tomcat as a first boat???

it's nice to hear someone with experience, having a little different take on towing. however, 1) i do go over to big mountain ranges from Las Vegas to San Diego. 2) once i have my boat, my 600 mile trips are in stone. it's "the pacific or nothing" according to my salt water loving wife. 3) upkeep on 25' boat, double axel trailer and truck ALL go up with a bigger heavier boat. if i see a deal i can't pass on with a 25' in 6 months, maybe i can adjust my plans a bit. but chances are, i'll be using a 22' way more, if it's cheaper and easier to maintain. i get 3/4s of my money back on selling a 22', if i don't go overboard in upgrades
 
Well...some thoughts from someone who went through this effort over the last 2-3 years.

I have a 17' flats boat and now a 27' Glacier Bay 2670. Actually I own a whole mess of other smaller boats too - 3 kayaks and 1 canoe.

I knew I was in a market for a boat that would do a cruise but fish.

I started looking at the C-Dory 22', then 25' and upon my wife's encouragement went looked and made an offer on a Tomcat. Fortunately that deal didn't work out (employment situation got weird). I then spent the next 18 months looking for the "right" boat. I had 4 deals fall apart - typically outbid at the last minute "we have another buyer", and I don't play that game. It's easy to buy a boat when you have a boat.

So some thoughts on a bigger boat:

a) two engines = twice the maintenance

b) the difference between a 17' flats boat and the GB is night and day; just like a TC it's huge, somewhat unwieldy, but a beast in the water - the first ride was a 5 hour jaunt from Big Pine Key to Naples in +20 knot winds; doable and "fun" but I would prefer not to do that again

c) there's a bunch more to go wrong on the bigger boat - brakes on trailer, head, 4 bilges, lots more electronics...simple = good, complex = $ or time

d) I'm not 100% sure the wife is on board with this whole cruising thing...only one way to find out; the plan is to cruise own the ICW a bit and then airbnb a yacht the first couple times (crazy deals you can find here in FL - pretend you're a millionaire for $150-200 a night) my best deal has been $80 a night on a 38' sailboat

e) bring your wallet - I needed a new truck (sold the F150 for $7K bought a Tundra for $28K); I trailer the GB at 8mpg; the boat at best will get 2mpg; ended up buying a new trailer ($8K);

f) I moved from GA to FL to eliminate the "commute" - best thing I ever did; took a big pay cut up front (30%), but over time it all worked out

g) When you buy a used boat you are buying the previous owner - get to know him as much as possible as well

and lastly

h) do the right things first - eliminate as much debt as possible, get the kids into college, and take care of some of the wive's bucket list first; then you'll be in good shape to pull the trigger on a boat - all this took me about 20 years; during that time I fished out of kayaks and my $8K flats boat. On a side note I've won about $5-7K in tournaments - so I'm kinda serious about fishing.

Everyone looks at me like I'm nuts for buying the GB - but at the end of the day it was a life goal (that is frankly just starting). Some people should own boats - some shouldn't. It's a terrible investment - so know that your depreciating assets will cost you plenty. Storage, gas, maintenance aside I'm counting on losing $15K over time. Realistically $30K is probably more accurate.

My comments to friends and family is, "I have two choices - buy a boat or spend $125/hr on a shrink. The boat is my escape from IT work - and even then it follows me on the boat."

So there you go the nickel tour on my journey...whatever you do don't let people talk you out of your dream/journey. I don't want to have regrets later.

BTW - I didn't have an issue trailering the GB; plenty of wind and Mac truks to deal with. I think there's a bit too much tongue weight, but that's fixable. The boat was very steady - I stuck at 65 mph in the right lane. I believe that the cat's hull style keeps it a bit more in line. Now...pulling into a gas station, you gotta plan that out every time. Just something to get used to.
 
jbdba01, honestly it felt like i was reading much of my own words. i don't get the guys that harp on a boat being a bad investment. save it for someone buying a boat as an investment? my first car was a 20 yr old 66 mustang i paid $400 for and sold after college for $9k. my 2nd was a 98' jeep bought for $5k and sold a few years ago for $5k. never paid a mechanic $1, and i didn't consider those investments. i also believe your statement "some people should buy boats and some people shouldn't" someone eagerly knowing the work he will do to his boat is not the same as a retired coulple, optimistically thinking the 30' moneypit they just bought will sit there, waiting for them to hold lf their drinks while watching the sunset.

getting my affairs in order has been the top of my list, selling my houses and also setting up for a sizeable paycut to be a stones throw from where i want to be, just like yourself. the longer i charter and fet the big salary the better, but the window of being a boat owner shrinks every year.

the cdory 22 is a great boat for meeting my goals of getting out 20 miles on a nice day for fishing and living on the water. it will be something i can leave this earth with far more satisfied than anything else i can think of.

knowing my skilled work and attention to detail, i'd be willing to bet my "terrible investment" will be in better shape than the day i got it, and that it gets passed down to my wife's fishing family, rather than sold for 2/3ds it's value.
 
gulfcoast john":2k4cly93 said:
Roger,
Did you forget about your holding tank overboard discharge pump, #8, with the paper gaskets?
John
Click to expand...
Nope - I have an airhead. But that's why I said that "if you get a Tomcat it will likely come with at least 7 pumps". I hate changing/fixing pumps and the sewage pump would be low, low, low on my list. :lol: In fact I've complained so much about pumps that last year when a buddy of mine and I were walking down the dock at Friday Harbor late in the evening, he paused and said

"Do you hear that?"

I replied "What"?

To which he said "The sound of pumps failing all over".
 
couple points to make:

"tomcat as a 1st boat" was the title of this thread, that was taking into account the perils of towing this monstrosity, doubling up the maintenance on (2) 150hps, all it's extra pumps, etc all from a new owner (albeit skilled in repairs), perhaps where i might scale back, avoid pitfalls . .

didn't want the comparing the cost of ownership to charters? eating out cost more than cooking, another thing i wouldn't bother comparing.

didn't want everyone to keep rehashing a boat as a bad "investment"? you lost me when you called it an investment. how many people i know who finance a $40k car every 10 years or only to trade in for a $8k discount on their next $40k "investment". you can argue that with gas, maintenance insurance, depreciation. . . public transport may be cheaper? but doesn't seem to slow down too many.

i don't expect to buy and maintain a boat for the cost of fuel (exactly like i have done with cars for 40 yrs) but i am convinced i'll be on the better end of the curve of the median of boat owners. that's all.
 
I went out on the maiden voyage in the cat yesterday and a couple things came to mind as I was cruising around testing things out. They may be of use to you - maybe.

1) a cat rides totally different than a monohull; the first time I took her out it was blowing like mad. Yesterday was a easy ride in 10-12. That said as I was passing a large monohull that was slapping the water I was really grateful to be in a cat.

2) it doesn't take much to convince people about a cat's ride, my buddy was totally sold on the ride. "We're so going offshore in this beast."

3) while she can do 40, cruising at 25 is where it's at. I had my buddy drive more than I just because I wanted to sit back and enjoy a cold one. We hit 40 just to see if she could do it a couple times.

4) trim, trim, trim...it's all about trimming her to get her to run like you want

Now the downside...

1) two sets of impellers are on the way - they just need replacing; as well as extra lower until oil, and extra 2 stroke oil (hpdi's), and two colwling covers...2x on everthing

2) there's a blockage that needs resolving - although the telltale is working and doesn't appear to be overheating it's "just not quite right"

3) you gotta get the trailer really wet and way down there to launch/recover

4) storage is a hassle at 10pm at night; no more putting her up in the garage

5) the gas station blues will kick in soon enough - it's a challenge gassing her up - two separate tanks mean moving her twice to fill up; much less two 90 gallon tanks - cha-ching.

I think the best way to phrase it is the Glacier Bay (just like a TC) is basically an RV on the water. You're not going to blow the doors of anyone, but you will definitely get there. In sloppy conditions probably before others.

No regrets on passing up on the 22' and 25' - for that matter the TC, but the GB just fit my lifestyle a bit better.

Stay thirsty my friend...
 
"5) the gas station blues will kick in soon enough - it's a challenge gassing her up - two separate tanks mean moving her twice to fill up; much less two 90 gallon tanks - cha-ching."

At fuel docks the hoses are always long enough to fill both sides. At gas stations on land, if I get close enough to the pumps with the trailer and get the fuel fills in the right position relative to the pump, I've not had a problem filling both sides without moving. Filling two 75 gallon tanks is not cheap, but that's also what allows me to do offshore trips.
 
the trade-offs seem pretty clear. that stability and handling of the offshore conditions would be soooo nice to have. the added expense and added difficulty in trailering, particularly to a newcomer, has pushed me away (for now). i can't relocate to the coastal community fast enough.
 
a question for roger,
you have 7 pumps, going on 8. my question is, you have to fishbox pumps and are about to add a live bait pump. couldn't you just get 1 pump 3 times the GPM, and split off to all 3 tanks? after all, it's not a safety issue, where redundancy is so crucial. again, i'm just asking, not debating, or speaking out if experience. any feedback that comes in, and i take out of it what i can use in the future.
 
nuccifilms":2jr79l4j said:
a question for roger,
you have 7 pumps, going on 8. my question is, you have to fishbox pumps and are about to add a live bait pump. couldn't you just get 1 pump 3 times the GPM, and split off to all 3 tanks? after all, it's not a safety issue, where redundancy is so crucial. again, i'm just asking, not debating, or speaking out if experience. any feedback that comes in, and i take out of it what i can use in the future.
Click to expand...
The bait pump pumps water in, the fish box pumps pump water/blood/guts out. So they are not interchangeable. In principal, one could combine the fish boxes to one pump but that would leave at least one long run of hose filled with stuff after pump out. Also when that one pump fails (& it will) neither fish box will be useable. While that's not a safety issue it is an annoyance when you're not close to civilization. Rubber spotters and Homer buckets can be used but...

Now you might reasonably ask if the raw water window pump and the bait pump could be one and the same. That's possible, but bait pumps are usually low pressure, moderate volume pumps where as the raw water wash down id's high pressure, high volume.

As much as I hate pumps, you might infer that I wouldn't have more than I feel I really need. ;-)
 
roger,
you sound like you are a full-out fishing set up, gear, gas, live bait, multiple fish boxes, going out far, tons of ice. as you've said, it all tallies up to a trip you can easily run you $1,200.

however, my question is, it sounds like a fishing crew all reaping benefits? man, i'd be looking at least a $200 chip-in or equivalent, and equal help with clean up to any friend i was (lucky enough) to get aboard with. now, you could have a boat filled with business associates, equally justifiable. but my point, that in all fairness, the cost of ownership has to be (pro-rated) over the enjoyment of several people, even if you're the only one paying.
 
rogerbum":197xs7c1 said:
"5) the gas station blues will kick in soon enough - it's a challenge gassing her up - two separate tanks mean moving her twice to fill up; much less two 90 gallon tanks - cha-ching."

At fuel docks the hoses are always long enough to fill both sides. At gas stations on land, if I get close enough to the pumps with the trailer and get the fuel fills in the right position relative to the pump, I've not had a problem filling both sides without moving. Filling two 75 gallon tanks is not cheap, but that's also what allows me to do offshore trips.
Click to expand...

Yup...done that, but for an extra $1-$2 a gallon at the marina I'll sing the blues and deal with it. At Big Pine Key I paid $258 to fill up for he run to Naples. I believe that was 1/2 full. "Welcome to the next level".

Thread handed back to OP. Buy a boat and don't look back. No regrets...right now I have two boats (one needs to go). My wife is saying, "Really...two boats? You collecting now?" "Hey it's either that or women...boats are cheaper."

Off to catch some tarpon...
 
nuccifilms":2k3n77eq said:
roger,
you sound like you are a full-out fishing set up, gear, gas, live bait, multiple fish boxes, going out far, tons of ice. as you've said, it all tallies up to a trip you can easily run you $1,200.

however, my question is, it sounds like a fishing crew all reaping benefits?
Click to expand...



That's an assumption on your part. My buddies didn't become buddies by being slackers.
 
roger,
it wasn't my assumption or sentiment that your buddies were slackers. just the opposite. making the point, you're getting something back from them.

and so i'm pro-rating the cost of a group outing, i don't expect me and my wife to $1,200 per trip to bottom fish a few miles out on a single outboard 22'.
 
nuccifilms":29hon1cq said:
what's the alternative? a 5 gallon bucket with your custom cut seat/lid?
Click to expand...

Yes.
Or a porta-potty.

2 things to remember:
1. It's a boat. Sooner or later everything is going to break. And when it does, I personally do not want it to be a marine head.

2. Never seriously use the word "boat" and "investment" in the same sentence.
 
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