How often do you use your shore power?

On a previous boat I was disconnecting my shore power cord (the thick yellow one) when I dropped one end in the salt water. It was only in a nano-second as I yanked it back out. But that is all it took. That connection was toast after that and I had to chop it off and reconnect a new fitting.

Just thought I would mention this in case someone does something similar and then hooks up to the boat and walks away. Big no no.

Martin.
 
Just an FYI changing over to the Smart plug socket on the boat was not an issue having the older round type factory plug. Our boat had shore power from the factory. One thing that everyone should be in the habit of doing is plugging in the boat end and unplugging with no power present. Plug in the shore power side; then turn on the breaker on the power pedestal. In reverse turn breaker off first then unplug at the pedestal then the boat. We like having a longer cord as we come thru the radar arch then down to the power plug leaving a loop down below the boats power socket as rain water won't run up hill. We also put a loop around the power pedestal with our power cord. After all this we throw the breakers in the boat and let the fun begin. Plugging in or pulling the plug out with power present causes arcing and this arcing on the plugs connections cause more resistance which over time can cause the heat build up and wires melt and then a fire. I look at my plugs./sockets very carefully. I upgraded to the Smart Plug on my existing 100' cord. If you follow the directions to a T you will have no problem making the upgrade. The cover on the boat's socket snaps into place on the cord end. Tidy set up. Pricey yes, but this should come as no surprise. It's always something. This is why I could not afford a burgee. :)
D.D.
 
Like everything else, preventive maintenance and monitoring is important. I see nothing wrong with those that use alternative methods of getting electricity on their boat. The bottom line is, know what you are working with, and don't overload it. Just because it's a big yellow cord with a twist lock on it, doesn't make it any safer than someone running a regular extension cord to their boat. How you hook it up and use it is what makes it safe! Colby
 
Colby,
What ever makes you happy. The marine power cords are a little more heavy duty than the extension cords at Lowes or Home Depot. Plus the only adapter we use has threaded coupler on a two foot cord if we only have a 20 amp connection (regular 115 volt wall plug). Our boat sits under a winter cover in our driveway all winter long with a heater running. Because of the way our driveway is configured we back over the cord with one axle of my wife's CRV and my truck. No issues for four years. The marine cords seem to offer better sealing at the boat end against water intrusion. For me over time and it's only my opinion (but also shared by others) they will hold up better. I posted here not because I was trying to change the world but I thought it was better to buy a heavy duty long term solutions to a shore power system. Their are a lot of folks that view these posts and my opinion was meant to fall under what I consider best practices. I thought some of my ramblings were relevant. I have breakers for every circuit and a main breaker for the incoming 115 volts. Two GFI duplex outlets, and a marine rated Charles 20 amp battery charger. I replaced a Guest charger that failed. Other than that, that's the way our boat was built. I guess they had their reasons for doing it that way. I would think the marine industry has standards that apply to electrical items related to boats. It's more than the big yellow cord and I think. I in no way wanted to imply that we could not be friends just cause you were not part of the exclusive big yellow cord club. :)
D.D.
 
even though Bob's layout seems so simple, and even though I make a living working with many of these products myself, I still dont feel comfortable with doing the install. I'm hoping to find someone local who can do the install and wiring with a battery tender this winter, although I'm not sure how much to budget for it.... :roll:
 
You can buy the heavy duty power cords at hardware stores. #10 gauge, and even with the yellow covering off the bulk reels. The difference may be that it is not tinned wire.

I would be concerned about running over power cords with an automobile, when it is so easy to make a wooden ramp to place the cord between two 2 x 6, taper the outside edges, and totally protect the cable. In marinas I dry and position my power cords so they are not run over by dock carts.
 
Hope you didn't take my comments wrong. I just see a lot of folks with a lot of ideas and opinions here, and mine are no different. ;-) I agree with you, that the marine cords are heavier duty and built for the environment they are meant for. But not everyone uses shore power frequently for heavy amperage items. I use my tools frequently, and tend to buy high quality life time guarantee stuff. But others may find cheaper tools suffice for what they need. My home extension cords get a lot more use than the shorepower cord on my boat. ;-) (And carry a lot higher amperage!) They also get drug thru dirt, grease and water! The only point I'm trying to make, is how one uses something, rather than what they use. I see a lot of "yellow" marine cords used in an unsafe manner too. But I see nothing wrong with someone trying to save money in a smart (and safe) way. Colby
 
colbysmith":ipndd5jd said:
Hope you didn't take my comments wrong. I just see a lot of folks with a lot of ideas and opinions here, and mine are no different. ;-) I agree with you, that the marine cords are heavier duty and built for the environment they are meant for. But not everyone uses shore power frequently for heavy amperage items. I use my tools frequently, and tend to buy high quality life time guarantee stuff. But others may find cheaper tools suffice for what they need. My home extension cords get a lot more use than the shorepower cord on my boat. ;-) (And carry a lot higher amperage!) They also get drug thru dirt, grease and water! The only point I'm trying to make, is how one uses something, rather than what they use. I see a lot of "yellow" marine cords used in an unsafe manner too. But I see nothing wrong with someone trying to save money in a smart (and safe) way. Colby
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Colby,
You are correct, and many people like you probably have the knowledge to know how to use electrical devices and connections in a safe manner. The thing that concerns me is some people who don't know what they don't know. I've been guilty of that fault from time to time, and experts like Dr. Bob often set me straight. In my opinion, if people have to ask basic self-help electrical advice, they should probably ask an expert to perform the work on their behalf. Nor should they cut costs with inferior components. A case in point is house wiring. If done right, a permit should be pulled and an inspector should approve the work. There is a lot at stake. Failure to adhere to electrical code can void one's insurance policy if a fire is deemed to be caused by improper wiring not adhering to code. I'll bet the same is true for boats. There are many subtle ways to make a mistake. Another concern is complacency -- it especially hits highly experienced people. A licensed electrician working for me started to saw through a 480 volt, 100 amp circuit with a hack saw, because he "thought" the connection was dead. At the time, he was sitting on a grounded, computer room signal reference grid. If he had cut through, he would have been electrocuted. He was a very smart and experienced man, it was just that in this particular incident, he forgot how dangerous his occupation was. I think it was actually a major factor in his decision to retire.
 
A licensed electrician working for me started to saw through a 480 volt, 100 amp circuit with a hack saw, because he "thought" the connection was dead. At the time, he was sitting on a grounded, computer room signal reference grid. If he had cut through, he would have been electrocuted. He was a very smart and experienced man, it was just that in this particular incident, he forgot how dangerous his occupation was. I think it was actually a major factor in his decision to retire
Click to expand...

That is pretty frightening experience! We had an electrician at the RV place in Knight's Key, who was called in because the breaker was blowing every 10 minutes on the main circuit. Two 200 amp 220 volt circuits. The legs were not equalized when the RV campground was wired/(probably re-wired after a hurricane). Most of the RV's use 50 amps 240 volts in our row. Because the 30 amp units were all pulling off the same leg of the 220 volts, thus one leg was up to 250 amps, and the other leg about 60 amps. There was plenty of power--but the loads should have balanced. Even a regular house or industrial electrician may not know either RV or boat wiring standards, and why there are problems in both marina, RV and end user wiring standards.


tk30.jpg


This is a kit you can buy at Home Depot for about $40--on the left is a polarity tester. Basically there are lights which will identify if the plug is wired properly by plugging it into a 15 amp plug. This detects reversal of hot and neutral and ground, or ground and neutral mis-wiring. In the center is a reasonable priced digital volt, milli amp and low amperage meter, resistance/conductivity meter and a non contact variable AC current detector, which will activate a tone and neon light if the circuit is "hot" by putting the end of a probe next to the switch, breaker, wire, plug etc. There does not have to be a completion of the circuit to work. I carry a similar kit, plus a clamp on 400 amp, 600 volt, AC/DC amp meter

http://c.shld.net/rpx/i/s/i/spin/im...=468&qlt=65,0&op_sharpen=1&op_usm=0.9,0.5,0,0

and a simple 12 volt test light in my electrical bag on both the boat and RV. When we plug in I check polarity. Reverse hot and neutral will trip many inverters, probably your GFI, plus it potentially creates a very serious hazard in a boat. I also have a cheap IR thermometer. (Also another use for my FLIR portable imager is to find 'hot" spots when trouble shooting an electrical problem)

I won't touch an electrical issue, until I have done testing--first is it hot, temp wise, then the non contact AC detector, looking for a live current--and probably verify this with one of the volt meters.
 
Dr. Bob,
You just brought up an important issue here. I used to have an electrician conduct a formal IR scan of all computer room electrical components to include transformers and circuit breakers. Through the years, IR scans have revealed many hidden problems that would not have otherwise been detected. The other day, I was looking at all the many electrical connections in my boat, and noticed that there was a lot of corrosion on the surface because I operate exclusively in a marine environment. So my question is this: do you recommend IR scans of both electrical components (switches, breakers, etc.) and power connections? Do you think that doing this kind of study is worthwhile on boats, or would an IR thermometer suffice? IR cameras used to cost thousands of dollars, at least for sensitive ones, and I wonder if the cheaper alternative of using an IR thermometer would suffice. (incidentally, I'm impressed with your level of thoroughness with regard to electrical systems and testing. You are clearly an example of someone who's not complacent.)

Thanks,
Rich
 
Rich,
Absolutely IR thermometer will suffice. The FLIR type of image is much faster to scan an area. It also gives a very fast and precise image of where the problem is. I use a PS 24, which is the cheapest marine unit--at about $2,000. It is designed with infinity focus. You can use an auxillary lens (not FLIR) and get a close focus. However, FLIR now has the E series, which starts with a low resolution color camera/with storage and software for $1000. It is lower resolution than the PS 24, but a daylight viewable 3" color screen but only 60 x 80 pix. (the PS 24 has a 240 x 180 image, but no storage and black/white and red--gray scale--not color.) If I was doing professional yacht surveys I would own one of the FLIR E5, with 120 x 90 pix for $1500. I think a FLIR survey, an ultrasound survey, and moisture meter survey should be part of every boat/yacht survey. Unfortunately is is only the moisture meter--and many surveyors do not know how to use these....
 
I think we have circled the subject, from the extension cord to the $300.00 umbilical from the space shuttle. The fact is we are all folks from all over the country. Some spend more time tied to the dock, some have never been to a marina. It is all "personal preference" with an eye to safety.

To the original question, having recently bought a CD22, I wish she had come with AC outlets. I had 110v cords dropped from every hatch, port
hole, and scupper while I renovated the boat from "theirs" to "mine".

Now that that is complete, I have no use for shore power. The boat is tied to a dock only long enough to move the trailer to the parking area. I have a GFI pigtail and a heavy 110V cord and an adaptor, should I ever need them. That works for me.

As for safety, the approved method of running an extension cord is to have the GFI at the source (pedestal), thereby protecting the whole run. GFI cords should be made this way or you can buy the pigtails and plug them in to the source and the cords into them.
 
anchorout":2pa88w4v said:
I think we have circled the subject, from the extension cord to the $300.00 umbilical from the space shuttle. The fact is we are all folks from all over the country. Some spend more time tied to the dock, some have never been to a marina. It is all "personal preference" with an eye to safety.

To the original question, having recently bought a CD22, I wish she had come with AC outlets. I had 110v cords dropped from every hatch, port
hole, and scupper while I renovated the boat from "theirs" to "mine".

Now that that is complete, I have no use for shore power. The boat is tied to a dock only long enough to move the trailer to the parking area. I have a GFI pigtail and a heavy 110V cord and an adaptor, should I ever need them. That works for me.

As for safety, the approved method of running an extension cord is to have the GFI at the source (pedestal), thereby protecting the whole run. GFI cords should be made this way or you can buy the pigtails and plug them in to the source and the cords into them.
Click to expand...

Okay, let's examine this a little closer. You have a 30 amp circuit, and use a 30 amp to 15 amp adapter to plug in at the 30 amp source. Then you use, most probably, a 15 amp pigtail GFCI outlet connected to a "heavy" cord. Now you think you are protected from overload protection because your GFCI is at the source. This is usually not the case, because GFCI's do not offer circuit overload protection -- these are residual current devices. So in all probability, you have a 15 amp extension cord, of unknown length and gauge, plugged into a 30 amp circuit. Unless you were to add 15 amp circuit overload protection, that would be a dangerous set up. And even if you did have such protection, electricity remains dangerous around water and all safeguards and procedures should be followed.
 
True about overload protection. But if you are not pulling more than 15 amps, I see nothing unsafe about running an extension cord rated for 15 amps (and for the environment it is used in). Is it any different than plugging in a 22 gauge cord at the wall outlet? A cord that I don't think could carry 15 amps, even though that is what the outlet is probably protected to? Colby
 
colbysmith":1jaqqors said:
True about overload protection. But if you are not pulling more than 15 amps, I see nothing unsafe about running an extension cord rated for 15 amps (and for the environment it is used in). Is it any different than plugging in a 22 gauge cord at the wall outlet? A cord that I don't think could carry 15 amps, even though that is what the outlet is probably protected to? Colby
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So you plug in a lamp with a 60 watt light bulb. You're not drawing much more than 1/2 amp. What happens if a short circuit occurs within the lamp fixture, or from any low wattage device? There are many ways to create short circuits too numerous here to enumerate. Now if that happens in your home, you are usually protected by a 20 amp circuit breaker or fuse. The whole idea of a fuse or circuit breaker is for the fuse or circuit breaker to blow when a short circuit is encountered -- not your internal wiring. Marine power is normally 30 amps, and uses 30 amp breakers. A short circuit could cause your power cord or device to melt, and there is a potential for a fire. Really, if a person chooses not to use circuit overload protection, they should use a 30 amp extension cord in a 30 amp fused outlet. Please be safe, that's my only motivation for being persistent on this subject.
 
Colby,
22 gauge extension cord man; that's like phone cord wire. They must be made in China. :P That must be rated in milliamps.
D.D.
 
I guess the safest answer is if you have shore power, and want to follow regulations, then use a marine shore power cord. However, if you don't have a shore power system, and just need to recharge your batteries while on the water, then I think it's ok to get an adapter with a GFCI, and use your regular extension cord. But personally, I have more problems seeing marine cords hanging in water, than I do seeing a clean outdoor extension cord securely attached at both ends! The cord alone isn't what makes it safe, but rather how it's maintained and used. Colby
 
C Nile is correct. To be completely protected one would have to have a 20 amp fused link at the GFI / male plug end of the cord. A direct short, without this link, would trip the 30 amp breaker. However, an overload, between the rating of the extension cord, the ratings of appliances, etc. and the 30 amp breaker could overheat the insulation and cause a fire.

C Nile, am I not correct?

However, I, like the Midnight Flyer, run an extension to my onboard battery charger; make sure it is sensibly run; unplug it when not on board; and that works for me.
 
We sometimes run a 25ft 15A 12GA cord from the dock through a standard 30A locking plug to a hard wired 15A GFCI on the boat. I think that gives enough protection to avoid fires/excessive heat in the cord.
 
anchorout":2uzkdo9h said:
C Nile is correct. To be completely protected one would have to have a 20 amp fused link at the GFI / male plug end of the cord. A direct short, without this link, would trip the 30 amp breaker. However, an overload, between the rating of the extension cord, the ratings of appliances, etc. and the 30 amp breaker could overheat the insulation and cause a fire.

C Nile, am I not correct?

However, I, like the Midnight Flyer, run an extension to my onboard battery charger; make sure it is sensibly run; unplug it when not on board; and that works for me.
Click to expand...

If the electrical cord is 15 amps, then you need a waterproof 15 amp breaker; 20 amp cords require a 20 amp breaker. The breaker, or waterproof fused link (on the hot side ) should be as close as possible to the 30 amp power source. I know some people may put breakers at the end of the cord, and that offers protection from overloads from attached devices, however, if one ever develops a short circuit within the cord itself, that could cause a fire on a boat. So it is best to be safe. But there are other factors, too. Is the marine power source wired correctly? Dr. Bob and others have recounted their experiences with incorrect wiring, which is why they perform the necessary tests. I am not an expert on electricity, and defer to others more knowledgeable than I.

Rich
 
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