HOLY NIP-N-TUCK BOATMAN......
- Thread starter Byrdman
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Captains Cat
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Nice pix Byrdman, what the heck is it? :?:
A
Anonymous
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It all started when I removed a screw from the transom and water ran out. I was initially in the process of vacuum laminating in a new transom core when I decided I really liked the cockpit without the splashwell, and things just got out of hand from there. Since I didn't want to see the look on my wife's face when the back end of the boat fell off in deep water, I read a bunch of books, communed with folks at boatdesign.net, consulted with a naval architect and a marine surveyor, looked at each and every post and pic that Oldgrowth posted regarding his project, and am currently winging it on my own...
Having lived in the Annapolis area for a while I always liked those long cockpit oyster boats with the small forward cabin. This boat will have a bit of that look to it.
I'm going to end up with a transom, splashwell, and storage compartments that are similar to the current 22-foot C-Dory offerings. Luckily, a friend of mine has a 2007 22-Angler and he lets me come by and measure and consider on a regular basis. I'm pretty much sold on a coupla 24-gallon saddle tanks at this point and the new gunwales may be around 10-inches wide to accomodate them and storage lockers below. I like the idea of having an area below the splashwell to throw big items and keep 'em out of the way. The gunwale at the steps is likely to remain at the six-inch width. The new profile aft of the cabin will be much more of a straight line than the Classic, but that's what I get for adding ten inches in width to the transom and moving it back four feet; I'll get as much curve as I can. The wider transom will accommodate a remotely-operated kicker mounted to port of the Honda 90.
To starboard will be the battery locker; to port will be a propane locker. One of the current conundrums is how to keep the batteries (2 starting and 2 6V house) low and still have easy access to them. That's gonna be a bit of weight with those batteries up that high. Maybe I'm over-considering the issue, but I'm prone to that...
The gunwales have been removed and the new sheer line profile will be pretty much in keeping with the upsweeping character of the Classic; the current models are fairly flat. Once I'm finished sanding the interior of the cockpit hull sides, I'll cut the lapstrake sections apart and remove the one-inch horizontal bits; the lowest section will remain attached at the chine. I'm impressed at the flexibility of the quarter-inch glass at the top edge while it's still attached. Once the frames are built the old glass will be repaired before I begin the new section; doing a 12:1 scarph joint for those repairs and keeping the one-inch lapstrake look that will eventially taper out at the transom. The old and new boat will be joined using a 24:1 scarph at the suggestion of the naval architect I consulted. The boys at Gougeon Bros. support this approach.
The new sole and transom will be plywood; I'm not sure if I'm going to make it from scratch or not; might just get some good thin A/C and laminate that up. The original sole core was - I believe - fir, but surprisingly full of voids; pretty much construction-grade stuff. The new ply you see in the pics at this point is just mockup stuff. The sole core will be half-lapped over the old by at least a foot.
I've got a lot of work to do before I flip the boat over to begin glassing. There is very limited space in my shop to work so I got the idea of making a couple of eight-foot wheels that fit the profile of the boat - one just aft of the cabin and one just ahead - that would turn on heavy rollers on the floor. A Wooden Boat magazine subscriber told me he'd seen just that concept a few issues ago. Here's what they did:
Mine'll be beefier as I'll also have to raise the upside down bow to lower the transom to a reasonable working height.
I've been delving into the C-Brats photo albums for the best ideas to incorporate into my boat - and there are many. This project has been in the learning/design phase for over a year and luckily, the design is still flexible.
It keeps me off the streets during the day and up at night...
Having lived in the Annapolis area for a while I always liked those long cockpit oyster boats with the small forward cabin. This boat will have a bit of that look to it.
I'm going to end up with a transom, splashwell, and storage compartments that are similar to the current 22-foot C-Dory offerings. Luckily, a friend of mine has a 2007 22-Angler and he lets me come by and measure and consider on a regular basis. I'm pretty much sold on a coupla 24-gallon saddle tanks at this point and the new gunwales may be around 10-inches wide to accomodate them and storage lockers below. I like the idea of having an area below the splashwell to throw big items and keep 'em out of the way. The gunwale at the steps is likely to remain at the six-inch width. The new profile aft of the cabin will be much more of a straight line than the Classic, but that's what I get for adding ten inches in width to the transom and moving it back four feet; I'll get as much curve as I can. The wider transom will accommodate a remotely-operated kicker mounted to port of the Honda 90.
To starboard will be the battery locker; to port will be a propane locker. One of the current conundrums is how to keep the batteries (2 starting and 2 6V house) low and still have easy access to them. That's gonna be a bit of weight with those batteries up that high. Maybe I'm over-considering the issue, but I'm prone to that...
The gunwales have been removed and the new sheer line profile will be pretty much in keeping with the upsweeping character of the Classic; the current models are fairly flat. Once I'm finished sanding the interior of the cockpit hull sides, I'll cut the lapstrake sections apart and remove the one-inch horizontal bits; the lowest section will remain attached at the chine. I'm impressed at the flexibility of the quarter-inch glass at the top edge while it's still attached. Once the frames are built the old glass will be repaired before I begin the new section; doing a 12:1 scarph joint for those repairs and keeping the one-inch lapstrake look that will eventially taper out at the transom. The old and new boat will be joined using a 24:1 scarph at the suggestion of the naval architect I consulted. The boys at Gougeon Bros. support this approach.
The new sole and transom will be plywood; I'm not sure if I'm going to make it from scratch or not; might just get some good thin A/C and laminate that up. The original sole core was - I believe - fir, but surprisingly full of voids; pretty much construction-grade stuff. The new ply you see in the pics at this point is just mockup stuff. The sole core will be half-lapped over the old by at least a foot.
I've got a lot of work to do before I flip the boat over to begin glassing. There is very limited space in my shop to work so I got the idea of making a couple of eight-foot wheels that fit the profile of the boat - one just aft of the cabin and one just ahead - that would turn on heavy rollers on the floor. A Wooden Boat magazine subscriber told me he'd seen just that concept a few issues ago. Here's what they did:
Mine'll be beefier as I'll also have to raise the upside down bow to lower the transom to a reasonable working height.
I've been delving into the C-Brats photo albums for the best ideas to incorporate into my boat - and there are many. This project has been in the learning/design phase for over a year and luckily, the design is still flexible.
It keeps me off the streets during the day and up at night...
A
Anonymous
Guest
Oh, and I'm very open to ideas others might have. Maybe there's something you always thought would be a good idea on your boat but you had more sense than to get out the sawzall...
Anyone is welcome to stop by if you are in town. This will be a slo-mo project as I don't have the skills and experience of Kevin Richards (Catch22) or Dave Thompson (Oldgrowth).
Tom Herrick
Anyone is welcome to stop by if you are in town. This will be a slo-mo project as I don't have the skills and experience of Kevin Richards (Catch22) or Dave Thompson (Oldgrowth).
Tom Herrick
Taking a saws-all to my 22 would scare the living daylights out of me!...but doing something like this is very, very tempting!
http://www.egyptian.net/~raymacke/TG/TG01.html
http://www.egyptian.net/~raymacke/TG/TG01.html
A
Anonymous
Guest
Snal,
I like the way he "rolled" his boat. Those Glen-L plans are certainly good for getting the imagination crankstarted.
Ashville - the new home for Brian Boggs Chairs. If you see him, say hi for me.
Tom Herrick
I like the way he "rolled" his boat. Those Glen-L plans are certainly good for getting the imagination crankstarted.
Ashville - the new home for Brian Boggs Chairs. If you see him, say hi for me.
Tom Herrick
localboy":195g8hah said:
Yes it does...never noticed that.
I spoke with Ray just after he finished the first boat build (he wanted something like a C Dory). I'd already be building a "True Grit" if I had the room! Actually , I do have the room...but I'd have to have it on rollers to roll out of the shop during working hours.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Dave,
You know, I don't remember exactly when he moved to NC. Between his teaching road trips and my schedules we didn't do much fishing in the last year or so. Good man, Brian. Very focused individual.
Tom
You know, I don't remember exactly when he moved to NC. Between his teaching road trips and my schedules we didn't do much fishing in the last year or so. Good man, Brian. Very focused individual.
Tom
With the added length.... I may follow Chris lead on his re-build....and raise the roof line a bit.... Not sure just how far up from the cockpit floor the roof line at the door is on a 22 Angler,,,,...but, I know on my 18 Angler...even at my short 5'8".....head clearance back into the covered area was too low. I am 100% sure that SENSEI Roger will agree after our trip on the Cumberland. Did yall know potato farmers can break into different lanuages?
But then... you may not want to screw around with cabin forward....only aft.
Yes.... I too love the looooong back cockpits of the working lobster boats. Like a back porch party on the boat.
I gotta get up that way soon.
Byrdman
But then... you may not want to screw around with cabin forward....only aft.
Yes.... I too love the looooong back cockpits of the working lobster boats. Like a back porch party on the boat.
I gotta get up that way soon.
Byrdman
Byrdman sed....
1994 Angler...68.75" from cockpit floor to the head-knocker at the door opening...70.0" to the top of the roof (low part at aft edge...not the raised mid section)
I never had a head-knock issue till the Cumberland River trip. For some reason I simply forgot to duck, even when completely sober
We do have a teak floor grate that lowers clearance to roughly 66".
1994 Angler...68.75" from cockpit floor to the head-knocker at the door opening...70.0" to the top of the roof (low part at aft edge...not the raised mid section)
I never had a head-knock issue till the Cumberland River trip. For some reason I simply forgot to duck, even when completely sober
We do have a teak floor grate that lowers clearance to roughly 66".
A
Anonymous
Guest
Raising the roof was one of the first things I was going to try a coupla years ago, but all my drawings of it made it look like a dorKy instead of the nice dory it is. Chris' adaptation, however, has the proportions down - in my opinion.
The pre-85 Classic roof allows my shrunken spine to stand upright just in front of the porta-potty which is, I guess, relatively handy. But I'm thinking that since we either sit or lie down in the cabin, or are moving toward one of those positions, I'm likely to leave the cabin roof alone. The cockpit - with a current working name of convertible salon - will eventually sport a Sunbrella enclosure that will provide standing room without causing that static bad hair thing.
Currently, I'm sanding the interior of the cockpit fiberglass to prep it for a couple of plys of glass once the exterior work is done. On the starboard side I got aggressive on the bottom of the step and water leaked out. I can't find any reason for the intrusion anywhere. Oh well, it'll make it easier to apply the glass to the interior and over the cable channels. I'll just make two new built-in steps and tab 'em on later.
On the sanding, I was using a 4x24 Porter Cable belt sander but the dust collection was a joke. I'd hooked up my shop vac directly to the aluminum tube that ejects very little dust into the bag. The belt sander was, however, doing a great job of removing paint and gelcoat quickly. I have modified my Bosch random orbit sander dust collection - which was surprisingly inadequate - with a rubber plumbing adapter to the 2 1/2-inch dust collector hose. I could pick up a five-foot 2x6 with the vacuum, which was actually a problem. I had to drill a coupla make up air holes in the fitting to keep the shroud from being sucked up into the pad. It does a remarkably good job of sanding and keeping the results to itself.
Now for the port side...
Tom
The pre-85 Classic roof allows my shrunken spine to stand upright just in front of the porta-potty which is, I guess, relatively handy. But I'm thinking that since we either sit or lie down in the cabin, or are moving toward one of those positions, I'm likely to leave the cabin roof alone. The cockpit - with a current working name of convertible salon - will eventually sport a Sunbrella enclosure that will provide standing room without causing that static bad hair thing.
Currently, I'm sanding the interior of the cockpit fiberglass to prep it for a couple of plys of glass once the exterior work is done. On the starboard side I got aggressive on the bottom of the step and water leaked out. I can't find any reason for the intrusion anywhere. Oh well, it'll make it easier to apply the glass to the interior and over the cable channels. I'll just make two new built-in steps and tab 'em on later.
On the sanding, I was using a 4x24 Porter Cable belt sander but the dust collection was a joke. I'd hooked up my shop vac directly to the aluminum tube that ejects very little dust into the bag. The belt sander was, however, doing a great job of removing paint and gelcoat quickly. I have modified my Bosch random orbit sander dust collection - which was surprisingly inadequate - with a rubber plumbing adapter to the 2 1/2-inch dust collector hose. I could pick up a five-foot 2x6 with the vacuum, which was actually a problem. I had to drill a coupla make up air holes in the fitting to keep the shroud from being sucked up into the pad. It does a remarkably good job of sanding and keeping the results to itself.
Now for the port side...
Tom
A
Anonymous
Guest
Fishhawk,
Not much of a side view, I'm afraid. Too small a shop; but what shop isn't too small - no matter the size...
Here's what I've got:
It was taken a few weeks ago. The transom mockup supports make me think that fins would be a nice addition.
Tom
Not much of a side view, I'm afraid. Too small a shop; but what shop isn't too small - no matter the size...
Here's what I've got:
It was taken a few weeks ago. The transom mockup supports make me think that fins would be a nice addition.
Tom
Very cool Tom, thank you.
That view is plenty good enough to "get it". So you will just spread out the sides to line everything up with the wider transom?
I'm gonna be watchin this one.
My wife and I with Osprey in tow will be traveling south to AL in late Sept/early Oct. for the winter.
If it works out we'll have to stop and see your progress.
I'll PM you for your address if that's O.K.
Capt Dan
That view is plenty good enough to "get it". So you will just spread out the sides to line everything up with the wider transom?
I'm gonna be watchin this one.
My wife and I with Osprey in tow will be traveling south to AL in late Sept/early Oct. for the winter.
If it works out we'll have to stop and see your progress.
I'll PM you for your address if that's O.K.
Capt Dan
A
Anonymous
Guest
Progress continues, albeit slowly, on the extension. I finally got the cockpit interior sanded for later fiberglassing. Still just beginning the mock-up stage. I generally like the new lines for the extension, but need to ensure they're truly fair curves before I move on.
The sheer line is very similar to the original Classic in its upward curve toward the transom. C-Dory's recent offerings in 22-foot sport a much flatter sheer line behind the cabin. I like the upward curve myself and can't find a reason not to go with this line and the increased height of about two inches at the transom. If anyone knows of reasons I should consider for flattening out the sheer line I'd like to know before I proceed much further.
It's getting interesting...
Tom
The sheer line is very similar to the original Classic in its upward curve toward the transom. C-Dory's recent offerings in 22-foot sport a much flatter sheer line behind the cabin. I like the upward curve myself and can't find a reason not to go with this line and the increased height of about two inches at the transom. If anyone knows of reasons I should consider for flattening out the sheer line I'd like to know before I proceed much further.
It's getting interesting...
Tom