Fuel Conditioner... what type??

T

Tortuga

New member
I know there has been lots of discussion on this in the past, but when I went to pick up a bottle today I came away stumped. Do I get fuel stabilizer? water absorber? ethanal treatment? all three?

My boat doesn't sit for more than a few weeks, but the gas can last for several months between fill-ups. I don't have any problems, but with the ethanal issues I've become a bit concerned. Is there a good basic stabilizer that accommodates ethanal?

Thanks for any suggestions.

Matt
 
Stabil is the "standard". I have also used the Pri G (or D) and Startron (Soltron). They all seem to work to some degree, and certainly prolong the useful life of gas. But you cannot make gasoline out of water....I have been adding all three recently, since I have some 6 month old fuel in the C Dory and probably will not use that for another few months. I used this combo in my 18 foot CC and it seems to work well.
 
Thanks for the suggestions.

I have been adding all three recently, since I have some 6 month old fuel in the C Dory and probably will not use that for another few months. I used this combo in my 18 foot CC and it seems to work well
Click to expand...

Does this mean that they can all work in tandem without counteracting each other or otherwise diluting the fuel?
 
Matt,
My boat sat from mid November '08 until mid April '09 with two half full tanks of an ethanol/gas mixture stabilized with Startron. Either I was lucky or the stuff worked cause those two half tanks have been run through the engine without incident.
Mike "Levity"
 
I looked at the chemistry (and I have been following Startron for some time--it susposedly is enzymatic)--and I don't see anything which will interact adversely. Each seems to work slightly differently.

There are other additatives, which I use--such as Ring Free in my Yahama 115.

As for SeaFoam, I have not used it. I see it used directly into the intake, into the crank case oil, into brake lines in cars, into the gas in high concentrations etc. I have thought it was for decarboning and cleaning, but I suspose that it may also help with older gas? Heck, I might throw some into my diesel truck just for good luck~!
 
I'm also wondering what additives to dump into Journey On's fuel tank. Now, we have E-85 which has alcohol, and we all clearly understand that alcohol absorbs water. Going up to out-of-the-way places, the gas probably comes in at the start of the season, and that's what you get, even if it's 6 mos old. So it seems prudent to use something.

And outboard manufactures have recommendations. Here is Mercury: Mercury Marine Fuel Discussion. And here is Evinrude, etc.:Evenrude Fuel Rest assured they don't like the new fuel, but don't offer specific guidelines except have a filter and use their fuel stabilizer.

Now this discussion is on fuel treatment seems to be focused of stabilizers such as Stabil, and other stabilizers. I've used Stabil for years when the fuel was sitting for months, such as in the bike's tank. And that worked well. But E85 not only can gum up/destabilize, but the alcohol can absorb water. Reading the label on Stabil for Ethanol, it says nothing about emulsifying (or absorbing) water. It stabilizes and conditions E85, as well as rebuilds your engine, but nothing about water which can and has killed EFI.

One recommendation is to seal the tank. This certainly isn't feasible; around here you'd have a collapsed tank. So I've been adding STP gas treatment every once in a while, since this has always worked for me in the past, albeit with regular fuel. I also religiously check the fuel filter/settling bowl that C-Dory has graciously supplied.

Anybody have any other ideas about how to combat water in the tank? I'd love to hear them.

Boris
 
Boris,

This is from the Star Tron description:

The enzyme package in Star Tron disperses water derived from normal condensation into microscopic clusters, and allows the water to pass through the fuel system and engine harmlessly, preventing the buildup on the tank bottom that can contribute to poor performance, fuel gelling and corrosion. If large amounts of water are already present it will be de-emulsified and drop out of the body of the fuel, improving overall fuel performance. Over a period of time, with fresh gas loads treated with Star Tron, even large accumulations of water will be totally eliminated.

Rob
 
The scientific data on Startron (or the various other names) is pretty thin.
There is lots of testimonial material. The MSDS shows that over 99.5% of the compound is aliphatic petroleum distillates. and less than 0.5% of the enzamatic chemical propeirtary organic chemicals...which is the core of the Startron.
Some of the companies own studies show that a ratio of 1 oz for 16 gallons, a one hundred gallon tank will be protected for ONLY up to 5 oz of water. This is not much "protection"--

I used it for over year in my diesel trawler (twin Cat 3208's). Zero difference in fuel economy or visiable smoke.

The only story I have personal knowledge of, is a friend had some 20 year old diesel which had geled (a small built in tank which had been forgotten) He had what we think is Startron put in the tank in Spain, and then sailed across the Atlantic. Upon arriving home, the diesel was liquid enough to be pumped out of the tank. It was not just that passage, since the boat was on its second circumnavigation.

So does it really help or not? I don't know--but I doubt if it absorbs much water. Enzematically breaking down fuel hyrdocarbon chains? I wonder. Could be.
 
Right now I am using Mercury Fuel Treatment & Stabilizer, which runs about $0.26 per gallon of gas. Star Tron, Sta-Bil and PRI-G run between $0.04 and $0.08 per gallon of gas, so I am thinking of switching when I run out of my current supply. Between the three brands, is it just a toss of the coin?

Rob
 
Hey, Dr. Bob -

Did you read the narrative on Sea Foam ("Why It Works") at

http://www.seafoamsales.com/motor-treatment/why-it-works/index.html ? This sort of discussion may make more sense to a fellow like you (as opposed to a fellow like me).

I know this stuff has a following on the Great Lakes, too. It is supposed to be good at combating the effects of ethanol, but I have no proof...just good results using it primarily (as to intention) as a fuel stabilizer. My Jet Ski has been a great test of this, I think.

I have no financial interest of any kind, direct or indirect, in Sea Foam.

Regards,
Mark
 
Ace Hardware has Stabil for $6.99 a bottle and free shipping. I've never bought this stuff and thought it would be a good idea to star using. Specially since all I put in the tanks are E15 blended gas. Is that a good deal? What's this stuff usually run a bottle?
 
I haven't seen it mentioned but there are two types of Stabil that I'm aware of the red type and the blue type. The blue is for the ethanol. I have been fortunate to be able to still get ethanol free fuel at the local marinas but I did purchase some of the blue stabil the other day for times I'm trailering and want to take advantage of the cheaper ethanol fuel and for my lawn equipment. I don't know if it works but as I remember the blue was more expensive than the red stuff and hard to find locally.
 
Using Stabil as a fuel stabalizer vs to prevent water problems (Phase separation) are entirely different. The summary of the Practical sailor showed that none of the products were of much value in the phase separation prevention.

Again--scientific evidence is difficult to find. I havn't seen much supporting any of these--but again I try them, hoping that they will help.

I have never had water in fuel problems, until I started using the E 10 (or 15).
 
marvin4239":17redii2 said:
I haven't seen it mentioned but there are two types of Stabil that I'm aware of the red type and the blue type. The blue is for the ethanol. I have been fortunate to be able to still get ethanol free fuel at the local marinas but I did purchase some of the blue stabil the other day for times I'm trailering and want to take advantage of the cheaper ethanol fuel and for my lawn equipment. I don't know if it works but as I remember the blue was more expensive than the red stuff and hard to find locally.
Click to expand...

The new concentrated "Marine Formula Sta-Bil" aka blue stabil "contains double the corrosion preventer and more than four times the fuel system cleaner in regular Sta-Bil (aka red Sta-Bil ) to fight many of the damaging effects of ethanol in gasoline in the marine environment including corrosion to marine fuel tanks, fuel lines, carburetors and injectors."
(The words that I am quoting are directly from the blue Sta-Bil container). As Dr. Bob indicated, whether there is any "scientific evidence" to support this is unknown to me.

Although it may be a bit more expensive than the red stabil, bear in mind that the quantities needed per gallon are considerably less, thereby making it more cost effective than the red stabil.

The red Sta-Bil recommends 1 oz per 2 1/2 gallons.
The blue Sta-Bil recommends 1 oz per 10 gallons, for everyday in-season protection or 1 oz per 5 gallons for seasonal storage.

I have now purchased the blue Sta-Bil and had to request that the local NAPA Auto store order it for me. Our NAPA store is now keeping it in stock as they weren't aware of it until I requested it.

I'm in the process of using up my remaining red Sta-Bil before I start using my newly purchased blue Sta-Bil.

I've been using the red Sta-Bil for years, but with the concern of the ethanol additive, I decided to make the switch to blue Sta-Bil.

http://www.goldeagle.com/brands/stabil/default.aspx
 
Starting in the middle of June you should be able to get this product at the Ace Hardware stores. My son-in-law is an assistant manager of the one of the Ace stores and he will be able to get it from the main warehouse in the middle of June. I have always had good luck with the red Sta-bil, pre E-10 gas. I guess I will now try the blue. I think it will be very important to drain the carbs for winter and maybe run them dry after each use if it will be more than a couple of weeks before the next trip? I also plan to use the blue in all my yard power equipment.
 
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