory, it can be very versatile, but there are some things it's just not going to do. My Highlander, and now my F150 do a great job for my use, but they are not going to be great for everything. (I also use my tow vehicle for a commuter around town, and while the Highlander worked much better for that, than the pickup, the pickup gives me some advantages over the Highlander. But they both do a fine job towing my CD-22!) BTW, I do agree with a lot of what Potter Water said above. I just don't prescribe to the bigger is always better. Colby
 
Take a look at the TFL truck channel on youtube. They are not perfect in their methods, but feature real towing performance and mpg testing of nearly all of the latetest truck offerings. I am not a truck person but still follow this channel to stay current on towing trends.

https://youtu.be/CaCjsMMScgM

Greg
 
The newer 1/2 ton rigs are incredible. Our '13 F150 3.5 Ecoboost 4X4 with economy gearing (3.31) is rated to pull 9,400 lbs. It makes an easy 22 mpg @ 60 mph.
It pulls much harder than our old F250 2X4 with the 460 V8 and 4.10 gears which got 14 mpg.
A new F150 with the 2.7 Ecoboost has more than enough power to pull your 22 and gets better milage than my '13 F150.
 
The one thing I don't see mentioned is the transmission. That is very important, when you get to mountain towing...and Mounting towing is not just the Rockies or Sierra--there are some fairly steep and long grades in the East. (There is an Atlas for trucks and RV's which shows the % grade, and length of the grade, plus other info, such as escape ramp info.

Not only going uphill, but also going down hill, some transmissions are better for towing than others.--and will make braking power of the engine better.

Also look at the stickers on the hitch--not what is in the magazine or internet--each truck should show the limits of that hitch--plus if a weight distribution hitch is required for the weight over XXXX--often 5,000 lbs. Not an issue for the 22, but certainly can be for the Tom Cat and 25.
 
Because I haven't seen it yet I'll mention a point that may be slightly off topic, but a BIG advantage if you use a tow vehicle with plenty of pulling power and not as much stopping or "tail wagging" power.

Equip your tow vehicle with a brake controller in these situations. I have brought wagging tails under control when using a tow vehicle near it's max capacity. If your trailer starts to wander a bit, or push your tow vehcile, applying trailer brakes while maintaining speed can get things under control pretty quickly. You will want to feel this out in a controlled/low consequences environment before you do it on the highway between a couple 18 wheelers, but it can help a lot.

I am not advocating for small tow rigs, or recommending you use a tow rig at or near its max capacity, but if you are in this position, a trailer brake controller can make it a lot more manageable. It won't help if the trailer brakes fail, obviously, so it's best to drive like you aren't relying on your brake controller, but in a pinch...
 
Back in Dec of 2015, I started a thread on the Dodge RAM EcoDiesel thinking I was interested (and I still am), in the new truck, better mileage, heavier tow capability and diesel power. I still think the concept is good.

Now there are more choices, other possibilities and more data.

The RAM EcoDiesel was implicated in possible mileage and EPA "adjustments" along possibly the same line as VW was.

There are now more of the EcoDiesel trucks out there and they have more miles and the owners have more experience with their trucks.

So now, I'm looking to see how things are now? Any changes, good bad or different? Would you do the same thing again?

The thread is here.

Harvey
SleepyC :moon

1_10_2012_from_Canon_961.highlight.jpg
 
I test drove a 2016 Dodge Ram 1500 eco diesel earlier, and it was really nice! HOWEVER, do the math on payload and GVWR. I don't remember all the numbers, but in the end, you really can't pull the weight it says, assuming you have 5-10% of the weight on the tongue. (A payload of 1100 lbs. seems to stick in my mind.) Going with a CD-22, you are looking between 400-500 lbs tongue weight, then add in two overweight passengers pushing 500, and you don't have much room left over for anything else. Start looking at weight distributing hitches, and you still have to do some math. I'm pretty sure the 2016 F150 I have now had a better payload rating. 1600 lbs I believe.

This payload, vs. tow capacity, vs. GVWR is what kills some of the tow vehicles. I forgot to mention this earlier in the thread, but it has been brought up frequently in other threads as well! Colby
 
in 2012 we replaced a 2001 f150 with a new frontier. I believe the fronty does as good, or better job of towing the boat and 4000# camp trailer than the f150 did.
When the spousal units car needed replacing she wanted a newer f150 for more comfort on road trips, who am I to argue, so we added a 2015 f150 crew cab, short bed with the 5.0 engine. Needless to say it tows our stuff effortlessly, seems to have a shorter turning radius, a much bigger fuel tank and gets about the same mpg. Last spring we took a road trip down to Yuma that would have killed me in the nissan, but in the f150 luxury liner it wasn't bad.
I still enjoy the heck out of the nissan and use it for my daily driver, it's a fun, sporty handling truck. If we had to get rid of a truck, it would be a tough call.......my recommendation, get one of each :)
 
thataway":1yubm1zw said:
Equip your tow vehicle with a brake controller
Click to expand...
And electric over hydraulic brakes?? Most of the new trucks have a built in controller--do you advocate a separate one?
Click to expand...

I do not, I only advocate having and understanding how to use a trailer brake controller, especially if traveling on grades or long highway trips. keeping your foot on the gas and a slight nudge of the brakes can steady everything when an 18 wheeler blows by you and gets your trailer swaying. That said, abruptly applying too much brake can have poor results, which is why I advocate some practice with the brakes before you use them to constrain an unruly trailer.
 
I agree with those that prefer a truck designed for towing for the best results.

If you are just towing from your house to the ramp, maybe you can cut corners, if you are towing through challenging places it would be better to be prepared for the worst.

I drive a 2500HD Duramax. The Allison transmission is always in the right gear, senses when I brake when going downhill and downshifts, and I get 19 combined mileage unloaded.

I towed my 27 foot Uniflite from SoCal to Washington State and it did not break a sweat.

I wouldn't try that with anything less. But that is just me.
 
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