What would you like to see on the new C-Ranger R25 tug?

S

Seaboldski

New member
First, let me say that I think the C*Ranger R25 is going to be a winner! The designers have really packed a lot of practical (and economical) cruising and living capability into a relatively small boat. It’s a head turner too. I’m sure owners will learn to expect a lot of questions anytime they pull into a marina (yes, my wife and I bought one :D ).

After spending three days at the Seattle Boat Show discussing the R25 with salespeople and prospective buyers, I decided to make a list of the areas of concern that I heard expressed by those looking over the prototype hull on display. I know there are a lot of sharp people here, maybe we can help the C-Dory Marine Group with some good feedback as to how they can make what looks to be a great boat even better.

Here is a list of concerns, followed in some cases by suggested fixes

1) V-berth: Too short. This is a major concern for us! This boat is too good to have an undersized main berth. Berth must be designed for two 6 ft tall adults. Make both consoles like the port side with the filler cushion going straight across (no jog)? Raising the height of the berth would increase the area as well, but I’m not sure how much you would gain.

2) “Mouse fur” in V-berth area: Hard to keep clean and stain free. Use spray on insulation to prevent condensation with a top coat of ‘speckle paint’? Break this up visually with teak shelves with reading lights?

3) Galley counter top: Prefer Formica type laminate on top of the fiberglass.

4) Galley table: Teak tabletop, although nice looking, is not as maintenance free as a laminate with teak trim would be. Add teak and holly flooring to the dinette area (for visual ‘warmth’) and use laminate on the table top and counter?

5) Console heights - both sides: Hard to tell without the seating installed, but both consoles seem a bit high for good visibility for anyone under 6 ft. This will not make the wives happy.

6) Sink in head: Must have clearance between faucet(s) and hull/bulkhead for operation and cleaning. If sink isn’t round, it should also be angled to face occupant (as the C*Ranger drawing indicates). Could a single lever faucet be used, possible mounted to the counter to the left of the sink, or on the aft bulkhead itself, above and to the right of the sink (clearing counter space)?

7) “Midship stateroom” entrance: Should have somewhat of a ‘lip’ across the bottom of the entrance to keep water that gets into the cabin from entering.
Cabin door (or “Dutch door”) at the helm: Seen on some tugs, would make single handed docking easier.

8 ) Windage in rough seas. Center of gravity. A/B ratio: I’m just repeating what I’ve heard here, and I don’t know enough to comment on this one way or another.

OK, you new R25 owners, jump in!

Steve
 
Oops, this should have been a seperate item:

Cabin door (or “Dutch door”) at the helm: Seen on some tugs, would make single handed docking easier.
 
Having spent a great deal of time on my buddys' 24' Murphy Alaskan trader over the last two yrs I have a couple of observations. Overall interior is very well laid out. Swim step is a big plus. Nice place to stash a cooler when fishing or cruising. The walk thru to the swim step is another big plus. No door from helm to outside... Biiiiig negative. I wouldn't want to try to dock this thing and have to run out the aft end of the cabin to tie it up. My prediction is if that isn't fixed by first delivery it will be by next yr. A single inboard with a rudder is a pig at low speed in the slip compared with an outboard or IO. It is routine for us to jump out of the helm door onto the dock to secure her. Without the door I sure would not enjoy docking or trailering this boat single handed. I'm very very sure that there are much better boat handlers out there that will diagree with me but that is just MHO based on 2 yrs with a very similar boat.
Norm
 
Seems to me a lot of cost could be cut by mounting a well or bracket on the back so outboard power could be used. Simply use the same tanks, hoses, etc. More options and affordability means more sales.
 
Re: No door from helm to outside
Norm, yes, the 24' Murphy Alaskan trader looks very similar indeed. http://www.trawlersmidwest.com/images/M ... chure1.jpg (1.9MB image)
I see they’re using the Dutch door approach. Nice looking boat. I see it has 27” to 30” of draft. How did your buddy like it’s handling in rough water?

I’m ogling that 6’ 4” “queen size double berth”. Nice! The foam floatation isn’t a bad idea either. :wink:
 
Flagold,
Seems to me a lot of cost could be cut by mounting a well or bracket on the back so outboard power could be used. Simply use the same tanks, hoses, etc. More options and affordability means more sales.
Click to expand...

I hear you on the cost issue. Although you could save on the cost of the bow and stern trusters, I'm not so sure outboards would be a good idea for this boat. As it sits now you have a 500 lb engine sitting low and fairly well centered in a hull with 26" of draft. If you remove that and hang 450 - 900 lbs on brackets (fairly high up) off the stern, you would have to do some major rearranging to get the weight distribution right again.

Engine_room_1.sized.jpg

4 cyl, 4 valve heads, 80 amp alternator, 500 lbs

Engine_room_2.sized.jpg

Engine access

More C-Ranger R25 tug pics in my album, if anyone is interested.
 
Looking at those pics (and thanx for posting them!), it would seem to me a 3 part head door might be able to allow extra cabin entry and passage room when the head is unoccupied. I am thinking maybe two 3 inch, piano hinged side panels that would allow that door to be 'inset' when empty, or 'outset' when the head is in use. That would allow more room also for the 'bathroomee' to change clothes, etc. John
 
Seaboldski, et. al., maybe you could answer some questions, having already seen that hull up close: Does the skeg protect the prop? I mean is the prop tucked up enough that some part of the hull ahead is beneath it? And, having only had experience with the old stuffing box type drives, how does the Ranger 25 solve this thru the hull drive waterproofing problem?

Regarding the 'Dutch Door', that other tug is a significantly different design in this area, the gunwale is much lower, providing room for such a double door. Maybe, though, a sliding or otherwise opening large window and a few teak footholds would allow the pilot to exit this area.

I had a 29 foot houseboat with no exit at the helm, but learned to keep fore and aft lines at the large window so I could just hook or loop a piling while passing by and then throw the helm over in F or R to tuck the boat up against the dock or pilings. If the windo opening were large enough reach thru, that ought to solve that problem. John
 
Also, regarding the apparently hinged teak step engine access door, it would allow greater engine access and visability if the step were secured by a couple of vertical, fixed pins, so one could simply lift the step vertically off position and set it aside whilst cleaning, maintaining the engine compartment. John
 
Regarding increasing front berth area: In addition to cutting out the hanging locker as you suggest, (although perhaps some steering or control lines might prohibit that), the raised height has been done before. The old Marine Traders (even over 40 foot) had a front bunk so high that small teak steps were needed to climb up into it. If my memory is correct, the bunk was at almost ribcage height as one stood in the center pit. I don't have the definitive answer to this problem for sure. May be too difficult for some to climb up, but it looks like one is stepping down initially, so if the center plug was in place, one would be stepping down to the bunk for sleeping, while still allowing the plug to be removed and standing room for changing. Alot of ideas from someone who has never seen the hull in person! John
 
Looking at those pics (and thanx for posting them!), it would seem to me a 3 part head door might be able to allow extra cabin entry and passage room when the head is unoccupied. I am thinking maybe two 3 inch, piano hinged side panels that would allow that door to be 'inset' when empty, or 'outset' when the head is in use. That would allow more room also for the 'bathroomee' to change clothes, etc. John
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You’re welcome! Just trying to get the input of the experienced boaters here for ideas on the new boat.
So the offset would take place in the hinge itself? Is there a brand-X boat out there that has a similar arrangement that you could point me to as an example? The wife would like to see a mount on the wall for the flexible shower hose as well, but that may already be planned.

Seaboldski, et. al., maybe you could answer some questions, having already seen that hull up close: Does the skeg protect the prop? I mean is the prop tucked up enough that some part of the hull ahead is beneath it? And, having only had experience with the old stuffing box type drives, how does the Ranger 25 solve this thru the hull drive waterproofing problem?
Click to expand...

On your first question, yes the skeg runs all the way aft (contains no ballast) and protects the prop. The bronze prop itself (16X17 RH) is semi-submerged in a ‘well’ (is that the correct nautical term - I’m not one of the experienced boaters here :? ). Neither of the hulls at the show had the rudder mounted, but I would assume it will be similar to the rudder on the R21. I uploaded a pic of that to the album.

I did not ask about the stuffing box and all that’s visible is shown in the pic of the engine bay I uploaded earlier.

Regarding the 'Dutch Door', that other tug is a significantly different design in this area, the gunwale is much lower, providing room for such a double door. Maybe, though, a sliding or otherwise opening large window and a few teak footholds would allow the pilot to exit this area.I had a 29 foot houseboat with no exit at the helm, but learned to keep fore and aft lines at the large window so I could just hook or loop a piling while passing by and then throw the helm over in F or R to tuck the boat up against the dock or pilings. If the windo opening were large enough reach thru, that ought to solve that problem. John
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A few others suggested the same thing (looping a piling from the window). Adding a Dutch door would also add cost. I sure this will be an area they give attention when they have the top on the boat and do some testing.

Also, regarding the apparently hinged teak step engine access door, it would allow greater engine access and visability if the step were secured by a couple of vertical, fixed pins, so one could simply lift the step vertically off position and set it aside whilst cleaning, maintaining the engine compartment. John
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Great idea! Easy too. It would be nice if the step piece went all the way back to the engine hatch so that when it was removed, the engine was totally accessible from the top. The fiberglass cross piece that is between the two is probably structural though, so that might not be possible.

Regarding increasing front berth area: In addition to cutting out the hanging locker as you suggest, (although perhaps some steering or control lines might prohibit that), the raised height has been done before. The old Marine Traders (even over 40 foot) had a front bunk so high that small teak steps were needed to climb up into it. If my memory is correct, the bunk was at almost ribcage height as one stood in the center pit. I don't have the definitive answer to this problem for sure. May be too difficult for some to climb up, but it looks like one is stepping down initially, so if the center plug was in place, one would be stepping down to the bunk for sleeping, while still allowing the plug to be removed and standing room for changing. A lot of ideas from someone who has never seen the hull in person! John
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Good ideas, John, for someone who has never seen the hull in person! Yes the V-berth size has to be addressed. I’m 5’11” and my wife is 5’ 8”, and we can’t stretch out. There are a lot of folks out there taller than us. I think the room is there, things just need to be tweaked.
 
The other day it was a lot easier to view the new tug. Today I am unable to find the photos from the Seattle show that showed not only some cabin shots but thye hull as well. Please point me in the right direction. Mike on Huda Thunkit
 
Some of the photos are on the first page of the 2006 SBSCBGT album which is the first album in the Cruises and Events photo section. This will get you there. Steve has a lot more in his album, as noted (thanks Steve!).

We need more photos for sure. Maybe Jeff or someone at the factory will post the progress pictures in the factory album like they did for the 255 TomCat. That would be cool, no?
 
OK John, I just ran across a pic that I had taken at the show of the prop area and skeg on the R25 . Shows the underside of the swim step with ladder, and the beautiful glass work. Check it out.
 
Wouldn't that be great, if some beam under the step opening could allow full open access to the engine? Having had several inboards in the past, I always look for dual access... one hole for the hands and tools, and another opening for the eyes to see what the hands are doing.

I know of no boats having tri-fold doors, but campers and motorhomes have alot, although they are designed to open and close only in one shape. Three 5-8 inch panels would allow the bather alot of room and the passageway alot of room.

Most campers and motorhomes and my boats have included a common faucet/shower tube head unit, so no problems on the shower head to my knowledge.

thanks,John
 
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