towing issues for the truckless

D

Dave Gallagher

New member
This is newbie Dave again
I was pretty impressed with all the feedback last night re. my ponderings on twins vs singles. I did go to the thread on the subject and enjoyed the comments but there seems to be no definitive preference. I do think the ladder issue is valid but isn't there another option for that ? What about some small side mount ladder?
I have another more basic question:
I'd rather not buy a new vehicle as well to tow the 22. I have a Dodge Magmnum 2005 with bags of power for towing but it is too low for the ramp. I would end up backing the darn thing into deep water, right?
So, is there some type of temporary extension that can be installed dockside to get the added length needed to avoid the above problem,some tongue extender for the trailer that can be unfastened and removed for normal towing? Just seems like this could be a common need for those without a truck, or do all Brats need trucks?
Dave
 
Dave Gallagher":2h7z9co3 said:
This is newbie Dave again. I have another more basic question:
I'd rather not buy a new vehicle as well to tow the 22. I have a Dodge Magmnum 2005 with bags of power for towing but it is too low for the ramp. Dave
Click to expand...

Dave, according to my towing guide, the Dodge Magnum is only rated to tow 1,000 lbs, and you really do need 5,000 lb capacity minimum to tow the C-22. My trailer/boat fully loaded weighs 4770 lbs total with 275 lbs of it resting on the ball. I can and do tow most places quite easily with my 6 cylinder Toyota 4Runner, though I do have to back in 'till the tires touch water. (bunk tandem trailer) Sure, the "Beast" Chevy Duramax equipped truck does it without breaking into a sweat, but it's not absolutely necessary except when I go up against the C-Brat Founding Father.

Don
 
Don-

You, Mike, and several others out to come up/down/across to Anderson, just below Redding, where they have truck-trailer races.

50 laps on a dirt track, and you get disqualified if the other driver can break the trailer off your rig!

Fun any summer Saturday night! I'll buy the beer! :beer

Joe.
 
Dave the dodge probably has plenty of horsepower but lacks the torque. I'm sure it's not geared for low end torque. THere's more to towing than just horsepower. What about the rear suspension? Is it capable of handling a 500 lb plus tongue weight.
 
Flapbreaker
I don't believe the hemi beast is capable of towing the balsa bateau. I must say it is a painful recognition but I think you may be right . 500 lbs -no way Jose on the tongue. But it is soo fast from stop signs -- I don't understand...
I think it may seem dumb , but I will call my trusty tacoma 4 into service. 160 hp with a pretty good low gear may work if I drive carefully at 3 in the AM and not go further than the local dock just 5 or 6 miles away.
I wonder if that fine little four can pull the thing out of the water tho'.
Dave
 
Dave Gallagher":3ditii0w said:
wonder if that fine little four can pull the thing out of the water tho'.
Dave
Click to expand...

Dave- May well need to add some extra weight to the pickup bed to get the traction needed.

Also, when backing down a steep ramp, even my Durango sometimes skids a bit when the brakes are put on fairly hard. Fortunately, the skidding stops when the boat hits the water and starts to float!

Joe.
 
Dave,

A great resource for understanding the hows and whys of trailering is Trailer Boat Magazine. They have complete listings of tow ratings for 2006 vehicles as well as a data base of tow ratings for older vehicles, including your 2005 Dodge Magnum.

http://www.trailerboats.com/

Towing a trailer is a big deal in my book, and that big deal happens when you press the brakes. It's gotta work. Manufacturer tow ratings are based on many factors, including frame strength, hp, and braking power.

Manufacturers tow ratings and recommendations (factory tow packages, for example) to me are important; I adhere to them.

I currently tow my 2500 lb boat/motor/trailer combination with a 2004 6 cylinder 4Runner rated for 5000 pounds towing. The 4 wheel drive is extremely important to me: I launch and retrieve in salt water where the tides can leave the ramps slick. I have launched and retrieved a lighter boat/trailer package with a 2 wheel drive not-limited-slip differential Toyota 4 cylinder pick truck, and pulling a boat out on a slippery ramp can be pretty scary as the rear end of the truck loses traction and fishtales from side-to-side as it tries to get the traction back. Slipping back into the water at that time is a very real possibility.

Personally, I would only tow with a vehicle rated for the required weight of trailer and which has either 4 wheel drive or 2 wheel drive with limited slip differential.
 
No matter what you say, you have a boat, or you want one, therefore money pretty much can not be important to you.

Go buy a big honking truck of some kind. Spend as much as you can - we all know you don't really care how much it costs.

In a short-lived moment of sanity, I bought a used F250 for $4,000. It pulls the boat just fine, and stays parked out of the way the rest of the time just fine too.
 
So, is there some type of temporary extension that can be installed dockside to get the added length needed to avoid the above problem,some tongue extender for the trailer that can be unfastened and removed for normal towing?
Dave,
As an ex-sailor who found himself with a similar problem, I experienced the need to back the boat and trailer half way across the lake in order to get the boat to float off the trailer. I purchased two 18" stinger extensions that I would put in during pre-launch on a flat spot in the parking lot. Be certain to place wheel chocks in front of and behind the trailer wheels on both sides before you unhook the trailer or you boat and trailer may go into the self-launch mode.

The stinger extension(s) will not only keep your truck wheels on dry pavement, but it will also make turning in a parking lot easier. Unless you have a Tork Lift hitch, don't leave these extensions in for towing. You should be able to find the extensions at J C Whitney, Camping World or most trailer hitch specialty shops.
Jim
 
My brother owns the 2006 magnum with the 3.5 six it is only rated to tow 2000lb ,with the hemi it will tow 3800lb .

my duck weighs in about 3800lb with only 10gallons of gas and no water this is with a single axcel trl 865lb , 90 suzuki 425lb, boat 2000lb, misc stuff
anchor windlass ,trim tabs , safety items etc 500lb or so .

you would be over your max if you got gas or filled with water or loaded it up with more stuff good luck in your quest
 
Pretty good info. all the way around. If I can't use the Dodge then the extension won't be an issue, but the data is useful anyway.
I'll probably break down and get a used truck with the limited slip or maybe 4 wheel drive. If these boats are as fun as you guys seem to think, then the investment will be worth it.

Dave
 
Dave- I like what Fishbob said. Get a truck. I use a Ford Explorer V-6. It works OK but not great . 4WD low snatches a 22 out of the drink
with ease. But not great for over 5 miles of towing. Could be partly the trailers fault. I do know my freinds truck pulls it with no problem.

Think truck (V-8 ) and leave the Dodge transmission on your car alone. I think you will be a happier boater for it.

Good luck

Chris Bulovsky
 
There are also custom built hitch extensions--or even wheeled extensions.
However, you need a SUV or truck to tow. We used a Honda Pilot part of the time to tow the C Dory22 and it is about the smallest vehicle one can use (rated 3500 lbs RV trailer, 4500 boat --but the windage of the C Dory is more than many boats). We had a two axle trailer and trailer brakes.

I purchased a well used diesel truck for the Tom Cat 255. In the long run it pays off to have the truck.
 
If your boat is a hassle to launch and retrieve, it can take a lot of the fun out of using it. THE OPPOSITE IS ALSO TRUE.

I have two pickups. The smaller one (which I drive daily) is a Toyota Tacoma, V-6 with AT. It is rated to tow 5000#, so I can tow the CD-22 with it. But this setup offers me very little spare capacity. Once, I barely made it back up the slippery ramp, by burning rubber the whole way!

My other truck is a 3/4 HD Chevy Silverado with four-wheel drive (which I bought some years ago to tow our fifth wheel trailer). It can pull the CD-22 with ease (only rarely do I need to use the four-wheel drive). It also makes launching and retrieving the boat a joy (rather than a dreaded chore). I can literally float the boat off and on the trailer (with no strain whatsoever) all by myself (with no help needed whatsoever) and never get my feet wet. THAT'S WORTH A LOT!
 
I have been using Ford vans to tow my CD 22. The latest is a 1991 E350 one ton with a 460ci fuel injection motor, auto trans, and two wheel drive. It gets 12mpg not towing and 8-10mpg towing.

Large vans are not expensive used and have enough weight on the rear axle to pull up the ramps. They also can store your extra boat stuff while parked.
 
I've also used two Ford vans to tow my CD-22, although they were half tons (E-150s), with 5.8L V-8's. Compared to Larry's E-350/7.6L V-8, I experienced somewhat better gas mileage: 11 city, 14 hwy, and about 12 with the boat, and can recommend them highly.

My present Durango, with a 5.9L V-8, has both a limited slip differential and four wheel drive on demand with a low range. Plenty of grunt, but a little lighter overall, sometimnes skidding under braking when backing down steep ramps. The Durango is less vulnerable to cross-winds, though. I miss the roominess of the vans.

Many live-aboards have a "parking lot van" used for storage, especially those in less roomy sailboats.

Joe.
 
pcator-

I hope someone who has that exact tow vehicle and boat will chime in here, but I think I can offer some insights.

Based on my experience with a '98 Durango with a "conventional" OHV 5.9L V-8, the power is not the issue, but the determining factor is the overall weight/suspension relationship between the tow vehicle and the towed trailer/boat. There's plenty of power from the motor, but towing stability and stopping ability set the limits. You may also find that there may be some suspension differences between the models that could make some difference in the total tow ability of the combination.

I wouldn't hesitate to tow a CD-25 with my Durango, but I'd be very certain to hold the speed down until I found the maximum speed that the rig was capable of going before it started oscillating back and forth with instability. Most tow combinations where the tow vehicle is on the marginal side have a speed at which the trailer begins to sway back and forth side to side and become unstable.

This is particularly noticeable going DOWNHILL, although a well adjusted brake set up will certainly help minimize it, making the trailer help hold itself back instead of wanting to pass the tow vehicle, where it's pushing altnernately to one side then the other on the hitch. If the tow's trailer brakes are ineffective, the situation is quite dangerous.

The other issue is stopping. Regardless of how much power you've got to tow a trailer/boat combination, you have to stop it, and most folks don't find out their minimum stopping distance until they're in a panic stop, and suddently the rig doesn't stop like they usually experience it, and seems to go on forever, the towed combination shoving the tow vehicle endlessly forward and into the collision danger zone.

I wouldn't be surprised if a boat like the CD-25 towed by a Durango would DOUBLE the stopping distance required over the tow vehicle alone. For the ultimate E-Ticket experience, try this emergency braking scenario going downhill around curves in deep snow!

My last thought about this would be regarding backing down steep ramps. Even the CD-22 (4300-4500 lbs with a tandem trailer), pulls my Durango back hard enough when backing to skid the rear tires when braking. (Part of this is due to the tongue weight shifting to a LIFT upward instead of a downward push as the trailer is tilted back going downhill, I think.)

A CD-25/trailer at 7000-8000 lbs would be much more difficult to launch on such a steep ramp. One could compensate with some weight placed in the rear of the Durango, of course, but it would take at least 500 lbs or more.

The final conclusion is that you could tow a CD-25 with a Durango, but care would definately be required, and it would be a marginal tow vehicle in the mountains and under difficult towing conditions.

By the way, it's my recollection that Mike (TyBoo) towed his CD-25 home from Sequim, Washington to Warrenton, Oregon with a Jeep, so excercising reasonable care can make a big difference.

I hope I haven't overstated the problem here, but I always try to answer not only the specific question posed, but also include plenty of information for those other folks who are less experienced with the matter at hand, just as a general learning aid.

Joe.
 
Back
Top