composting toilet
- Thread starter moabarch
- Start date
patrick and linda
New member
hello tom,
so, when i first read your post, i'm thinking, who wants to compost poo, and pray tell what would they do with all that compost poo?
i've looked at the installation of the airhead compost toilet and just can't see why one would swap out a perfectly functioning marine head for something like this. compost poo gets my thumb's down.
good luck with your decision.
best regards
pat
so, when i first read your post, i'm thinking, who wants to compost poo, and pray tell what would they do with all that compost poo?
i've looked at the installation of the airhead compost toilet and just can't see why one would swap out a perfectly functioning marine head for something like this. compost poo gets my thumb's down.
good luck with your decision.
best regards
pat
patrick and linda":228n07z9 said:
When Pat & Patty sign on about the subject you will "hear" nothing but good about the airhead. If I were ever to purchase a vessel with a head the Airhead would definitely be my choice based on the satisfaction that Pat & Patty have expressed about theirs. It really seems to be no hassle and the elimination of a "through hull" is another plus.
Pat Anderson
New member
Indeed, the standard marine head is stinky and tends to spew ##!** all over owners sooner or later when something gets clogged. The stories about that here are legion. The fresh water flush tank under models are certainly better, but the problem is, sooner or later you have to pump it out, and it just might be full when a pump out is not convenient. And as to odor, ask David on Anna Leigh when we are side by side at the dock which one smells worse, our Airhead or his marine toilet. Not a contest really.
The Airhead design has a liquid tank and a solid container. It composts very well, we only need to empty the solids container about once a year. A year's worth of composted "poo" looks like soil, and is perhaps 3 gallons in volume. I probably would not dig it in to the vegetable garden but I would have no qualms about digging it in to a flower bed. The liquid tank of course we empty overboard when it is full, but actually urine is sanitary, and it is not a problem.
Getting an Airhead from the git-go was a great choice for us. I don't know how anybody could have an opinion about it without knowing anything about it...
The Airhead design has a liquid tank and a solid container. It composts very well, we only need to empty the solids container about once a year. A year's worth of composted "poo" looks like soil, and is perhaps 3 gallons in volume. I probably would not dig it in to the vegetable garden but I would have no qualms about digging it in to a flower bed. The liquid tank of course we empty overboard when it is full, but actually urine is sanitary, and it is not a problem.
Getting an Airhead from the git-go was a great choice for us. I don't know how anybody could have an opinion about it without knowing anything about it...
Pat Anderson
New member
Don't know about that, we told the factory to leave out the marine head when they were building Daydream in 2005, which they did and gave us a credit. We bought and installed the Airhead ourselves after taking delivery. The only other C-Dory with an Airhead we knew of before reading the prior post was a 25 Cruise Ship that Marc Grove had in rental service at Wefings some years back, I suppose that must have been a retrofit, but you might want to PM Wefings about that. One recommendation I would have is to up the size of the fan and run it off a dedicated small battery like a motorcycle battery with a solar panel to keep the charge up. That fan runs 24/7, and it is OK if you are on shore power all the time, but if for any reason you lose charging and the fan keeps running, even at 80ma it is going to run the house battery down. That has happened to us, and I am eyeballing the Harbor Freight 15 watt panel to dedicate to the Airhead fan. Also I think a larger fan would promote even better composting.
moabarch":325zxb3x said:
Captains Cat
New member
Hard to tell. How well do you deal with shxx? :cry
I would think the hardest thing would be removing the holding tank. Not sure how it's mounted in a 25, whether it is accessable. Of course you could always just cap it off and leave it in place. Be a shame to give up that room though. Be a lot easier to take out a holding tank head than to put one in where none existed before. No need to remove fittings, unless you want to..
JMHO
Charlie
I would think the hardest thing would be removing the holding tank. Not sure how it's mounted in a 25, whether it is accessable. Of course you could always just cap it off and leave it in place. Be a shame to give up that room though. Be a lot easier to take out a holding tank head than to put one in where none existed before. No need to remove fittings, unless you want to..
JMHO
Charlie
Pat Anderson
New member
Our holding tank is under the motorwell between the battery compartments on either side. It has never had shxx in it, and another mod we need to make is to install a third vertical hatch cover and cut out the top of the holding tank, which would be a terrific large dry storage area. Just inertia has kept this from happening (and fear of power tools of course), have already bought the hatch cover. Otherwise perhaps sanitizing, capping off and leaving in place would be OK I would think.
Captains Cat":1husqmn5 said:
patrick and linda
New member
hi tom,
reading your original post you mentioned your goal was to replace the factory installed head. on the 25' i just assumed that would be a marine head, consisting of overboard discharge including a thru hull. with that in mind i didn't understand the logic in this swap out.
so, i guess the factory deal was not a typical marine head. at any rate, isn't boating great, it keeps us busy, helps us stay gainfully employed and allows us the opportunity to modify, create, repair and swap out what ever we want!
best regards
pat
reading your original post you mentioned your goal was to replace the factory installed head. on the 25' i just assumed that would be a marine head, consisting of overboard discharge including a thru hull. with that in mind i didn't understand the logic in this swap out.
so, i guess the factory deal was not a typical marine head. at any rate, isn't boating great, it keeps us busy, helps us stay gainfully employed and allows us the opportunity to modify, create, repair and swap out what ever we want!
best regards
pat
Try that "dumping the urine overboard" in places like the Florida Keys, Yellowstone Lake, Lake Tahoe, and other great cruising waters that have some sort of "no effluent" rules... and tell us how that works out for you.
I have no beef with the Airhead, but it is the "right tool" for the weekend user, not necessarily the extended cruiser. Reports on cruiser forums that I've read have been less than enthusiastic about it for daily use over a long period. If I understand it correctly, you have a certain amount of space and you need time for the Airhead to do it's "work." Overload it and what are the consequences? Also, does yours use the "coffee filters" to separate the solids from the liquids? One more thing to deal with. And having been next to a sailboat with an Airhead, I can attest to the fact that there is some smell that comes from the solar vent they used on theirs.
Not dissing the Airhead, just saying that each system has its pros and cons. We all poop, and we all have to deal with it. I am NOT a fan of the vaccu-flush type systems that use sea water... almost a guarantee that you are going to have stink and crappy maintenance situations with hoses. I have no issue at all with a porta-potty other than capacity. And, again, some places (like the Keys and areas in Canada) require that you have it mounted AND some way to pump it out. It may depend on the length of your stay, as well.
For our use, the SeaLand set up that the factory used/uses(?) that operates with a fresh water flush has worked well. It's essentially a larger capacity, permanently mounted porta-potty. No sea water, no dead critters in the hoses. Put a ball valve on the fresh water hose to the toilet and you can greatly increase your time between pump-outs. Most marinas, marine parks, etc are equipped for boats with a pump out. Get offshore and you can turn on the macerator. We use the RV stuff (non-formaldehyde) to help dissolve and deordorize... pretty painless. Most of the time, I don't give a lot of thought to the potty process... a good sign that what we're doing works for us.
We all do it; even if you think yours doesn't stink, it does; and you find your best way to deal with it. It's a part of life... and cruising. To me, the worst thing would be trying to cruise and have NO place to potty. We have no bathrooms on the cruise boats that I am driving this summer. The cruises are 90 minutes in length, and we make SEVERAL announcements before we board passengers, with an emphasis on the fact that there are no bathrooms on the boat. Yes, it has been a situation that has had to be dealt with at times. So, pick the system you like and get out there!
Best wishes,
Jim B.
I have no beef with the Airhead, but it is the "right tool" for the weekend user, not necessarily the extended cruiser. Reports on cruiser forums that I've read have been less than enthusiastic about it for daily use over a long period. If I understand it correctly, you have a certain amount of space and you need time for the Airhead to do it's "work." Overload it and what are the consequences? Also, does yours use the "coffee filters" to separate the solids from the liquids? One more thing to deal with. And having been next to a sailboat with an Airhead, I can attest to the fact that there is some smell that comes from the solar vent they used on theirs.
Not dissing the Airhead, just saying that each system has its pros and cons. We all poop, and we all have to deal with it. I am NOT a fan of the vaccu-flush type systems that use sea water... almost a guarantee that you are going to have stink and crappy maintenance situations with hoses. I have no issue at all with a porta-potty other than capacity. And, again, some places (like the Keys and areas in Canada) require that you have it mounted AND some way to pump it out. It may depend on the length of your stay, as well.
For our use, the SeaLand set up that the factory used/uses(?) that operates with a fresh water flush has worked well. It's essentially a larger capacity, permanently mounted porta-potty. No sea water, no dead critters in the hoses. Put a ball valve on the fresh water hose to the toilet and you can greatly increase your time between pump-outs. Most marinas, marine parks, etc are equipped for boats with a pump out. Get offshore and you can turn on the macerator. We use the RV stuff (non-formaldehyde) to help dissolve and deordorize... pretty painless. Most of the time, I don't give a lot of thought to the potty process... a good sign that what we're doing works for us.
We all do it; even if you think yours doesn't stink, it does; and you find your best way to deal with it. It's a part of life... and cruising. To me, the worst thing would be trying to cruise and have NO place to potty. We have no bathrooms on the cruise boats that I am driving this summer. The cruises are 90 minutes in length, and we make SEVERAL announcements before we board passengers, with an emphasis on the fact that there are no bathrooms on the boat. Yes, it has been a situation that has had to be dealt with at times. So, pick the system you like and get out there!
Best wishes,
Jim B.
patrick and linda
New member
hi jim,
aboard my boat we have a vacuum flush head, using fresh water only. has a 28 gallon holding tank and easily pumped out at the pump out station. wouldn't have it any other way.
can't understand the logic in no head aboard a cruise ship that has a 90 minute cruise. my bladder is the size of a golf ball and when i got to go, brother, i got to go, end of story. i have taken 90 minute trips aboard 40' pontoon type cruise ships, but they had provided a porta-potty type head, designed for people just like me!
hope all is trending well in your neck of the woods.
best regards
pat
aboard my boat we have a vacuum flush head, using fresh water only. has a 28 gallon holding tank and easily pumped out at the pump out station. wouldn't have it any other way.
can't understand the logic in no head aboard a cruise ship that has a 90 minute cruise. my bladder is the size of a golf ball and when i got to go, brother, i got to go, end of story. i have taken 90 minute trips aboard 40' pontoon type cruise ships, but they had provided a porta-potty type head, designed for people just like me!
hope all is trending well in your neck of the woods.
best regards
pat
We now own the 25' CS Marc Grove used to rent. An advantage of the Air Head is obvious when you boat on rivers and lakes with no pumpout facilities like we often do. The Air Head on this boat seems to be original equipment since I can find no evidence of a patched through-hull. I think that neither toilet arrangement is worth the stuff it's supposed to contain, but they're both better than porta-potties. You might get in touch with Marc for more info, I think he has installed them on Rangers too.
First of all it great to associated with toilets .But I guess its better than no association at all !
The Airhead is simple , effective and even in the deep humid south works just fine . The coffee filters are not for solid/liquid separation [good old gravity does that], just for making a clean transfer into the magic composting portion of the unit.
They are called "carriers" .Solar is great on any boat and will easily replace the power that the 24/7 fan uses and more.
Ill take the computer fan replacement job over the macerator replacement or hose replacement job any day!As a bonus ,the constant negative pressure in the cabin keeps the mold down and things drier . Pumping out every 9 gallons seems like a PITA to me . Going 6 Mos. to a year for a average couple or a month of constant use sounds pretty good . With very little planning you can never worry about the pumpout , and the liquid dumpout can be done in any restroom if you are in a place you cant simply go out the cabin door . There are many more restrooms than pumpouts .
As to replacement units, many of the 25s and Tomcats have the Sealand Porta Potti on steroids like Jim's. Its self contained except for the macerator plumbing and water supply . The tank is above deck . No major surgery required, pretty much an out patient procedure on alot of them .
Jeff , the owner of Airhead , has made a few improvements over the years and the new units are pretty spiffy now . I would certainly use them in Ranger Tugs IF I could get the factory to use the extra freed up tankage for water or fuel . When the right customer comes along Ill lobby for that . I am working with a watermaker guy here locally [intriguing stuff] so the extra fuel would be my vote for the extra tank .
The original mid 90s 25 Cruise ships had regular porta pottis .
We installed the airhead,the shower sump and floor ,the water heater, the extra flexi tank for the shower and the new electrical system on the 'Tide"
Marc
The Airhead is simple , effective and even in the deep humid south works just fine . The coffee filters are not for solid/liquid separation [good old gravity does that], just for making a clean transfer into the magic composting portion of the unit.
They are called "carriers" .Solar is great on any boat and will easily replace the power that the 24/7 fan uses and more.
Ill take the computer fan replacement job over the macerator replacement or hose replacement job any day!As a bonus ,the constant negative pressure in the cabin keeps the mold down and things drier . Pumping out every 9 gallons seems like a PITA to me . Going 6 Mos. to a year for a average couple or a month of constant use sounds pretty good . With very little planning you can never worry about the pumpout , and the liquid dumpout can be done in any restroom if you are in a place you cant simply go out the cabin door . There are many more restrooms than pumpouts .
As to replacement units, many of the 25s and Tomcats have the Sealand Porta Potti on steroids like Jim's. Its self contained except for the macerator plumbing and water supply . The tank is above deck . No major surgery required, pretty much an out patient procedure on alot of them .
Jeff , the owner of Airhead , has made a few improvements over the years and the new units are pretty spiffy now . I would certainly use them in Ranger Tugs IF I could get the factory to use the extra freed up tankage for water or fuel . When the right customer comes along Ill lobby for that . I am working with a watermaker guy here locally [intriguing stuff] so the extra fuel would be my vote for the extra tank .
The original mid 90s 25 Cruise ships had regular porta pottis .
We installed the airhead,the shower sump and floor ,the water heater, the extra flexi tank for the shower and the new electrical system on the 'Tide"
Marc
Pat Anderson
New member
Yeah, Marc said most of what I would have said in reply to Jim. As to extended cruising, Daydream was out five weeks on the Alaska cruise with three people aboard, and the Airhead handled that just great. It really does seem like magic the way it keeps reducing in the solids container. As Marc said the coffee filter has nothing to do with liquid/solids separation, that is handled by the design, where liquids go forward, solids go straight down. The solids container really does get emptied just once a year on our boat.
As to dumping liquid overboard, I probably would not want to argue with an overzealous park ranger but urine really is a sterile liquid, and would not, from a scientific standpoint, violate a "no discharge" rule. Here is the Wikipedia entry for "Urine."
Urine
Urine is a sterile, liquid by-product of the body that is secreted by the kidneys through a process called urination and excreted through the urethra. Cellular metabolism generates numerous by-products, many rich in nitrogen, that require elimination from the bloodstream. These by-products are eventually expelled from the body in a process known as micturition, the primary method for excreting water-soluble chemicals from the body. These chemicals can be detected and analyzed by urinalysis. Amniotic fluid is closely related to urine, and can be analyzed by amniocentesis.
The Airhead tank capacity for urine is probably three-four days, longer if the guy pees overboard! That isn't illegal, is it Jim? We have not cruised on those lakes, but would not hesitate to do so, we could always take the tank ashore to empty I suppose, it is easy to remove and has a cap. And urine really is just water, all the pollutants are in the solids, not that I am advocating it, but if you were stranded in the desert or some remote mountain pass, you could drink it if you had to.
Correct on the fact that there is some odor emanating from the exhaust vent. But it is barely detectable, and nobody at any of the CBGTs has ever even turned a head walking by or boat! We are starting to have some interior "issues" which I think might be related to losing a good seal between solids container and exhaust hose, I have to work on that I think. I wonder if that is one of the parts that Geoff Trott has improved?
Anyway, I agree with Jim, whatever floats your boat, I would not have a problem with a fresh water flush tank-under marine head, it is just the seawater flush with long shxx hose runs to the big holding tank that have been problematic, and if you like yours, more power to you. Composting heads are however a legitimate option, and I just take exception to people who know nothing about them dismissing them out of hand.
As to dumping liquid overboard, I probably would not want to argue with an overzealous park ranger but urine really is a sterile liquid, and would not, from a scientific standpoint, violate a "no discharge" rule. Here is the Wikipedia entry for "Urine."
Urine
Urine is a sterile, liquid by-product of the body that is secreted by the kidneys through a process called urination and excreted through the urethra. Cellular metabolism generates numerous by-products, many rich in nitrogen, that require elimination from the bloodstream. These by-products are eventually expelled from the body in a process known as micturition, the primary method for excreting water-soluble chemicals from the body. These chemicals can be detected and analyzed by urinalysis. Amniotic fluid is closely related to urine, and can be analyzed by amniocentesis.
The Airhead tank capacity for urine is probably three-four days, longer if the guy pees overboard! That isn't illegal, is it Jim? We have not cruised on those lakes, but would not hesitate to do so, we could always take the tank ashore to empty I suppose, it is easy to remove and has a cap. And urine really is just water, all the pollutants are in the solids, not that I am advocating it, but if you were stranded in the desert or some remote mountain pass, you could drink it if you had to.
Correct on the fact that there is some odor emanating from the exhaust vent. But it is barely detectable, and nobody at any of the CBGTs has ever even turned a head walking by or boat! We are starting to have some interior "issues" which I think might be related to losing a good seal between solids container and exhaust hose, I have to work on that I think. I wonder if that is one of the parts that Geoff Trott has improved?
Anyway, I agree with Jim, whatever floats your boat, I would not have a problem with a fresh water flush tank-under marine head, it is just the seawater flush with long shxx hose runs to the big holding tank that have been problematic, and if you like yours, more power to you. Composting heads are however a legitimate option, and I just take exception to people who know nothing about them dismissing them out of hand.
After getting a PM from my buddy, Pat, I just want to publicly clarify that I am not putting down anyone's choice of potty. In the land of the free and the home of the brave, it is your constitutional (get it? :wink: ) right to poop in the container of your choice. After decades of using RV and boat potties, going to a dump station or pump out is just part of the process. But, by golly, I will support to the death your right to have a porta-potty, AirHead, vacu-flush, or SeaLand fresh water flush. 'Cause if you don't poop, you will eventually explode, and that won't be good for you or the resale of your boat.
Just let me say, again publicly, if you (and that's the "royal" you, not directed at anyone in particular) think your s**t don't stink, then you have never pooped in a small boat. How anyone handles it is a personal choice. Po-tay-to, po-tah-to... unless you dump it overboard after each "session", we all carry a bit of poo around. If the system you use works, then that's what you should stay with. I don't think my crapper is better than your crapper, and I completely understand that each system has its pros and cons. This isn't like dissing West Texas or saying GM is better than Dodge... this is some serious s**t we're talking about here! :twisted:
And as I told my buddy Pat - give your particular potty a hug from us and take one for yourself.
Best wishes,
Jim
Just let me say, again publicly, if you (and that's the "royal" you, not directed at anyone in particular) think your s**t don't stink, then you have never pooped in a small boat. How anyone handles it is a personal choice. Po-tay-to, po-tah-to... unless you dump it overboard after each "session", we all carry a bit of poo around. If the system you use works, then that's what you should stay with. I don't think my crapper is better than your crapper, and I completely understand that each system has its pros and cons. This isn't like dissing West Texas or saying GM is better than Dodge... this is some serious s**t we're talking about here! :twisted:
And as I told my buddy Pat - give your particular potty a hug from us and take one for yourself.
Best wishes,
Jim