Reality Check, Good deal?

C

curioustraveler

New member
Good evening C-Brats. I've been looking for a boat for the last couple of years and keep coming back to C-Dory's because they're just so stinking cool. If you've seen any of my other threads you'll remember we decided a 22 is too expensive for us so I tried to find a 19. Also started looking at Shamrocks and I was actually ready to make the move on a 22 foot Shamrock in the next week or so. But it's kind of hard to get excited about a generic looking walk-around boat.

My neighbor has had a C-Dory 22 Cruiser sitting in his driveway unused for the last couple of years and it's been very lightly used it's whole life. I asked if he's willing to sell and what he'd take for it. He came back with what I think is a very attractive price, $20,000 as is. I just got back from briefly looking at her and I wanted to bounce this off the community to get a reality check.

-She's a 2006.
-Honda 90 horsepower with maybe 150 hours. Hasn't been used in the last couple of years but he has fired her up and winterized her this past season.
-He pulled out the fuel tanks a few years ago because they had some crud in them. He ran her off of portable 6 gallon tanks. Still has the original tanks. I'm tempted to just run off some portable tanks too unless we find we are going long distances.
-Cushions are great
-Cabin seems dry and we've had lots of rain lately. There's a tiny leak from where the GPS antenna is installed. I didn't see any leaks around the hatches, windows or handrails.
-As far as he knows the electronics, bilge pump, and trim tabs work.
-There's some problem with the shore power. It runs to some type of inverter or something that doesn't work (I know it's not an inverter, don't know what it is.) We don't have shore power in our neighborhood marina so he never messed with it.
-I did notice some tiny amounts of seepage at several of the rub rail rivets. No current moisture but I could tell some water had seeped in there before. I've read about this on C-brats and I know that area can be a problem.
-Galley table has some damage from when a heavy-set passenger fell on it. Basically the hinges pulled out of the wood.
-Water tank has never been used.
-Alcohol stove has never been used.
-Trailer is in great shape but could use new bearings.

My plan is to charge the batteries then run it over to the Honda mechanic to check out the motor. If it's shot and she needs repowered it's probably still a good deal but not as great a deal. From what I understand this is about a $9,000 - $10,000 repower right?

If the motor checks out then I'll get a survey and go through all the systems to ensure they work.

Assuming the motor is fine and the systems all work, this seems like a really great deal that gets me into a great boat at a price I can afford. She needs a good cleaning and attention to a few items but hopefully nothing critical.

I'm interested in the community's thoughts. As much as I love C-Dory's and am excited about possibly being able to afford one, I don't want to make an emotional decision.

Thanks
 
Jimmie said:
I would buy it like yesterday before he changes his mind or dies.
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I tend to agree...pretty darn excited. But I want to make sure I'm not crazy. Even if it needs a repower and maybe 5 grand of other repairs, I'm still only at 35k with a lightly used boat.
 
That motor will probably turn out to be just fine. Keep it flushed lubed and fresh fuel and you will have a hard time killing it.
 
I'm sure you're right. For now I only need to tow her from my house around the block to the neighborhood marina. Eventually I'd love to get a better tow vehicle and actually take her somewhere.
 
Always easy to spend other’s money, but I would jump on it. It doesn’t sound likely that you would need to repower, but even if so probably worth it. Your repower estimate might be a bit low. My best recent search for a new Honda 90 is about $11,000 installed. All of the other deficiencies you mention would be fun DIY projects. Last year I replaced fuel tanks with new translucent tanks. Good luck and keep us posted. Ken
 
Thanks everyone. I'll keep you posted with what the mechanic says.

Even though this is probably a great deal, and I can see for myself what works and doesn't work, it's probably still worth a survey right? If nothing else, to see if there's hidden delamination or other issues.

He's not coming off the price any lower so I don't need a survey for negotiations. Still seems like $450 is worth it to uncover anything I'm not aware of.
 
Overall it sounds like you've found a great deal, which will get you and yours out on the water!

A couple of observations:

Re: the engine; I believe that was the year Honda introduced the redesigned 90. If you have the older variant (with carbs) you have a tank. They routinely gave >2,000 service hours with proper maintenance. Your initial service will include synching, or possibly rebuilding the carbs d/t the motor sitting for so long. If you have the newer variant (EFI) you have a more modern, efficient engine, which has been proven in the Honda Fit automobile. But, the early EFI models had well-documented (and very fixable) electronic control problems. This engine will have held up better to long-term disuse and be more operationally efficient, but might need initial de-bugging by a Honda Marine mechanic.

Re: the boat: The only thing that would kill the deal for me would be the presence of significant water intrusion into the balsa core. Repairs can get ugly. No reason to believe this boat has that issue, but your instinct to have it surveyed is correct IMO. Have the surveyor pay special attention to any areas where fasteners may have penetrated the floor (fuel tank hold downs, cabinet hold downs, etc). Luckily yours has the tanks removed which will facilitate this inspection.

Re: trailer: Very inexpensive to have the wheel bearings replaced. I suggest doing this sooner than later.

Assuming the CD 22 is what you want in a boat, this sounds like a great value. Best of luck moving forward!
 
The early Honda BF90Ds had a problem with the ECU. In my boat this caused surging if the engine ran between ~2000 rpm and ~4000 rpm. It doesn't hurt anything, but is pretty annoying. At idle and above 4000 it does not do it. If you only go fast and very slow, you won't notice a problem (like the original owner of my boat). The solution is to replace the ECU.

When I had it done, it was about $900 for the ECU (but mine was done under warranty).

The issue is described in Honda Service Bulletin 61.
 
I believe this is the carbureted motor.

Are the gunnels cored? I'm going to have the surveyor focus on a crack in the gunnel. Its at the outside edge of the gunnel. This is the largest area of concern for any water intrusion.
 
buy it and replace the water pump in the motor now. if they sit for to long then the pump blades get hard and brittle. easy to do your self and a cheap precaution.
 
I went over and took a more detailed look at her today. Spent a lot more time going through everything in more detail then I did the other day with the owner. I have to say she seems like a great boat.

I cleaned up all the leaves out of the cockpit to get a look at the tank area. From what I've read most C-Dory's had some type of panel mounted along the forward edge of the tanks. Where these panels mount to the cockpit sole is a source of water intrusion. This one had panels (removed when the owner pulled the tanks) but there are no holes in the sole. His panel's must've mounted in there some other way. The only thing holding the tanks in was a strap. The screws securing these straps to the sole look like they're bedded in some type of caulking.

These questions are probably better for their own threads but I'll just ask them here for now.

The bad crack I mentioned earlier is located right at the edge where the gunnel and the hull meet at the port lazarette. I assume this is cored and I assume its wet. Hopefully the surveyor can ID the extent of moisture. Can I just fill it with Life Seal for now until I can get it repaired? If it is wet, but isn't a structural problem, is it really that serious?

I checked along the entire length of the rub rail. It doesn't appear damaged or separated at all. But there's definitely a few spots where water has seeped in by the rivets. Has anyone run a bead of some sealant along the top and bottom edge of the rub rail just to prevent water getting in here?

He thinks there's a little leak where the GPS antennae wire comes through the cabin roof. I think it's actually leaking where the screw that holds the little shelf to the cabin top is located. It seems like I remember reading on here that someone else experienced a leak at that spot.

All in all though I have to say I'm pretty excited. She's actually in really great condition. Fingers crossed for the mechanic's report.
 
curioustraveler":3ankdgop said:
... I checked along the entire length of the rub rail. It doesn't appear damaged or separated at all. But there's definitely a few spots where water has seeped in by the rivets. Has anyone run a bead of some sealant along the top and bottom edge of the rub rail just to prevent water getting in here?
...
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The OP on my boat ran a bead of 3M sealant along the top and bottom sides of the rub rail where they meet the hull. No leaks and no evidence that the rail is coming loose.
 
The Mechanic checked her out today and gave a good report on the motor. He doesn't see any issues with it. 147 hours. He's suggesting we replace the water filter and do some other service items just to be thorough. Steering and rigging is good.

The quote to fix the crack by the lazarette wasn't bad either.

Next step is a survey.
 
I would have them replace the waterpump impeller, and maybe the pump depending on what things look like when they get into it. Also, weigh the zincs and replace if near half weight. Oil and gear lube for sure. The mechanic may have a list and I would go with that. Add the above if it's not on his list.

Harvey
SleepyC:moon

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Oh man, have the surveyor really pay attention to the core.
On our 19 we got into a bigger core repair waaay sooner than we expected and ended up putting $5k on top of $20k.

We had water intrusion into the sole. On the 19s there are panels that make the interior wall of the hull. When the factory built the boat they used rivets and over the years lots of water had gotten in and caused rot. The sole was never saggy and the bottom of the boat was still super solid but the freeze/thaw cycle can eventually cause irreparable damage to the fiberglass.

We also had a lot of core damage around the laz hatches. I believe that the cored areas in the gunwales is separate from the sole and the cored area around bow hatch. I also believe the hull coring doesn't extend forward very far into the v-berth area on the 19. Not sure if any of this holds for the 22.

That all being said, we could afford the repairs and my wonderful wife, winner of the Spouse of the Year award, didn't even get upset as the cost of the repair eventually doubled from the original estimate. Other shops quoted over 10k for the same repair.

I was already happy with the boat, and after a couple months of repair-induced-stress, I am happy once again.

IMHO this is a great safe boat that handles a lot of weather comfortably while using very little fuel to get places a little fast.

The 22 should be pleasant to trailer and put in/out of the water. The 19 is super easy with a 6-cyl Tacoma.
 
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