New twist in US/Canada border crossing by anglers/boaters

Capt Harpoon

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http://www.watertowndailytimes.com/arti ... /306179983

N.Y. boater reports Canada crackdown
VESSEL BOARDED: Fisherman runs into red tape at favorite spot in Gananoque Narrows

By BRIAN KELLY, TIMES STAFF WRITER
Watertown Daily Times
Watertown, New York
FRIDAY, JUNE 17, 2011

A fisherman's got to know his limitations. And the same now apparently goes for every other boater on the St. Lawrence River who may accidentally drift into Canadian waters.

Roy M. Anderson, a seasonal resident of Thousand Island Park, found out May 30 that long-held notions of where it's OK for United States citizens to fish no longer apply. While fishing a favorite spot in the Gananoque Narrows with a friend, his boat was boarded and then "seized" by Canadian Border Services Agency officers.

"I was dumbfounded," Mr. Anderson, 22, Baldwinsville, said. "My dad's 67 years old and he's fished there his whole life without a problem."
According to Mr. Anderson, officers came aboard his boat and checked his $83 Canadian fishing license, which he always carries, and checked for outstanding criminal warrants, of which there were none. Trouble started when Mr. Anderson was asked if he had reported his presence in Canada at a port of entry, which he had not. At the time, he was less than a quarter-mile into Canadian waters.

"I was told, 'If you are in Canadian waters, you should be running toward a port of entry. If you're not running toward a port of entry, you are in violation of the law,'" he said.

Mr. Anderson, who fishes the narrows daily in the summer, said he had been checked previously by Ontario Provincial Police and Canadian game wardens and was always left with the impression that, as long as he was not anchored or otherwise on shore, he was doing nothing illegal.
This time, his boat was searched for contraband and seized and he was told that it would cost him $1,000 to get it back. If he could not immediately come up with the money, he would be placed in handcuffs and made to lie on his stomach while his boat was towed to shore in Canada, where he could face a fine of up to $25,000 under the Canadian Customs Act.
"I had to pay it on the spot," Mr. Anderson said. "They seized my boat and I had to buy it back on the spot."

The Canadian Customs Act states that penalties "shall become payable on the day the notice of assessment of the penalty is served on the person." It also gives border agents the authority to seize a boat "as forfeit."
Chris J. Kealey, a spokesman for the Canadian Border Services Agency, said if the penalty is not able to be paid on the water, "the alternative is they can seize the vessel pending payment of the penalty."

Mr. Anderson said that his boat is old and "not worth much," so "I was thinking about letting them just take it." After a phone call to his father, Michael, he agreed to pay the money using a credit card.
"Usually I don't have my wallet with me out there," he said. "Thank God I had a credit card with enough on it so I could get my boat back."
Sean R. Magers, a spokesman for Rep. William L. Owens, D-Plattsburgh, said the congressman has been made aware of Mr. Anderson's plight and has "reached out" to the Canadian Embassy on the matter.
Mr. Magers said the congressman's interpretation of the statute involved exempts fishermen, as it states that it does not apply to a person entering Canadian waters "directly from one place outside of Canada to another place outside of Canada."

David A. McCrea, a charter captain out of Henderson who fishes frequently in Canada, said "there's no rhyme nor reason" to be found in the enforcement of the Canadian fishing and boating regulations. He said calls to the border agency's Canadian Passenger Accelerated Service System, or CANPASS, which is designed to expedite the customs and immigration process, rarely provides a satisfactory answer as to what is and isn't allowed.

"You call that number five times and get five different answers," he said. "You just keep calling back until you get the answer you're looking for and then you get that guy's badge number."
Russell A. Finehout, a Clayton fishing guide, said he has had a Canadian fishing license for 55 years and it has always been a general rule among guides and other fishermen that if you had a license and weren't anchored, you could fish in Canadian waters without declaring your presence to customs.

"I've never been stopped by Canadian customs in all my years of fishing and I'm 74 years' old," he said.
Mr. Finehout said he recently visited the Canadian customs office at Landsdowne, Ontario, and was told that American fishermen are expected to report into the country at points in either Gananoque, Ivy Lea or Rockport.

"That makes it pretty much impossible for us to fish because of the time wasted going all the way over there to check in and then back to where you want to fish. That's a couple hours wasted, plus the extra expense for the gas."

Mr. Finehout said he was also told at the meeting that the rules apply not just to fishermen, but to all boaters, even people who unwittingly drift into Canadian waters without realizing they have crossed the international border.

"They don't want us to go over there. It's quite apparent to me," he said. "It'll be the last time I buy a Canadian fishing license."
 
Hmmmmmmmmm... It will be interesting to see if this was just a mistake by some rookies, a one time rare event (perhaps due to belligerence on the part of the boater) or a new policy of enforcement that will apply all over. If the latter, the $220 I just spent on two BC fishing licenses is worth less now.
 
I read this story and was wondering if many people realized how bad it's got for Canadians trying to cruise in U.S.A waters since the new reporting requirements went into effect.
http://www.customs.gov/xp/cgov/travel/p ... erview.xml
I tried to abide by these regulations since their inception in S.E. Alaska and found the inconsistency of their enforcement and interpretation to be very frustrating. I finally sold our boat this year after over 25 years of cruising in these waters as it no longer was worth the hazel I had to go through. Too bad it has come to this, but right now I don't see it getting any easier on either side of the border.
 
Even as US citizen, I've always found the border crossing easier and the staff more friendly going into Canada than coming back to the US.
 
Let me put on my conspiracy hat for a minute.( mark was done using it on the parks issue anyhow) Who's to gain by guides and their clients not fishing Canadian water from U.S. ports???? Canadian guides and ports.

This is another step in a push to cause fishing clients to use canadian guides and port instead of U.S. operators. a few years ago Canada stopped allowing the use of licenses bought on line to be used to fish parts of Canadian waters for halibut. So you were no longer allowed to buy a Canadian fishing tag on line and fish out of neah bay in select Canadian waters. The idea was to get the U.S. clients to us guides and services on that side. The result was van loads of Americans going to the first store selling tags across the border at the Blaine crossing and still fishing with u.s. guides in nech bay anyhow. social engineering of behavior rarely works and never the way you think it will.

I hope this is not enforced in my area. a lot of guys fish both sides of the boarder with out checking customs all the time. it clearly states in the current regs that you do not have to check customs unless you anchor or tie up .

I guess all those cruise ships out of Seattle will have to stop in Victoria now before going on to Canada. Just more reason to annex B.C. as the 51st state.
 
Turns out a graduate student working with me this summer is a close friend of the "victim" and he just shed some light on this.
Apparently Canada Customs interpreted the fishing spot, in Canada, as his destination. They did not deem that he was in transit from NY to NY through Canadian waters. Transit passage is still fine, but this was interpreted as travel to Canada for a specific purpose, e.g. fishing, at a specific location, in Canada. That constituted illegal entry.
Also learned that the Canadian Custom's agent "looked like he was about 19 years old."
 
Certainly the first fisherman article is a change of enforcment from traditoinal reciprocity, or an error. Now with GPS it is easier to know when in foreign waters--but in the past, often the boundry was subject to dispute.

However, many of our foreign flaged vessls, brothers and sisters have never been treated well when cruising the US. It gets even worse with larger vessels, when a pilot might be required. Generally foreign flagged vessels need a US cruising license, and must check in at every port they visit where there is a customs presence.

This is generally ignored in the Washington State area--and there are some slightly different rules for countries with reciprocity (such as Canada).

As you go further afield, there are a lot of very difficult requirements to check into ports, and the protocols are very strict. The reciprocity with Canadian boarders has been fair and easy in the past. In the last times we checked into BC in the Gulf Islands we just did a phone call, or sometimes interacted with a single agent. Prince Rupert, usually involved a single agent boarding the vessel. In many countries there is agriculture, medical, customs, imigration, ligh house fees, and harbor masters involved. Thus a single check in may take all day, and taxi rides.
 
The fishing spot is the destination??? not if you don't drop a anchor. Just making the rules as they go and the common man gets to pay a thousand dollars.
 
So a thought comes to mind.....if the gentleman's vessel had been a "Documented Vessel" would Canada still seize the vessel if the "fee" had not been paid? Then, if the vessel were seized would the US Government then intervene on behalf of the American vessel owner to regain custody of his vessel?
 
I'm all for going to war with Canada over this fishing boat dispute after we get done in Iran and Afghanistan.
Seriously, as others have said my experiences have always been that coming back into the U.S. the U.S. border agents seemed to be in need of an attitude adjustment. Maybe an ass whuppin! No telling what the the Canadians go through coming into this country. I thought you could get a nexus card of something and come and go at will. What happened to being friends with your good neighbors? Is Canada still considered a friendly nation? Now where should we attack first? :lol:

D.D.
 
We someone posed an interesting question, (Marty) If we attack Canada and lose would we still get free medical care? Maybe we should hold back on the attack until we get some verification on this important question.
D.D.
 
Just to be exact; Walt Kelly first used the quote "We Have Met The Enemy and He Is Us" on a poster for Earth Day in 1970.

Regards,

Ron
 
I have a Nexus card to travel between the USA and Canada and its well worth the $50 for 5 years. At airports you can jump ahead of the customs line and or use a machine that reads you irises and go right to collect your bags. You can also now use the card at most major airports in the USA for travel back to the USA from most other countries. On the land crossings they have special lanes and or just swipe it, ask a few questions and let you go thru.
I never had to use it for boating, as I never cross between the USA and Canada via boat, but I would think they most likely give you a pass, as it shows you have gone thru the background checks and travel both countries enough to go thru the process to get the card.

Jim
 
Well i just mounted a 45 calibre on the bow of my boat just in case .lol
The law i was told is this: having a fishing license whether it is Canadian or American doesn't give you the legal right to fish in a foreign country.You must first have a Canadian or American Boat Landing Permit or Nexus Card and must first inform the authorities of the country that you plan on fishing the time and location where you intend to fish.If you are traveling " Free Passage " thru anothers counties water from point A to B you can not stop, fish,etc, ( even if you have a fishing licence ) unless you have the legal documents mentioned above and have informed the proper authorities of you intentions other wise you will be viewed as entering foreign water for the propose of fishing, which is illegal.That is was told rather unpleasantly by the USA Border Patrol. The same laws now apply in Canada.
 
centerisland":2nontq11 said:
This thread reminds me of the movie "Canadian Bacon":
:lol:

I love the scene where the invading US sheriff (John Candy) steals a Canadian truck and writes anti-Canada slogans on it. He gets pulled over by a Mountie (Dan Ackroyd) and told that they must also be in French!

MV5BMTU4OTA0NTE5N15BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwOTk1NjAzNA@@._V1._CR174,0,674,674_SS100_.jpg
 
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