tire failure

I suspect that there are a lot of factors in a car tire--including max load, ride, tire wear and fuel economy to name a few.

Good point about compressed air: for some reason the tire guys were having a problem getting one of the three tires to seat properly on the rims. They have an approximately 5 gallon air tank, which fits on the rim, is charged thru the compressor, and dumps the entire tank under the rim, into the tire space in a split second, to help seat the tire. When that discharged, and seated properly on the rim, there was a lot of force, and noise.

In my Yukon I run higher pressure in the rears especially when towing--because of the load in the vehicle as well as the better handling.
 
Bob, do you have a specific place you go to to get the tyre capacity vs pressure? I can't seem to find anything for trailer tyres.

Years ago a tyre rep pointed out that a tyre is like a spring. The more pressure you put in, the more the tread grows. His comment was to inflate the tyre to the load. I see this in the Toyota Camry, since the rear tyres are carrying a lot less weight than the front, and unless I run a lower pressure, the middle wears out quickly, before the side tread. I assume this is because it's carrying most of the load.

I know the load on the trailer tyres, since I weighed the trailer/boat/everything else and each tyre carries a lot less than it's capacity. If I can find a tyre capacity chart for a 225\75R 15E, I would be able to put the correct pressure in. I assume any chart for that size could be used.

So, Bob do you know where I can find such a chart?

Boris
 
On our trailer an aluminum tandem axle with torsion springs we run 14" Carlisle radial load range c tires at 50 pounds cold. Our tire guy recommended the pressure which matches the cold inflation recommendations on the side of the tire. For me increasing the tires load range would not exactly change the trailers load rating. I would think that it would be more of a function of what the axles and springs were rated for would dictate the trailer load capacity. Our tires are rated for 1760 each so at 6000 pounds for the boat and trailer we are below the 7040 for which the tires are rated. We have about twenty thousand miles on the above tires and they have been good so far. We have traveled as much as 800 miles in a day in warmer weather towing the boat so if anything was weak I believe it would let go. I don't have a point and shoot thermometer but I lay my hand flat on all for tires every stop and that gives you a pretty good idea of what is going on. I take two fingers and touch the hubs and look to notice any one wheel running hotter Heavier tires add to the unsprung weight and I wonder if they do in fact run warmer? I would have liked to increase the diameter of my wheels but that would result in having to modify my fenders mounts braces etc. But in my thinking anyway increasing the wheel and tire diameter has got to help. Our truck recommends the front axle tires be at 60 psi cold and the rear axle tires run at 70 psi cold. I wonder if trailers with leaf springs which seem to ride a little rougher that torsion springs could in fact increase dynamic loads placed on the tires while dealing with road irregularities. Pa. roads are nothing to brag about. :mrgreen:
D.D.
 
Boris, the link I posted above:
http://www.maxxis.com/trailer/trailer-t ... tion-chart
Does have the 225/75-15E (which is what I have) at 80 PSI.

Boris, if the middle is wearing excessively, this usually means that the tire is over inflated. Under inflation, the edges tend to wear more.

Dave, I agree that just having higher load range tires, does not increase the trailer capacity--but since the tires is often the weak linK (and part of that is the road condition)--it is of value to to have the larger tires.

It is unusual for an axle or spring/frame to fail, but they certainly can. Looking at my trailer--the weakest point now is the axle. The trailer frame is certainly beefy enough.

The "pro" RVers--and one of the Monaco moderator is an automotive engineer who was a Federal DOT regulator--are very careful about matching the tires, wheels, bearings, axle's springs, air bags etc all together so the are both save and give a good ride. It is re-assuring to have someone of that caliber commenting on what is correct.
 
One subject we seem to have avoided for some reason, is that of tire temperature and pressure sensors. Almost all new cars have them. Most RV's have them, and there are plenty of "add on" systems: Such as the
http://www.tiresafeguard.com. My RV has an older unit which you cannot replace the batteries in--and I am going to upgrade to one of their units. I'll just throw it in the truck for monitoring the C Dory trailer tires.

I will still stop every two hours to check the hubs, with the IR thermometer.
 
On my way home from a day of crabbing w/ a work buddy and his two young sons. About 2 miles from my house...BAM!! Sounded like a shotgun going off. Passenger side rear trailer tire explodes. I limped it into a grocery store parking lot around the corner and changed it out. Center tread on the tire blew outward a good 6" long. Even the steel belt blew out. Impressive. The guy at Les Schwab kids, "you can patch that". Right. $121 bucks today at Les Schwab and then new tire is now the spare. It was one of the last four original tires from when I purchased the boat. So, when do I need to change the last three? They still have tread depth. But this blowout was so unique.
 
localboy":dp1xab5z said:
So, when do I need to change the last three?[/b] They still have tread depth. But this blowout was so unique.
Click to expand...

I think it's best to go by age for when to replace tires. I mean, of course you would replace a bald tire, but "plenty of tread" isn't a guideline if they have aged past replacement date (the rubber ages, even sitting on a shelf).

For RV tires, 5-6 years is the common recommendation. I have heard 3 years for trailer tires, partially due to the fact that it seems hard to get really high quality trailer tires (for love or money). So I guess on trailer tires there is a grey zone, but I wouldn't go over five years in any case.

My trailer tires (made in China - I could not find any US made ones in the size my trailer takes) have just passed their three year birthday. I will probably replace them sometime between now and this winter. They show no signs of deterioration, nor tread wear, and they have mostly been stored indoors; but still the date code says three years old. Even if I put it off, I'll do it before they "turn four."

Sunbeam
 
My trailer tires looked like new--were 4 years old, and one had a bulge on the side wall--all new ones last month. I would have done it at 5 years.

RV tires replaced at 5 1/2 years--40,000 miles, but lots of tread left. Asked the dealer if he could sell them for semi trailer use? Nope--if they are out of date by 5 years he will not re-sell them. May be his own rule.
 
I've blown two trailer tires in the past year, and I am guessing they were the original tires on my 2007 trailer. Guy I bought the boat from a few years ago didn't use the trailer much, and it was probably stored inside as the tires show no signs of cracking. The first one blew out last fall on the way to Lake Cumberland, and the second blew out last month on the way to the San Juans. Both tires still had a lot of tread and and didn't show any outside signs of cracking or impending failure. I had started running nitrogen in them a year ago, but not sure if that would hurt them after running regular air... The blowouts were pretty impressive, pretty much like the one just mentioned. Tires pretty much shredded! When the last one blew, with a long haul ahead of me, I purchased 3 new tires. One for the one that blew out, one for the cheap spare that was already showing cracking, and a third one to have with me, just in case. (Always pretty easy to find shops that can mount tires, but not always easy to find the tires!) I'll more than likely get a new spare soon, and then at the end of this year, mount the two newer tires and discard the original two tires. If I just had a single axle, I'd probably be more concerned about swapping the tires out sooner! :-) Colby
 
I will go against the grain on this one too. We have now trailered the Hunkydory for 70,000 miles, with a good deal of those miles on trips north to Canada & Alaska on not so good roads, with only two flat tires in all those miles & one of these happened when parked in storage with the boat off. Now what was the secret to this? Well for sure it wasn't replacing them after a manufactures or dealers recommended life span or just good luck. Three of the tires now on the trailer were manufactured in 2006 & still have decent thread with 20000 miles on them & we just returned from a trouble free 2200 mile trip last month.

What makes me replace a tire before the tread is sufficiently worn, is any sign of cracking, bulging or other defect or road damage & during the last 70000 miles several have been replaced for these reasons. It has been mentioned here before & & I think worth repeating, excessive heat is the number one destroyer of tires & this most often is caused by speed, under inflation or the combination, followed by road damage & defects, so keep the speed down, especially on hot road surface days, the inflation matched for the load they are carrying & check for proper inflation, defects & road damage often. I also have both mirror sides on the truck, set, so I can easily see the trailer tires & out of habit developed from many years ago being a professional truck driver, check them very often. Doing this, I've several times, caught slow leaks from nails or other road damage & stopped with replacement or patch before heat developed to cause a blow out.

I also think radial tires & slightly oversizing the tire for the load planned makes good since. With our duel axel trailer & the 22CD, I run the same size & load rated tire as DD does with his 23 Venture & now carry two good spares & not just on our long trips. On a duel axel trailer if you aren't able to stop very quickly, it's very likely the other tire will be stressed & possibly need replacing also.

From Michelin tire reps for off highway heavy equipment, I learned rain & wet roads especially gravel will greatly increase the tires vulnerability to puncture from a rock & he said that holds true with highway tires too. This was confirmed on a couple road trips by us in northern Canada where we drove several thousand miles on gravel & incurred 9 flat tires, most which came on rainy days & before I slowed down during them. These trips also convinced me of the justification for the extra cost in increasing the number of tire ply in those tires we had to purchase for replacement.

Mark, no recommendations from me to replace your tires now or not to. I'm simply sharing my experience as another factor to consider.

Jay
 
Jay, I think you put enough mileage on your trailer tires, to allow them to hold up better. Something about constant use allows the inner oils of the tire components to come out and protect the tires from ozone....I also think the constant use keeps them flexible. I don't really think trailer tires (RV tires in general) are made from any different components that standard auto tires are. TO my knowledge, trailer tires just have stiffer sidewalls. I'm still not absolutely sure I will replace my two older trailer tires, now on the trailer, with the new ones I have waiting to be mounted. I don't trailer over 65 on short hauls, and stay about 60 on longer hauls. I think the problem lies when tires are left to sit for long periods of time without use! BTW, what kind of trailer brakes do you have? Colby
 
Colby,

The last 20,000 miles have been electric over hydraulic before that on a single axel trailer it was surge brakes. On horse & other trailers I have ran either electric or no brakes.

Concerning your theory on constant use of tires adding to their longevity. I think it a good one, but I don't think it pertains to me, though maybe so if you don't mean periods of a year or more without use. Here in Wyoming my boat sits on the trailer covered for an average of 7.5 months a year without moving for the last 12 seasons, & most of the miles have come in a few months burst of long trips during a very short spring & then summer season.

I too, for the most part limit my speed to 60 mph or less, but on a return trip from Alaska where re turned via Calif, we made the last 940 miles in one day by traveling very fast across the hot Nevada interstate in August. There very likely was some luck involved that day in not having any flats.

I agree with the main difference with trailer tires & highway tires being the trailer tires side walls are stiffer & that is needed for the more constant back & forth sideways motion of a trailer, which can generate more heat & is also the reason for their recommendation of 65 mph top speed.

Jay
 
Jay: It's interesting reading your thoughts (backed up by plenty of experience). I probably sound like I work for a tire company or something :? And you know, over the years on my various cars and small pickups, I've often gotten 100,000 miles (or close to it) on a set of tires. Never even knew about date codes back then.

With the RV and trailer, the thought of tire problems is repugnant enough that I just play it safe and replace in the time periods I mentioned. Of course, for all I know, there were years left in them, but it's sort of like those deer whistles: if you put them on and don't hit a deer.... does it mean anything? Hard to prove a negative, so I'll never know. Would certainly be nice to replace tires less often.

Like you, I can see the trailer tires in my side mirrors - I really like that. I also do try to keep them inflated appropriately for the load, and check the sidewalls with an IR thermometer when I stop for gas. I had thought about getting a tire monitoring system, but... so far keeping it simple. I may change my mind on that though.

I do wish I had a better selection of tires though. I was only able to find "made in China" ones (not that China can't make good things, but it seems that typically that's not what companies ask them to do), and all but one brand is Load Range C. So far so good, but I wish I had more to choose from. I think I may go for the "one" Load Range D set I found, for a bit more margin ("Kenda" IIRC).

Sunbeam
 
Localboy,
If they aren't all cracked up, have noticeable budges, or any other obvious looking issues maybe you want to see what happens with the other three. If you are staying close to home it should not be too life threatening. The only thing I'd worry about is what would happen to your trailer fenders if you continue to run the Maypops. If I was doing longer trips I'd replace the others just for the fun of it. Take my advise I won't be using it. Be Safe
D.D.
 
And they will be very pleased to sell them to you. One more factoid on our present three tires with 20,000 miles & eight years on them. These are the remaining original tires that came with the trailer. The one flat I had, occurred on our return trip from Alaska while passing through Oregon at a speed of less than 60 mpg, when they where only one year old & at approximately 5000 miles of service. I would too would have made the manufacturer & dealers very happy following their advice. The three remaining tires of the original are now at the point, I will be replacing them or even sooner if another Alaska trip had been planned this year.

Jay
 
From Carlisle:

If a tire fails on a tandem axle trailer, replace both tires on that side.

If one tire fails, the remaining tires will be required to suddenly
compensate by supporting the increased load. This increase of weight
may overload the other tires causing a chain reaction blowout or other
internal structural damage. After a blowout, check the other tires for
damage and replace all tires on the side of the blowout.

http://www.carlisletransportationproduc ... ctices.pdf
 
And they will be very pleased to sell them to you
Click to expand...
I'm sure.

But the trailer is a 2006 and it was originally set up for a dealer in Idaho, then re-po'd to Kitsap Marine by the factory. I don't know the miles on it, but it is 8 yrs old and they are the original tires. The tires were basically $100 each + stem and tax. I'll probably get 2 new and use the one old remaining tire as the spare.

Like I said, thank god it blew when I was almost stopped and not doing 60.
 
My two axle trailer is a 2007 model EZ loader, I bought from Master Marine in Mount Vernon, Washington in 2010 as a new trailer. Among the specific items like electric over hydraulic brakes & tire upgrades, I requested was new tires upgraded from B to C. It wasn't to a couple years later, I realized, they pawned off on me tires manufactured in 2006 & were already 4 years old, when I made the purchase. That was just one of several things making it the last ever purchase from there for me.

Jay
 
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