Donald Tyson
Member
Would love to chat about towing a CD25 with a half ton truck.
F150
- Thread starter Donald Tyson
- Start date
All most all C Dorys should have trailer brakes. The 25 are best with electric over hydraulic--it is mandated in Canada. (Truck controlled brakes in load over about 6800 lbs.) Going down long grades will often overheat surge brakes.
I towed my first 25 with a Ford Expedition, 7.3 L Diesel 3/4 ton chassis. I towed my son's and my second 25 with a GMC Yukon Xl (same as chevy Suburban--1/2 ton. Even with the heavy duty tow package the Yukon overheated on the Grapevine in Calif.--and we had to stop about halfway up the grade. I also had to add air bags. Many of the earlier 1/2 tons will be overloaded.
There are many of the new 1/2 tons rated for over 10,000 lbs. But read all of the fine print. When it was time for a new truck--it was a Ford 250, 6,7 L Diesel--in retrospect I should have gotten the gas engine. It was a problem driving the truck around town--I had to take it out on the road to nowhere (I 10) to heat the exhaust enough to get the DEF to work. I would do a 250 again if given the choice. More capacity in the rig--with the 1/2 ton, there often is little weight allowance for items in the cab or on the bed. Read all of the fine print about weight distribution etc. I used a weight distribution hitch on the first Ford expedition and it solved a trailer tire wear problem. That same rig towed the Tom Cat 255.
Also the trailer which is used is important. There is a specific LoadRite trailer, which is best. It has adequate capacity--many of the 25's come with a cheaper trailer (to be competitive from dealers cost wise.). Same with the Tom Cat--fortunately my Dealer on the Tom Cat knew what trailer was best.
I towed my first 25 with a Ford Expedition, 7.3 L Diesel 3/4 ton chassis. I towed my son's and my second 25 with a GMC Yukon Xl (same as chevy Suburban--1/2 ton. Even with the heavy duty tow package the Yukon overheated on the Grapevine in Calif.--and we had to stop about halfway up the grade. I also had to add air bags. Many of the earlier 1/2 tons will be overloaded.
There are many of the new 1/2 tons rated for over 10,000 lbs. But read all of the fine print. When it was time for a new truck--it was a Ford 250, 6,7 L Diesel--in retrospect I should have gotten the gas engine. It was a problem driving the truck around town--I had to take it out on the road to nowhere (I 10) to heat the exhaust enough to get the DEF to work. I would do a 250 again if given the choice. More capacity in the rig--with the 1/2 ton, there often is little weight allowance for items in the cab or on the bed. Read all of the fine print about weight distribution etc. I used a weight distribution hitch on the first Ford expedition and it solved a trailer tire wear problem. That same rig towed the Tom Cat 255.
Also the trailer which is used is important. There is a specific LoadRite trailer, which is best. It has adequate capacity--many of the 25's come with a cheaper trailer (to be competitive from dealers cost wise.). Same with the Tom Cat--fortunately my Dealer on the Tom Cat knew what trailer was best.
Donald Tyson
Member
Brakes, IMHO, should be on any trailer over 1000-1500lbs but in My state you rarely have brakes on trailers less that 3000lbs. My F150 is approved to tow a 7800 lb trailer. It has the nice towing package.
However it is not the Max Tow that ford makes for heavier trailers. I need to learn more about it. I'll have to figure out if heavier tires, springs and shocks are needed? How long will this truck perform if I do this all the time. I really don't want my Superduty back. Should the boat be adjusted according to tongue weight? Do I need a third axle?
However it is not the Max Tow that ford makes for heavier trailers. I need to learn more about it. I'll have to figure out if heavier tires, springs and shocks are needed? How long will this truck perform if I do this all the time. I really don't want my Superduty back. Should the boat be adjusted according to tongue weight? Do I need a third axle?
Yes boats should all be adjusted for tongue weight.
3rd axles do not reduce tongue weight--My position is only if the trailer cannot be found with 2 axles. The 3rd axle makes turning more difficult--more scrubbing of the tires. I had only one 3 axle trailer, and that boat was over 12,000 lbs. It came with a 3 axle trailer.
3rd axles do not reduce tongue weight--My position is only if the trailer cannot be found with 2 axles. The 3rd axle makes turning more difficult--more scrubbing of the tires. I had only one 3 axle trailer, and that boat was over 12,000 lbs. It came with a 3 axle trailer.
Avidmagnum12
Member
Don towing capacity is only one part of the equation. Payload is another part. Check out the tag by the drivers door. Tongue weight, people and any other items count toward payload. Only the manufacturer can set payload. Adding springs or other equipment will not increase payload or towing capacity.
Safety first.
I towed for about 6 years with an F150 with a 9600 lb. tow capacity. It was OK but the F250 with a 15,000 lb tow and 3300 lb payload we use now is a much better match for a heavier CD 25.
Our trailer is rated for 9600 lbs gross. You will find some 25’s will come with undersized trailers. It also has electric over hydraulic brakes and 10 ply 87 mph rated Goodyear Endurance tires. Not that I drive that fast.
Good luck on your search for a 25……it took me 2 years to find ours.
Safety first.
I towed for about 6 years with an F150 with a 9600 lb. tow capacity. It was OK but the F250 with a 15,000 lb tow and 3300 lb payload we use now is a much better match for a heavier CD 25.
Our trailer is rated for 9600 lbs gross. You will find some 25’s will come with undersized trailers. It also has electric over hydraulic brakes and 10 ply 87 mph rated Goodyear Endurance tires. Not that I drive that fast.
Good luck on your search for a 25……it took me 2 years to find ours.
colbysmith
Active member
I have a 2019 F150, with the 5.0L V8 and tow package. Truck is rated to pull 9700 lbs I believe. My 25 fully loaded weighs 8300, so I'm will within that weight. As Tom mentioned, you need to know all your other numbers as well. GVWR, RAWR, FAWR, GCVWR. Payload pretty much falls under the GCWR. I towed a 22 with a Toyota Highlander, that put me pretty much right up against the ratings. I have a little leeway with my F150 and my 25. I do have electric over hydraulic brakes on the trailer, and have had regular electric brakes on my trailers in the past. Either will do just fine in fresh water, but the EOH allows use of SS Disc brakes, which are definitely superior to regular electric drums. But cost more and are a bit more complicated. I have towed over the Rockies numerous times with no issue. I did install an after market system on the rear springs to help with the tongue weight of the 25. (I'd have to look up the name of it, but it's basically another horizontal coil spring that helps the pickup's leaf springs.) There are lower gears available, and recommended, for towing. However my truck came with the 3.31:1, standard ratio, which actually gives it great mileage when I'm not towing. About 21mpg. With the boat, I'm anywhere from 9.0 to 14.0 depending upon wind and terrain. Many will argue the preference of a larger truck. And you will get the "larger" ride with it. 
As long as you are aware of your specs and stay with in what the truck is rated for, it will do fine. Colby
As long as you are aware of your specs and stay with in what the truck is rated for, it will do fine. ColbyDonald Tyson
Member
Heavy landscape trailers, chippers and equipment I'm quite comfortable with. Understanding how to balance a trailer for tongue weight is paramount to a good ride and best tire wear. I know all that.
The reason I asked about suspension improvement would not be to increase the capacity of the suspension but rather to prevent over cycling of the existing suspension. When on back roads, and dippy country roads, a poorly loaded and adjusted trailer will porpoise and buck mercilessly. and it is so easy to adjust for that. A third axle has the potential to spread the load mor evenly and even out the dippy roads even better. This makes a difference mostly on bucking back roads, but also in the NE where our infrastructure is so worn event the open turnpikes and freeways dip heavily at every bridge overpass. A third axle helps there.
A child of the sixties we new how to make do with lighter trucks pulling heavy stuff long before there was a "trailer towing Package".
So I know sufficiently....probably.... how most of the dynamics of towing works.
The nature of the question was more like (and I should have been more specific):
-will the F150 have good enough wheel bearings. in other words
-are the axles free floating
-does the truck weigh enough, along with the 4wheel drive traction, to pull these heavier boats up wet ramps
-I have the tranny cooler and tow mode that changes the shifting detents. Plus I don't mind controlling stress on the whole system by slowing or downshifting on hills. Will I need to manage like this to haul a 25 long distances?
-will this Coyote 5ltr motor hold up?
The reason I asked about suspension improvement would not be to increase the capacity of the suspension but rather to prevent over cycling of the existing suspension. When on back roads, and dippy country roads, a poorly loaded and adjusted trailer will porpoise and buck mercilessly. and it is so easy to adjust for that. A third axle has the potential to spread the load mor evenly and even out the dippy roads even better. This makes a difference mostly on bucking back roads, but also in the NE where our infrastructure is so worn event the open turnpikes and freeways dip heavily at every bridge overpass. A third axle helps there.
A child of the sixties we new how to make do with lighter trucks pulling heavy stuff long before there was a "trailer towing Package".
So I know sufficiently....probably.... how most of the dynamics of towing works.
The nature of the question was more like (and I should have been more specific):
-will the F150 have good enough wheel bearings. in other words
-are the axles free floating
-does the truck weigh enough, along with the 4wheel drive traction, to pull these heavier boats up wet ramps
-I have the tranny cooler and tow mode that changes the shifting detents. Plus I don't mind controlling stress on the whole system by slowing or downshifting on hills. Will I need to manage like this to haul a 25 long distances?
-will this Coyote 5ltr motor hold up?
colbysmith
Active member
The aftermarket system I have is the Road Active System (RAS), and I’ve been very happy with it. I’ve got around 60k on my F150 now, much of that towing the 25. I think the 5.0 is holding up fine. I have rarely used 4 wheel drive on the ramps and when I have it’s been due to a slippery ramp. I think the weight of the F150 is just fine, but I tow at a reasonable speed of 65mph or less. The rearend has leaf springs and the front is independent suspension, I think. Can’t remember right now. I’m below my RAGW rating, and haven’t had any bearing issues. There has been two times I’ve climbed a crazy steep short hill with the 25 in tow and it pulled it. In summary, the Ford F150 can do just fine towing the Cd-25. Btw, I tow the 25 an average of 10,000 miles during the boating season, 15,000 last year! Taking it easy this year. That towing usually includes one or two west coast trips, a south east trip, several trips around the Great Lakes, and some local trips. I’m here to tell you the F150 can handle it. 
Colby
ColbyDonald Tyson
Member
Mr. Smith...I paid cash for my 2014 last year with 82,000 on it. I had gotten to the point where I couldn't take that straight axle Superduty for one more mile of Pennsylvanias crappy roads. The F150 was a huge ride difference with that independent front axle. I've done one trip to the west coast and have driven it all over the northeast. I plan to care for it and drive it a long way yet, but we'll see. I only get 15mpg everywhere. 15.2 on HWY. I wonder if something is wrong. I put 20000 on it and it is always 15-15.2. You probably have put more heavy tow miles on than most. Did you add any supplemental suspension?
I really like this little engine but The 6.2 that was in my Superduty was my favorite engine ever. While I like the diesels I don't feel like catering to them.
Thanks for your comments. I hope you keep posting about your adventures in that vehicle.
I really like this little engine but The 6.2 that was in my Superduty was my favorite engine ever. While I like the diesels I don't feel like catering to them.
Thanks for your comments. I hope you keep posting about your adventures in that vehicle.
I am towing a 25 with a newer 1/2 ton V8 truck rated to 9k+ lbs like others. Almost all of the miles on my truck are towing boats, but I don't get out as much as Colby!
Your questions:
- Your rear axle is not a "full floater" like the similar axle would be on a F-250.
- Slippery ramps have not been a problem, but I often use 4x4, and admittedly do not use extremely steep extremely slippery ramps.
- Use your tow mode, you will not need to do anything else.
- The 5.0 Coyote has similar HP/Torque as my truck and I consider it adequate in the mountains when the boat is loaded. Will it hold up is not a question anyone can answer. It is of course generally considered a reliable engine.
Three changes I made that helped a lot towing with a 1/2 ton truck:
1 - EoH brakes, which removed the jerking when in-town and are nice on hills, as well as worry-free backing.
2 - Adding Timbren SES extended/overload bump stops; inexpensive and a ten minute install. Reduced porpoising on bumps, generally feels much better when towing or heavy dump runs. This is similar to the idea behind the RAS suggested by colby.
3 - Getting weight off the boat; lighter batteries, filling up on the way to the ramp.
Your questions:
- Your rear axle is not a "full floater" like the similar axle would be on a F-250.
- Slippery ramps have not been a problem, but I often use 4x4, and admittedly do not use extremely steep extremely slippery ramps.
- Use your tow mode, you will not need to do anything else.
- The 5.0 Coyote has similar HP/Torque as my truck and I consider it adequate in the mountains when the boat is loaded. Will it hold up is not a question anyone can answer. It is of course generally considered a reliable engine.
Three changes I made that helped a lot towing with a 1/2 ton truck:
1 - EoH brakes, which removed the jerking when in-town and are nice on hills, as well as worry-free backing.
2 - Adding Timbren SES extended/overload bump stops; inexpensive and a ten minute install. Reduced porpoising on bumps, generally feels much better when towing or heavy dump runs. This is similar to the idea behind the RAS suggested by colby.
3 - Getting weight off the boat; lighter batteries, filling up on the way to the ramp.
colbysmith
Active member
The RAS I mentioned earlier. I did have the Timbrens on my 2016 F150, but the RAS I put on my 2019 seems to be far superior to the Timbrens. The Timbrens were basically a heavy duty hollow core rubber "bumper" that fit above the leaf springs. The truck can squat on those which then act like an additional spring. Whereas the RAS is a coil spring that stiffens the leaf springs allowing them to give more support. They will cause the rear end to be somewhat jacked up with no tongue weight, but then do their job when the rear end is loaded down with the trailer tongue. All depends on how much adjustment you put into the RAS, which is another advantage over the Timbrens. Colby
Donald Tyson
Member
Thanks for the info, and to confirm Colby's experience. I'm used to being loaded or overloaded, having come from the logging/treecare/farm background. But for the last 22yrs I've only been a saleman (with a little drift boat...so I needed to hear all of this.
I sure like the little engine in this truck so far. Service is being kept up well. I do very little of my own work on vehicles. My local dealer does most.
I Doubt I will cross the mountains more than once out and once back. I want to see the Sac Delta, Coeur d'lane, Lake Powell and everything east. Don't even tell me about Washington and Alaska. I'm not terribly old but, having lived in and climbed the Costal Redwoods(Eureka) in my younger day I don't ever want to be that cold and wet, weeks and weeks on end, ever again.
I'm loving the f150 but it is licensed and rated to tow 7800lbs. So, I suspect that the only way I'll actually be legal is with the cheaper/lighter trailer. In PA at least they don't weigh you. They look at the wight you're legal for and then look up whet the boat weighs, and the truck is legal for and then fine you if you're over. It can get expensive.
Any thoughts on this?
I sure like the little engine in this truck so far. Service is being kept up well. I do very little of my own work on vehicles. My local dealer does most.
I Doubt I will cross the mountains more than once out and once back. I want to see the Sac Delta, Coeur d'lane, Lake Powell and everything east. Don't even tell me about Washington and Alaska. I'm not terribly old but, having lived in and climbed the Costal Redwoods(Eureka) in my younger day I don't ever want to be that cold and wet, weeks and weeks on end, ever again.
I'm loving the f150 but it is licensed and rated to tow 7800lbs. So, I suspect that the only way I'll actually be legal is with the cheaper/lighter trailer. In PA at least they don't weigh you. They look at the wight you're legal for and then look up whet the boat weighs, and the truck is legal for and then fine you if you're over. It can get expensive.
Any thoughts on this?
I hauled a CD26 with a 2014 Ram 1500 5.7? V8 Hemi 4x4. Majority of the time it was
more than adequate. Wanted more pizzaz in the mountains. 4x4 helped on steep
slippery ramps (and Michigan winters). Hydraulic suspension automatically leveled
tandem trailer w/surge brakes. Back up camera made zeroing ball into hitch a snap.
If cash is no object for you, I'd get the same with bigger cubic inch gas or diesel V8.
Aye.
more than adequate. Wanted more pizzaz in the mountains. 4x4 helped on steep
slippery ramps (and Michigan winters). Hydraulic suspension automatically leveled
tandem trailer w/surge brakes. Back up camera made zeroing ball into hitch a snap.
If cash is no object for you, I'd get the same with bigger cubic inch gas or diesel V8.
Aye.
Donald Tyson
Member
Foggy, My Mom always told me "you hear fine but you just don't listen....she had a lot of sayings regarding me.
Foggy":2gky8jnd said:
Donald Tyson
Member
Ha Ha! yup.
Foggy":1n58rfax said: