Venture 23 insulation

M

maryvmcclain

New member
Hi again. I've been reading about the differences between a 22 CD Cruiser and the 23' Venture. According to the C Dory website, the cabin is totally lined with some kind of marine insulated vinyl (I assume like we had on our Hunter sailboat). But, when I look at pictures for 2012 Ventures, it appears to be "bumpy" like the normal glass, maybe a bit shinier (possibly painted with insulating paint?) Which is it? Insulation (from heat...we're moving to Las Vegas), is important to us... more important than the 2500 Wallas Heater.

I know there is a difference of an inch or two, here and there.... and I see that there are wood (teak? Teak decoguard?) cabinet doors. And that there is a bulkhead against the engine well. Is the table/settee a little bigger? Can it seat 4 smaller adults? (instead of 2 larger adults)

I'm sure you all will tell me about the construction differences, the chine and the flex and the ride... but (as the first mate, I'm concerned about livability... and we will mostly be using it on lakes or maybe the CA Delta.

I imagine that somewhere there is value for the additional 15K of Venture versus Cruiser... but will I SEE a difference?

Thanks again.
Mary
 
Do you know of a site with pictures of the interiors of the 22 CD Cruiser and 23 Venture? The C-Dory site has nothing.

Thanks,

Jake
 
Hello Mary. We are the owners of a 2008 Venture 23' which we bought new at the 2008 SBS (Seattle Boat Show). I believe ours was the very first one made by C-Dory as previous Venture's were actually produced by Cape Cruiser.

The Cape Cruisers (at least those that I have seen) do not have the interior lining while the Ventures made - at least until Triton acquired the C-Dory line - under the C-Dory banner do.


The following is speculation on my part about what you might be seeing. This would need to be verified by Triton or any possible owners of Triton made Ventures:

I had heard that Triton did not like the vinyl lining so perhaps, if indeed Triton has produced any new Ventures, they are not using the interior lining. If so, this would account for seeing differences in what may be the old website (I do not believe Triton has updated the C-Dory information or pictures on the http://www.c-dory.com/ website) and any possible pictures of new Triton produced Venture interiors.

We have not spent a lot of time in non-Venture C-Dory's (i.e. overnight trips) nor have we ever owned a boat w/ an uncovered fiberglass interior so I cannot state the differences without a doubt. However; theoretically, the fiberglass interior minimizes the "fiberglass sweating" moisture accumulated in a boat's interior, minimizes noise to a small degree, and provides a minor bit of insulation.

If you are planning on acquiring the boat primarily for fishing then the interior lining might not be as convenient. For us; however, since we do not fish and do not have to deal w/ possible fish guts and/or fish scales in the boat, the interior lining seems beneficial.

Also, for those that do heavy interior modifications the lining probably gets in the way.

I have no idea how the lining will hold up over the long haul, but ours is still in good shape since we acquired it.

Let me know if you have other questions that I may assist you with.

Tanks,
Dan, Tanya, and Hannah on C-Renity
 
I was just at Triton Friday and they have 2 new Venture 23 (solid color hulls) very nice getting prepped to go out the door. Give an email to scott or jeff at Triton with this. Of course they could do whatever ypu wanted in a new boat. Just fyi. In a couple 23's I've been on I can put one fingertip with one hand on the cuddy lip and touch the back bulkhead with the outstretched other arms fingers. I can't fo that on my 22. I think the 23 loses 6 inches inside for a bit bigger cockpit. George
 
Mary,

I think George may be correct RE the cabin length, although I haven't measured it. That may explain why the CC23 (or V23) only comes with the single burner Wallas, since the galley seems somewhat shorter.

I have a 2006 CC23 and love it. The cockpit is about the same size as the CD25. The V-berth is a couple of inches higher (I can almost sit up on the bunk) and the cabin height is 6' 4" overall without the hightop feature available on the CD22.

To a large extent the CC23(V23) is very close to the CD22, which may explain why the legal issues engulfed the CC23 a few years ago. The boats are different, but to the casual observer they would seem extremely similar. The hull has marginally more dead rise, the beam is a couple inches wider, and slightly more cabin volume (although possibly shorter).

I had a CD22 (bought new) in 2003 and sold it in 2008. Silly me. I found the CC23 in 2009 and bought it used so there wasn't a lot of difference in prices. Whether or not a new V23 is worth $15K more than a new CD22 only you can determine. My hunch is that unless you have quite a lot of time in a CD22, you may not notice/appreciate the changes in the V23. Personally, I like the changes - but as mentioned I didn't face a $15K price differential.

One other feature that I can't fully explain is the fact that I get slightly better mileage in CC23 (with a Honda 150) than I ever got in the CD22 (with a Suzuki 90). There may be some other differences in the hull design that would explain the improvement. The other thing is that with the larger motor you can cruise at higher speed but still have improved mileage (ie. 26-28mph with 4.2smpg). Displacement cruising is virtually identical between the two boats.

Best,
Casey
 
The Ventures started out as the Cape Cruisers and the fact that they were so similar to the C-Dory IS what got that company into trouble (combined with the legal agreement between that company and the one they sold C-Dory to). As a result of the loss of a lawsuit, the Cape Cruiser assets (hull molds for 23 and a 26) were transferred to C-Dory. That was when C-Dory was owned by a different group of people.

At the time, that group started building the 23 (and a 26) as the "Venture" series. In order to more clearly distinguish them from the 22 and the 25, they added some upgrades to the trim level (including the insulation) which increased the overall cost but which made the Venture series appeal to a slightly different audience than the classic C-Dory.

Since then, Triton has taken over. Many here (and probably elsewhere) have commented that they like some of the features of the Venture design but don't want the fancier interior. So Triton has built some Ventures with the C-Dory classic trim level (at presumably a lower price than with the Venture trim level). It's a buyer's market now so I'm pretty sure you can get whatever trim level you want.

As I've said here before, IMHO, it would be better for Triton if they simply built the Venture boats with different options for the trim level and didn't bother to build the 22's or 25's. The Venture 23 and CD22 are so similar to each other and the Venture 26 and CD 25 are so similar to each other, it doesn't make sense for one company to offer both sets, especially when what differentiates them the most in the buyer's eye is the trim level. I think having too many models simply confuses the buyer and to some extent, this thread is evidence of that.
 
The Venture series was thought to be an evolution of the 22' Cruiser. A little sharper entry up in the bow the rear of the hull is flat. The insulation was put in the Ventures to cure a common malady of the uninsulated 22's as cold outside warm inside produces condensation which if you are sleeping on the boat you end up wearing. The insulation along with the molded cabinets for the ventures and the newer 22's instead of the classic wood built interiors had the tradionalists up in arms. The insulation was a great addition although you no longer could just glue wood blocks to the inside of the cabin to mount various changes or upgrades. So ventures take a little more effort to rig but then again you don't see wires etc running everywhere, Others worried about mold getting behind the insulation,especially Florida folks. The molded interior instead of the wood built was another thing that got the old guard riled up. The molded interior is thought to be harder to modify but on the other hand some have said the molded interior makes the boat stronger. Some liked it others said it looked like a Baylinner or a Clorox bottle. That was cold! We have an 2008 that was i guess built by Fluid Marine. During that period C-Dory's had a few different daddy's. The mold has not been a problem for us and we sleep on the boat a fair amount. No condensation drips, no mold. I do keep a heater on in the boat through out the winter. Ventures are or were 1000 pounds heavier and side by side with a 22' are a bigger heavier boat. If you raft up with a 23' Venture and a 22' cruiser and walk down the boats with one foot on each boat the the difference is dramatic. The 22' is effected much more by weight walking up to the bow than the Venture. The Venture rides a chop better than a 22' cruiser because of the steeper entry of the bow. Ours has a 150 hp Yamaha will cruise at 30 and top out at 40/42 mph with a light load. They are just as happy cruising from 14 to 20 as we often do when cruising with 22' cruisers. Being heavier the Ventures require a little more in the way of a tow vehicle and loaded on a trailer they weigh in at 5500 to 6000 pounds. The Ventures used to have twin 30 gallon aluminum fuel tanks, now????The 22' cruiser is a good boat simple, light,uninsulated,fuel efficient draws about 7 inches of water while the Venture draws 12 inches. We like our boat the cockpit is bigger than a 22'. The tables are probably about the same size. Used ventures or cape cruisers don't seem to last long when they show up for sale. More people enjoyed the full feature set of standard features like the pre Triton versions came with, window coverings,hot and cold water with an on demand electric pump,raw water wash down,interior grab rails,butane stove,tilt wheel helm, hydraulic steering, nicer helm seaat and a wood like steering wheel, shore power and battery charger along with a three 120volt outlets, and one 12vdc socket, step boxes in the cockpit which make them much easier to get into compared to the 22', a full transom. I'm sure I've missed some things. Each to there own. One last thing because of the ventures hull design which features that deeper forward entry and on each side of that fairly wide flat lifting chines,it loads on a bunk trailer and stays put. The flat bottom 22' can be a bit more of a challenge to center up unless you add front and mid ship guides. We trailered ours 10,000 miles last year it seems to be holding up well. I think a new 23' Venture with two of new Yamaha 70's would be a nice set up. Could un along with one to save fuel start up number two for covering ground. Good luck with your search. There are really only two kinds of people those who have ventures and those who wish they did! :lol:
D.D.
 
My personal feeling is that if you want good insulation, then you would be better off starting with a unlined hull, and add it ourself. I am planing on 1/2" to 5/8" closed cell foam on the side walls and ceiling of the V Berth in the 22, then I will cover it with a quality vinyl. This will give considerably more insulation from both heat, and cold than the single foam backed vinyl or "mouse fur" that may be used by many builders. It is a technique I have used on several boats I have remodeled/restored.
 
Not to be difficult, but contrary to a previous comment made our 2008 Venture 23' does have a double-burner Wallas stove.

I believe; however, it came form the factory w/ a single burner alcohol stove but was replaced by Master Marine - whom we acquired the boat from - with the two burner Wallas.

Will-C and others covered some of the additional Venture features extremely well but one item I did not see mentioned is that the Venture series comes with a reinforced roof that I do not believe the 22 posesses.

Take care,
Dan, Tanya, and Hannah on C-Renity
 
Thank you, this is very helpful, once again.

There seems to be a bit of confusion about the cockpit size... one said he was sure it was smaller because he could reach across... the other said it was bigger.

It really is ridiculous that there are no pictures of the differences on the website... only a drawing and that seems to look about the same to me. I've looked through your albums and noticed a few things... but had no idea that the cabinets on the Venture were molded in... you couldn't tell that from the pictures at all. Not sure what I think about that!

I do wish that they made C-Dories with teak duraguard cabinets... I really don't like the white.... but then, I'm not a fisherman, I'm the decorator.

Thanks again.

Mary
 
Mary,
Some of the older C Dorys had some teak Dura-guard--and it made a very dark cabin interior. Also it detiorrated to some degree with UV light (the back bulkhead was also made of the teak Dura-quard.

You really need to look at the various boats in person. Photos cannot really tell you the difference in size.

Not sure what is meant by re-enforced roofs. The various C Dorys were made with some having the center just about 1/4" fiberglass, and the outer part cored with balsa. Some others were made with the outer being 1/4" solid fiberglass, and the center being cored. I don't know of any of the boats having completely cored tops--but that is certainly possible.
 
The cockpit is bigger on a 23' venture as compared to a 22'. I have a 14" square piece of roof from our 23 venture at the the house that was cut out for our air conditioner. It looks to be about 1/2 thick cored material. We have pictures in the Willl-c album of what a 2008 interior looks like. What the factory is providing now for an interior anyone's guess. They probably would put anything you wanted in there. There was some discussion about the option of getting the boat built with what you wanted. The idea of what was considered to be a list of standard equipment and what was available as an option from the factory might still be in the dream stage. Call the factory is probably the best idea,they should be able to provide pictures,hopefully.
D.D.
 
As to the reinforced roof, I do not know the specifics since I have never had a 22' nor cut into the roof of the 22's or 23's (God forbid in my case!).

However; when I bought the boat new at the 2008 SBS 'a reinforced roof' was one of the many attributes the factory folks (I believe Reynolds was still there then) claimed as a feature of the Venture's as compared to the 22's.

The many other Venture features they told me about included those Will-C and others have also mentioned. Most of those are readily visible to the naked eye such as the longer foredeck rails, interior roof grab bars, the wider gunwales, the full height transom, more vertical clearance in the V-berth, and the steps built into the cockpit.

As to the 'reinforced roof' actually being factual or not I would not state with a certainty but the others factors they mentioned all appear to be true so I would be surprised if they mislead me on the roof reinforcement.

Tanks,
Dan on C-Renity
 
the current spec sheet on c-dorys web site says ,on page , material composite core & fiberglass. then on page two ,under construction-with the use of balsa core composite construction. I thought the reason it weighed more was due to NO balsa core construction,any help here with my confusion? :?:
 
The 2 boats at Triton are in fact Wefings . The 26 is loaded and not necessarily for the Florida Market . There is a Wallas , Windlass,Remote Spoghtlight,Linered interior,really nice looking solid blue hull, Lonseal Teakstyle Flooring,Window Covers, a NovaKool Fridge,Interior Hand Rail,and extra battery wiring with VSR/combiner . Its a real showpiece and we have it rigged for a single Suzuki . It available for a while out west ,it would sell through us but be delivered by the factory . We also have a solid blue 23 Venture without the liner and a little more simply equipped in Ferndale. Feel free to message me if you have interest in these boats . I am awaiting some good pics and will post them when I get them .
Marc
 
The use of a foam or other composite (such as Nida-Core, not necessarily used in C Dory or Venture) does not mean that the boat may be lighter or heavier. Generally cores tend to make decks or hulls stiffer, and in many cases it may mean less glass. There are some places where balsa is a superior material--but it does have the disadvantage of potential water intrusion--however, any core material can be delaminated if there is water intrusion, or poor construction.

However, I would not buy a specific boat because of a "re-enforced cabin top"--what ever that means in this case. The minor difference in hull form, the look, more room etc would be valid reasons.
 
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