What did I do wrong? What should I do in the future?

G

Gratitude

New member
Last weekend while heading offshore to Anacapa Island, and while in the Shipping Lane, I was on a collision course with a Large Container Ship. I chose to slow down, and wait for it to pass in front of me. The Container Ship was putting off a substantial wake - maybe 4'. Since I was previously heading into the swells I had my bow down before the Container Ship became and issue. I did not change the trim, and headed into the Ships wake on a 45 degree angle. Then it happened. After the C-Dory Cruiser came over the top of the wake it broached a lot, went on an extreme angle, stuff that was on the counter fell to the floor, and it really scared my friend and me.

After we cleaned up the mess, I regrouped, and changed the bow angle from down to up, and headed on a 45 degree angle into the ships smaller wake heading away from the Container Ship. All went well, and after I went over the top of the Container Ships wake the C-Dory accelerated from about 15 mph to about 23 mph, without incident.

I am embarrassed with this, and hope to never have to go through something like this again. I welcome all comments and suggestions.

As an aside when I see pictures of C-Dory's crossing the Columbia River Bar in huge swells, I am curious what trim the boat would be in?

Thank you for your time.

Gratitude (Jim)
 
Glad you made it, man! Swells are long period and until they reach shallow water, not very steep, hence less of a problem for small vessels. OTOH, the bow wake off a freighter can be very steep, especially fresh off the bow. Farther away, less steep.

BTW, 15 knots going into one of those bruisers might be a bit much, even at an angle.
 
AstoriaDave":26i7ejze said:
Glad you made it, man! Swells are long period and until they reach shallow water, not very steep, hence less of a problem for small vessels. OTOH, the bow wake off a freighter can be very steep, especially fresh off the bow. Farther away, less steep.

BTW, 15 knots going into one of those bruisers might be a bit much, even at an angle.
Click to expand...

Yep. agree.... :thup
 
Two words - slow down. As was alluded to above, 15kts is faster than you should be going for steep stuff. Also, if I can see a large wake/wave coming, I turn into and take it at a 90 degree angle. The 45 degree thing is IMHO a compromise that I use when I want to make time against waves that are somewhat predictable.
 
Gratitude,
I had the same type of experience. Now I raise my trim tabs and slow down.
My hearing couldn't take the screaming of the spousal unit if I slammed into another large wake again. She gave me the look that she usually reserves for breaking up dog fights, once was enough.
The waves that got me were from a Trident sub. The bow waves were not too bad, it was the propeller waves that got me. They were at least 4' tall and very close. Subs belong under water.
 
When faced with really large waves in our CD-22, we would head straight at the wave, power fairly slowly (8-10 knots) up, then pull back on the power somewhat as we approached the top, so as to mush through the top. The idea being to keep up enough speed to maintain steerage and forward motion, but not more. If we carefully mushed through the top, then headed straight down into the trough at a very moderate speed, steering attentively, we would neither turn sideways much, nor stick the bow into the next wave. This worked well for us in some tough situations, one of which was 8-10 foot super-steep and closely-spaced waves caused by a wind vs current situation. Wasn't much fun, but it worked.

In another situation (much bigger waves, but not as steep) where we had to do this for quite a while, it forced us to a course which was several degrees off from what we wanted. But it seemed that we really didn't have the option to proceed on the desired course.
 
This is one where I'm really waiting for the answers. I've never found a good way to cross a large swell, so I can only hope to learn something.

First, remember that those freighters are going about 20 knts, and have a snout on their nose that throws up a wake higher that the top of a sailboat's mast. It's impressive and I try to avoid going near their wakes for a long time.

Second, any C-Dory has a flat bottom and will slide downhill. Coming back from Santa Cruz Isle in the afternoon, going downwind, you don't dare go too far off the swell, though it can be fun. I guess your slide wasn't?

And finally, a C-Dory, when you go directly over the wave has a tendency to ride to the top of the wave and then come down flat. Judy loves it, especially when the glass rattles.

So, bow up is a great approach, and I'd love to find out how those guys rode the Columbia entrance

Boris
 
First, you did the right thing to elect to slow down and go behind the ship. They are often going much faster than they seem to be. Good choice. I agree that slowing down more when you approached the wake would have been helpful. 5-7kts would give you enough speed for steerage and let you just ride over the wake with less chance of burying the bow. Wakes, as has been said, are very steep and have very short periods so, especially big ones need to be treated with care. Next time..., maybe get a little farther behind the vessel before crossing the wake, slow down. Finally, you came out OK, nobody hurt, the boat did fine, learning experience with little pain.
 
Since I am reading this and wanting to learn better how to handle this myself in the future.

Can you state how far away from the container ship you were as it passed your bow.
 
The wake off various ships can be different. The slab-sided auto transport ships seem to be the worst in my experience... besides the steep wave from the wake, there is often a deeper trough hidden behind that first tall wave.

When taking the wake, I try to do so at 90º, with just enough speed to crest the first wake. Sometimes you get "the surprise" of the deeper trough.

My preferred method of crossing a ship's wake is to run as far behind as possible, giving the wake some time to dissipate. Even if this means running off at an angle. Driving the whale watch boats in the San Juans, this is a common occurrence... with boats bigger and much heavier than a C-Dory, it is still important to watch out for ships' wake.

Jim B.
 
First slow down and trim bow up--that way if you go down the back side of the wave, you will not bow steer and broach as you did. 90 degrees vs 45 degrees to a wake? I prefer to go away from the ship at about 45 degrees. I am not entirely sure if folks are talking about 90 degrees to the ships course, or the face of the wave.

I much prefer to hit the wake far back as possible. These freighters can certainly be steep and you don't really want to be anywhere close to the ship…(or many of the ferry's , large sport fishers etc).

Lots of ships out there. Having an AIS receiver is very helpful to know the course, rudder angle (if the ship is turning, which many are in this area) and the speed of the ship. I like to pick up ships as far away as possible--AIS or Radar often helps with this.

I can certainly understand how this type of encounter can be frightening--put it up to another lesson, and try a bit differently next time….but the speed is the major issue.
 
Agree, those car transport ships make the steepest wakes.

Not the same deal, but another wake hazard is the surge ahead of the bow wake, not evident unless you are in very shallow water on a very gentle slope into the shipping channel. That surge can throw you right up onto the beach and strand a small boat. See this often on the Columbia River, with its multiple sandy dredge spoil beaches.
 
redbaronace":182fa1kd said:
Since I am reading this and wanting to learn better how to handle this myself in the future.

Can you state how far away from the container ship you were as it passed your bow.
Click to expand...

redbaronace when I slowed down to idle speed, I was about 1/4 mile from the Container Ship. I let it pass in front of me, and it was about 1/4 mile to my Starboard when I turned toward it. Lessons learned.

Thank you one and all for your help, suggestions, and guidance.

Have a wonderful Easter.

Gratitude (Jim)
 
as said above speed was a bit high. we deal with these freighters all the time fishing Coho in the shipping lanes out of Port Angeles. We try and give as much time for them to dissipate and take them on at a 90.
Trim tabs were a great addition to our boat. and when there is a 1-2' wind chop they are great. we also use them to balance different boat loads and in a heading sea we use them moderately to keep the bow down. however in a 1/4 swell or a following we do not use them at all I trim them up or what would be bow up. slow down and manage the surfing as best we can.
After trying all different attempts with trim tabs I found this to be the best answer for us. I hate the feeling of a 1/4 ing or following sea "grabbing" the trim tab and gives me a feeling of no control on the stern of the boat.
we have not done the Columbia bar to date in a cdory. but out of la push and through the straights this is what we found works the best.
 
I understand your feeling and concern the first time this happened to us was shortly after we got our dory water ready. only running deep V boats in the past I just headed out on 3/4 throttle. only to get in some outside marina mixed wakes from all the boats heading out to fish. needless to say we were going too fast for this hull and we got thrown 90 degrees. scared the lights out of us for lack of a better word. We contemplated selling the boat that weekend as I would not run a boat I didn’t trust. three years later and lots of learning how to operate this hull I am glad we decided to keep it.
 
Did quite similar crossing the wake of an ocean-going tug when we first got the boat. I slowed considerably, but under-estimated the severity of the drop on the back side of the wake and buried the bow in green water. I traversed it at 90* also. I now find that, based on each wake, I prefer to cross them at ~45*. We get more "roll" but it's less treacherous to my marriage. :wink: My wife laughed about it and she is very confident in the boat's ability, but...
 
The C-Dory is NOT a deep V hull. That can be good or bad, depending on you view. If you want to pound through waves, swell and wakes, go deep V, with 2 ea 200 HP motors off the back. If you want simple, go C-Dory

And it's different from a sailboat, as it will skid. There's no keel

Do we need another learning lesson at our age? Oh well, I got it.

Boris
 
Agreed with bow up, slow down and give the big boys sea room.

I got too close in the Straights of Gibraltar to get "5 blasts" (read danger signal)
from a large freighter. The wake was a non issue but I was in a 61' sloop.

These C-Dorys, by design, with some "V" in the bow and flat (or little dead rise)
astern are more prone to broaching than a full "V" hull or full keel vessel.
Running off, on the downside of a large wave, the V'd bow can dig in and
the stern, being somewhat flat, can slip to the side causing a broach.
Hence, use xtra care and keep the bow up when running off in larger seas.

Aye.
 
My experience is that with the semi dory type of hull, by applying power you can pull out of a broach far easier than either a Deep V or a full keel sailboat. But definitely keeping the bow up, is important in following seas. Also the light C Dory , with a good acceleration can work the waves far better than a displacement hull going down wind/waves. There is a lot of work--and reflex action in play--sort of like surfing!
 
Rather than like surfing, using throttle on a flat-ish and skid-ish rear end boat
(usually the heaviest part) to steer down a large wave, is more like having the right
light touch on the throttle of a 911S Porsche (rear end engine and drive wheels)
on snow in the winter. The ass-end of the thing wants to be first down the road
(wave). This is where experience counts and neuvo, or tired, helmsmen end up
as a late night broadcast in the local news.

I've made the mistakes in all three scenarios (surf, boat, car).

Aye.
 
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