Volcanic Glass

El and Bill

New member
A quick geo-comment on the grounding of flights in Europe due to clouds of volcanic ash from eruptions in Iceland.

When molten rock cools very fast it solidifies as glass. Obsidian is a volcanic glass from such rapid cooling, usually associated with lava flows. It was very useful, when chipped into shape as arrowheads, knives or spearpoints by early humans.

The volcano in Iceland is now erupting under a glacier. The rapid cooling of the molten fragments in the erupted ash forms tiny fragments of glass. This 'stuff' is like finely suspended sandpaper and is very abrasive - to aircraft windows traveling through a cloud at high speed. In the high heat of an aircraft engine, so I'm told, some remelts and resolidifies - freezing parts and shutting down the engine. Hence the groundings of planes in Europe this am. Glad that Pat and Patty came home over the Pacific.

As the dust circles Earth we might see some mighty pretty sunsets and sunrises in our part of the world in a few days.
 
My Daughter is in Accra, West Africa and is flying into Amsterdam later today and on to Vancouver. I phoned and the airport is open and it looks like her flight will be ok. I hope all will remain ok.
Donna
 
This sort of thing makes me glad folks have sort of stopped saying "global warming" and call it "Climate change" Earth is still one really hot rock, and very dynamic. I've been known to say I'll cut my gas burn usage when they shut off the volcanoes. Kilauea on the Big Island of Hi was a fascinating visit. I didn't see David Suzuki there trying to shut it off.
Climate change fer shure what is going on? Interesting stuff and adds to the challenge of getting around.
George
 
This is much more intereting than things I really should be doing.
Bill, Thanks for your input on these matters.
Donna: Now would you really want your daughter to be on the flights that push the limits and test this stuff out? Kinda the reverse of sitting on a plane safely on the ground, watching them de-ice the wings/flaps and things, all the while the thoughts of how the airline industry is attempting to cut back cost anywhere they can. Thank God the pilots have to make the same ride... I am just saying... :mrgreen: :thup :smiled
 
patrick and linda asked:

hi bill,
thanks for the explanation. to your knowledge have there been any recorded plane accidents caused by the suspended fragments of glass?
pat

A long time ago, in a C-130 squadron far, far away, I was a Naval Flight Officer; Wings of Gold, Bars of Brass, you can shove them up your... but I digress.

:wink:

Volcanic ash can and has caused multiple engine failure in jet aircraft in cruise flight. The sandblasting effect can be quite severe, to the extent that seeing outside the cockpit can be problematic. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Airways_Flight_9

------

British Airways Flight 9, sometimes referred to as the Speedbird 9 or Jakarta incident,[1] was a scheduled British Airways flight from London Heathrow to Auckland, with stops in Bombay, Madras, Kuala Lumpur, Perth, and Melbourne.

On June 24, 1982, the route was flown by City of Edinburgh, a 747-236B registered G-BDXH. The aircraft flew into a cloud of volcanic ash thrown up by the eruption of Mount Galunggung, resulting in the failure of all four engines, although the reason for the failure was not then apparent to the crew or ground control. The aircraft was diverted to Jakarta in the hope that enough engines could be restarted to allow it to land there. The aircraft was able to glide far enough to exit the ash cloud, and all engines were restarted (although one failed again soon after), allowing the aircraft to land safely.

...

As Flight 9 approached Jakarta, the crew found it difficult to see anything through the windscreen, and had to make the approach almost entirely on instruments, despite reports of good visibility. The crew decided to fly the ILS, Instrument Landing System, however, the glideslope was inoperative, so they flew the localizer as the first officer monitored the airport's DME (Distance Measuring Equipment). He then called out how high they should be at each DME step along the final track to the runway, creating a virtual glide slope for them to follow. It was, in Moody's words, "a bit like negotiating one's way up a badger's arse".[1] Although the runway lights could be made out through a small strip of the windscreen, the landing lights on the aircraft seemed to be inoperable. After landing, the flight crew found it impossible to taxi, due to glare from apron floodlights which made the already sandblasted windscreen opaque. Therefore, City of Edinburgh had to wait for an airport tug to tow her in.

...

It was found that City of Edinburgh's problems had been caused by flying through a cloud of volcanic ash from the eruption of Mount Galunggung. Because the ash cloud was dry, it did not show up on the weather radar, which is designed to detect the moisture in clouds. The cloud sandblasted the windscreen and landing light covers and clogged the engines. As the ash entered the engines, it melted in the combustion chambers and adhered to the inside of the power-plant. As the engine cooled from not running and as the aircraft descended out of the ash cloud, the molten ash solidified and enough broke off to allow air to flow smoothly through the engine allowing a successful restart. The engines had enough electrical power to restart because one generator and the onboard batteries were still operative; generator or battery power is required for ignition of the engines.

...

A nearly identical incident occurred on 15 December 1989 when KLM Flight 867, a B747-400 from Amsterdam to Anchorage, Alaska, flew into the plume of the erupting Mount Redoubt, causing all four engines to fail due to compressor stall. Once the flight cleared the ash cloud, the crew was able to restart each engine and then make a safe landing at Anchorage. However, unlike City of Edinburgh, the aircraft was substantially damaged.

<SNIP>

------

C-Dory content: Since C-Dory surface skimmers travel much more slowly than Boeing 747 jet aircraft in cruise flight, potential sandblasting effects are correspondingly reduced.

:lol:


Best regards,
 
Pat

Yes, there was a flight affected - it was a KLM, if I remember right, along the Aleutians, when it flew into a volcanic cloud. Lost all four engines, dropped over 20,000 feet before the pilots got the engines started and made an emergency landing.

Also, seems I remember a tale of another commercial plane going through a 'glassy' cloud and frosting the windshield so badly the pilot had to put his head out the small side window in the cockpit to see the landing. Erg!
 
El and Bill":o3uv8m2o said:
the pilot had to put his head out the small side window in the cockpit to see the landing.

That would give you quite the mullet, if you put your head out the window of a plane travelling at 200-600 mph! :wink

I think they said the pilot had to stand up and look through one of the angled off-center windows which was not so badly obscured...
 
marco422":101e2iii said:
El and Bill":101e2iii said:
the pilot had to put his head out the small side window in the cockpit to see the landing.

That would give you quite the mullet, if you put your head out the window of a plane travelling at 200-600 mph! :wink

I think they said the pilot had to stand up and look through one of the angled off-center windows which was not so badly obscured...

Marco, you're not going that fast when you're landing! If you are, you're going too fast!

Charlie
 
interesting. just another reason why i continue to check in with the c-brat site, always learning something of interest. now if you guys could just post some information that would help me reduce my tax burden i would really appreciate that!
thanks again
pat
 
charlie said:

Marco, you're not going that fast when you're landing! If you are, you're going too fast!

That depends upon the type of aircraft you are flying. A high school buddy of mine flew F-4 Phantoms for the Marine Corps. The Phantom was a good bird, but it had relatively small wings for its size and weight, and it had roughly the glide angle of a crowbar. My buddy said his standard landing speed was:

"...200 knots, plus four knots for my wife and two knots for each of my kids." He had two kids then, thus 208 knots at touchdown.

In the C-130F, by way of comparison, the "gouge" for landing at 100,000 pounds gross weight was:

"...125 knots on the approach, 115 knots at the inner marker, and 100 knots over the fence." Of course, the Herky Bird had much bigger wings and was a _much_ more forgiving aircraft than was the F-4 Phantom.


Best regards,
 
Captains Cat":1u76be0u said:
marco422":1u76be0u said:
El and Bill":1u76be0u said:
the pilot had to put his head out the small side window in the cockpit to see the landing.

That would give you quite the mullet, if you put your head out the window of a plane travelling at 200-600 mph! :wink

I think they said the pilot had to stand up and look through one of the angled off-center windows which was not so badly obscured...

Marco, you're not going that fast when you're landing! If you are, you're going too fast!

Charlie

Aren't they still going around 160mph on an average landing? Sticking my head out the window of a car going 80 just about takes my breath away... I guess that's better than endangering 400 passengers. I'd hate to get a bug in my eye at that speed. :)
 
Hi Pat
Yes, I would rather have her safe on the ground in Accra. She is still there, no flight to Amsterdam yet. She is much better of in Accra then sitting in Amsterdamn airport. Thinking there wouldn't be a hotel to be found. She is in a "luxury" hotel by Accra's standards for 22 bucks a night. If all clears they will try for Saturday night fly out. After 3 months in Kumasi she was dying to sink her teeth into a double cheeseburger from Mickey D's...lol...guess she will have to wait. Patience is not one of her virtues so this will be good practise for her. I told her it was just adding to her African adventure...so far she was in a car accident, bruised but not broken, tested positive for Malaria and spent over a week, out of it. She had a blast! She did lots of good environmental work over there and will never forget this opportunity she had.
 
Geologically speaking, the air traffic problem caused by the volcano in Iceland, is a preview. We could (and probably will) experience much larger disruptions from other volcanos in the future.

Humans love to divide things into two piles when in discussion - you know -either, or. Geologists divide volcanos into two piles. Either continental volcanos or oceanic. Continental usually form over an isolated 'hot spot' under continental crust - like Yellowstone or (see dividing simple-mindedly into two piles again) continental volcanos that lie along a continental margin where two plates are converging - like Mt. St.Helens.

Oceanic volcanos lie over hot spots beneath oceanic crust - like Hawaii. Or, where plates are moving apart opening oceans - like Iceland on the mid-Atlantic ridge (or, as geologists say the mid-Atlantic spreading center).

NOW - the important dichotomy - continental crust is mostly silica - when it melts it is sticky stuff and volcanos on continents go BOOM and blast silica (glass) in great volumes high into the stratosphere. Oceanic crust, melted, is fluid so volcanoes emit lava and rarely go boom. In Hawaii you go close to see the volcano - with Mt. St. Helens you get away, if you have any sense.

So back to air traffic - the eruption in Iceland is a problem because of the a
amount of water mixing with the lava (making it explosive) and ice, causing rapid cooling.

If a continental volcano erupts the ash cloud could be more extensive and perhaps shut down air traffic all over the globe. So the current problem should be viewed as a 'dress rehearsal.'
 
After watching the news this weekend about the havoc in Europe which will eventually spread around the world (not from the ash but the economy), we have decided to go "liquid" with our investments for a couple of months. We might miss a little "bump" in the market if the present trend holds out but we may avoid something bad. I probably should not be in equities at all at my age but, as I am an active investor, I do watch them each day and make changes where I think necessary. Did this once before when the tech stocks crashed, 2002 I think.

Hope this passes soon!

Charlie
 
Our son Brian and his wife are stuck in the UK mid-move to Houston. The grandkids are with "the other grandma" in Illinois -- Sandy brought them over at Easter to await the move. The UK house is sold but the title company in Houston will only accept original signatures -- no Faxes -- to close escrow on the Houston house this week.

They called this AM and they have reservations on Friday from Madrid to Houston with back up on Saturday to Chicago. A friend will sail them to France so they can rent a car to drive to Madrid. Brian is an oil trader -- he has a tanker leaving for US on Monday (a 2 week trip) but can't even get to the continent to board it if he wanted to.

I told him he better be recording all of this for his memoirs!

As others have noted things like this will definitely require rethinking how we conduct global and domestic trade!

Bill Uffelman
Las Vegas NV
 
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