Tow vehicle advice sought

W

westward

New member
Greetings!
I'm starting to think about a new tow vehicle and would like to get thoughts about 4WD vs. 2WD with locking rear differential. The latter configuration is available on the mid-side pickups and would seem sufficient for pulling the boat out of the water at the ramp. I don't have any experience using such a system. For years I used a 2WD Econoline van as my tow vehicle for a much heavier Glasply. I always made it out but there were a few frustrating retrievals where the drive wheel spun. Now I have 4WD but hardly ever need it, and almost never use it during normal driving. The 4WD adds resale but costs much more up front and reduces fuel economy by a considerable amount. I'm looking at a Toyota Tacoma or Chevy Colorado but open to other choices. My tow weight is appx. 3,500#. I kind of don't want a full size pickup for parking/maneuvering reasons but they're now about the same price and MPG as the mid-size trucks. Thoughts? Thanks, Mike.
 
Low tide retrieval can mean slimy algae covered ramps. I've occasionally struggled to get traction with my full size 4x4 pickup, and at least once would have buried myself in the mud in low tide without 4x4.

A locker on the rear is a huge improvement. I have air lockers on an old 4x4 we have fun with, and just rear wheel drive with the locker engaged is equivalent to 4x4 off road. On a ramp though, I think its the front drive wheels that have a less slippery footing which claw the truck and trailer up the ramp.

If your selective about when you use the ramp, you probably will never have any trouble with 2 wheel drive and a locker
 
The old adage, "better to have it an not need it than need it and not have it" comes to mind!
Any mid or full size pickup with 4wd will make launching and retrieving much easier anywhere you go. Limited slip rear differential is good, but if the ramp is slimy, you'd be much better off in 4wd.

Ram trucks has a 1/2ton diesel called EcoDiesel, does everything the Hemi V8 does but gets 23-28Mpg.
I have one, best truck I've ever owned! (And I've owned almost all of them!)
 
'Tis an age-old question...

My take - I don't buy trucks for gas mileage, and since they're not my primary vehicle losing 1-2MPG is insignificant given the utility 4WD provides.

And, there will almost certainly come a day you need that 4WD utility - particularly when towing boats. These days may be far and few between, but when the day comes - not having 4WD could range from a minor inconvenience, to ruining your day.

I've probably used the 4WD in my truck less than 50 times since buying it new in 1997. Still - I'd get it again without batting an eye.
 
Of course in your weight range you could do without a truck and use any manner of possibly better MPG SUV/Crossover vehicles.

We like to use lots of ramps at all tides and I wouldn't do that without 4wd. If you have a favorite launch ramp and know it well you could get by with less in many cases. Our most commonly used ramp is impossible at low tide without the added drive wheels.

Greg
 
And not just slime covered ramps but also ramps that end early. Some of our local ramps only go down so far before you are actually driving on gravel or some sand/mud at a low to very low tide. That makes traction tough and we like the option of still pulling the boat out and not having to wait around for more water like we see others often doing.

Not retired yet.

Greg
 
My Nissan Frontier 4x4 tows our CD22 just fine. It's not a brute but it does the job. I've gone up hills on the freeway and it handles those fine. I have not tried mountain passes yet. As for the traction, the 4x4 action on the Frontiers is great! It was an unexpected surprise when we had a big snowfall the first year I had the truck and it handled the snow and hills flawlessly, really good traction to the road surface. Much better than the 4x4 Dodge Durango I previously owned. I have a lot of confidence when I switch to 4-wheel drive with this truck. Slimy ramps have not been a problem.
 
Aurelia":v6ij9l9y said:
Of course in your weight range you could do without a truck and use any manner of possibly better MPG SUV/Crossover vehicles.

We like to use lots of ramps at all tides and I wouldn't do that without 4wd. If you have a favorite launch ramp and know it well you could get by with less in many cases. Our most commonly used ramp is impossible at low tide without the added drive wheels.

Greg
Click to expand...
I have a Jeep Liberty Diesel (2005) 2.8 litre MV-Motori. This was only available for 2 years -05-06. Then California "North America's controlling tail found it didn't meet their exhaust pollutions standards and that was the death knell for this great little engine. And the tow rating was 5000lbs too! for this great do all little towing Jeep. Now Chrysler-Fiat- who owns this Italian MV Motori company, are into producing the Dodge Ram 1500 with this highly rated 2800cc- now V6-Ecodiesel (MV Motori) tow rating 9300lbs up 28 mpg.
Now I am waiting for the light bulb to go on at Chrysler again and repower the Jeep Cherokee with this engine before my 2005 model needs replacing replacement.
 
Blueback":2tr6thrn said:
Now I am waiting for the light bulb to go on at Chrysler again and repower the Jeep Cherokee with this engine before my 2005 model needs replacing replacement.
Click to expand...

The V6 EcoDiesel is currently available in the Grand Cherokee. For AT LEAST 2014 and 2015 model years if not before then.

So, you are in luck!

Fair Winds and Diesel Power,

david
 
I have a 16 ft ( not a C-Dory) boat that weighs about 2500#. I used to have a 2WD one ton Ford with the V-10 engine. I had the truck before the boat as a work truck. It would spin about 1 RPM on a weedy ramp. Towing I didn't even know it was there. Got 12 MPG towing the boat.

I traded it for a new 2WD Nissan Frontier with the V-6. The towing capacity is 1000# for a trailer without brakes. I put on electric over hydraulic brakes. Very nice and comfortable truck. Pulls the boat just fine, but you can tell it is there. I only get about 18 or 19 MPG on the highway not towing. We just took a trip with the boat. I'll get the towing mileage later.
 
My current vehicle (Yukon XL) with full 4 x 4, locking diff, dual range, is the first real 4 x 4 I have owned in 60 years of towing boats. I did own a Honda Pilot with all wheel drive. I bought the Yukon, because I wanted the neutral transfer case so I could tow it behind my RV the 4 x 4 was an included extra. We had no problems towing a C Dory 25 behind a diesel Excursion (1973).

That said--I can never remember a time I could not pull a boat out of the water with 2 wheel drive, and a locking diff. The ramps in the PNW are most likely to have slime, with the high tidal range. Also if you use any sand or gravel ramps, then the 4 x 4 becomes essential.

I do recommend the large SUV--I believe that the ride is better than the pickup, for most folks they are more versatile, but that depends on what you move in the truck. We get best mileage (20 to 22 mpg), on the highway (at 55-60), following the RV. Towing a C Dory 22 we get about 12 to 15 mpg, depending on conditions.
 
dave":2fsyhiy1 said:
I have a 16 ft ( not a C-Dory) boat that weighs about 2500#. I used to have a 2WD one ton Ford with the V-10 engine. I had the truck before the boat as a work truck. It would spin about 1 RPM on a weedy ramp. Towing I didn't even know it was there. Got 12 MPG towing the boat.

I traded it for a new 2WD Nissan Frontier with the V-6. The towing capacity is 1000# for a trailer without brakes. I put on electric over hydraulic brakes. Very nice and comfortable truck. Pulls the boat just fine, but you can tell it is there. I only get about 18 or 19 MPG on the highway not towing. We just took a trip with the boat. I'll get the towing mileage later.
Click to expand...


I got 13.179 MPG over 514 miles in Southern Florida, where a highway overpass is a hill.
 
Without question I agree with PaulNBriannaLynn. To many times I had to reach for the 4 wheel drive knob to get up a ramp. I would not even question it. Buy a 4x4.
 
I'm an outlier as usual (except agree with Dr Bob here)... My GMC Sierra 2500HD diesel was not available with 4WD, but has rear slip diff and pulls the 11,200# TC up every slime-covered ramp with under 2-4 inches of total tire slip always. With over 900# tongue wgt, the tires dig down to solid cement fast. The huge weight may be the advantage here. I wouldn't launch this rig on a grass, gravel or mud ramp. In 10 of 13 prior lighter boats, I always had 4WD and liked it. Get it if you can. But if you can't, you may still be able to play with us. Don't be deterred by a good rear slip diff 2WD for a heavy rig (>16,000#) diesel. We get 12 MPG @ 60-65MPH through any weather without any special permits. No $400,000 SeaRay 370 can do that.
Cheers!
John
 
I suspect you're considering a vehicle like mine: a 2008 2WD Toyota TRD. Ours has four doors and drives beautifully. Best of all it fits nicely in our small driveway. It has the locker rear end but honestly I've never had to use it. It has the factory towing package so it has the 7-pin plug and will tow 6500 lbs. I drive a lot of miles so am glad to have the extra 2 MPG and lower service costs.

Remember, too, that most of these 4WD trucks don't give you the driving safety that an AWD car has because they're not made for driving on pavement in 4WD mode for any length of time. I could see where 4WD would be nice on primitive ramps (or otherwise slippery for some reason like sand) but my guess is you could lock the rear end and get out just fine. With the weight of the boat on the hitch and with the slope of the ramp there's not going to be much weight on the front axle anyway.

Just my .02.
 
An additional thought: consider putting a trailer hitch receiver on the front of the truck, that way you have better control, visibility and traction when launching…Granted, that the weight in the rear may be necessary on many ramps.

Also there is a real advantage of tow hooks on the front of a truck--(hitch can double as this)--if you get stuck, than another vehicle, up on good solid ground, can give you a pull. I have done this for others on several occasions, and have a tow line in the truck most of the time.
 
Thanks for all the great info! I am also intrigued by the idea of diesel. Chrysler now offers a mid-range diesel and I hear the Chevy Colorado will offer one for next year. These should end up being 30 MPG vehicles, which will offset the higher price of fuel. All the domestics offer diesel in their larger pickups but I really don't want that much truck. Toyota offers it in other countries but unfortunately not here in the U.S. I also see that Ford is coming out with a few new engine choices for their F-150 series. My current tow vehicle is a 2004 4 Runner V6. It's a beautiful, comfortable car and it tows the boat effortlessly, but I want to be able to throw wet downriggers/tackle/dogs in, and do dump runs, etc. around home. I only switch into 4WD because the manual recommends doing so to keep the system lubricated; otherwise I haven't yet needed it. Lots to choose from, and many possible approaches. Cheers! Mike
 
Question:

In order to improve mileage on 4WD vehicles, can't one install Warn Hubs to allow the front wheels to spin freely when not using 4WD to avoid spinning the whole assembly of front axles, differential, drive shaft, and part of the transfer case?

Or won't they fit/install on many 4WD vehicles?

You'd still have the additional weight of 4WD, but a lot of the rolling friction would be gone.

Should give you back the 1-2 or so mpg when in 2WD.

Just asking.....

Joe. :teeth :thup
 
I would look for a low mileage suv with four wheel drive. If the difference in gas mileage between two wheel drive and four wheel drive is an issue. Sell the boat :lol:
D.D.
 
The modern, cab controlled 4wd lock or free wheel system does the same thing as the old warn hubs. Or so I'm told. I'm pretty sure that if there was any mileage improvement, I'd have a hard time telling whether and extra bit was due to a hub change or just the better diesel last stop and so on. I asked the dodge people and they said the fronts on my diesel free wheel like the old warn system when I disengage the 4wd. Something about some pins or steel balls engaging or disengaging. I have an old 85 ford bronco as well and it has the warn manual hubs and they make a big difference when they are engaged or not in fuel savings and drive-ability.

Some folks say they've experienced failures with the modern auto hub locks, but mine have done fine so far.
 
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