Ranger vs. C-Dory

[BTDT]

I believe that's a myth...the same engine block in an outboard (think only Honda and Suzuki do that) will be far more heavily stressed than in a car, where you are typically running 1/2-2/3 of redline, compared to much higher in most outboards. In an outboard, that block is putting out close to maximum power for a high duty-cycle, compared to automotive use. One reason: road rolling resistance is far lower than pushing water all day.
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I beg to differ, at least in my case. The redline on a Honda Accord is 7000 (13,000 rpm on their race version). I have never hit 7000 on my Honda 150 outboards nor will my prop let me. Normal usage is an extended warmup as I clear the no wake zone in my Marina, and then accelerate to 3500 RPM (50% of redline) for less than one minute to get on plane, and then back to 2900 to 3000 to cruise at 18 mph. There is no dust for the engine to inhale, below freezing temperatures are always avoided, and run time is always sufficient to warm up the engine and burn off the bad stuff (acids etc). I don't pull long grades or cross deserts in high summer heat, nor do I drive a short distance to work each morning. I guess time will tell but at 2500 hours if you equate that to a car I would think that's about 125,000 miles (50x2500), and my engines are running perfectly. I also understand law enforcement have seen In excess of 10000 hours on their Honda outboards.
:thup

 

[smckean (Tosca)]

My dual Honda 150 outboards (Honda Accord based) are fast approaching 2500 problem free hours, and knock-on-wood, I expect to get another 2500 hrs before even considering rebuilding.

Be sure to have the trust bearings checked for play periodically (no, not foreplay :roll: ). I lost my Honda 150 with only 1000 hours to that problem.

 

[ssobol]

Another advantage to the outboard application vs. a car is that the engine typically runs at about the same speed most of the time. Most people tend to cruise/troll/whatever at a constant speed and fairly constant load for relatively long periods. When driven in a city or town a car engine is always changing speed and load.

Starting and thermal stresses also occur less often. When we boat we go for a few hours at least. A car will typically start, run, and stop for anywhere from a few minutes to about an hour many times in one day.

In a boat there is no compression braking, and less load from accessories (no AC compressor, power steering, etc.).

 

[BTDT]

My dual Honda 150 outboards (Honda Accord based) are fast approaching 2500 problem free hours, and knock-on-wood, I expect to get another 2500 hrs before even considering rebuilding.

Be sure to have the trust bearings checked for play periodically (no, not foreplay :roll: ). I lost my Honda 150 with only 1000 hours to that problem.

Thanks, I read your "catastrophic Honda 150" post two years ago about your thrust bearing failure at 1100 hours. As I recall your Honda mechanic said he had seen it before on occasion but not often and most 150's seem to be OK. At 2500 hours who knows, but I'm keeping an eye on them and if one is failing I will put new powerheads on both

 

[Robert H. Wilkinson]

One reason: road rolling resistance is far lower than pushing water all day.

I would agree with this key point. A marine engine is under a constant load - more so while getting on plane - but always a load - there is no coasting while it is pushing against the resistance of the water. It would be the equivalent of driving your car up hill all the time.

Accessories - the Volvo 4.3(GM block) in my boat has belt driven P.S. and a 75 amp alt. This would be comparable to the equivalent car engine considering a lot of us charge a hefty sized house bank and sport a plethora of electronic gadgets 8) .

Regards, Rob

 

[smckean (Tosca)]

Yes, it was a sad story, but I am super happy with my new Yamaha 200! The CD25 sings with 200 horses, and given new engine technology, it weighs no more than the Honda 150 did (important since CD25s are stern heavy).

At 2500 hours who knows, but I'm keeping an eye on them and if one is failing I will put new powerheads on both.

As I undersand it, it is quite easy to check this. Once you remove the cover on top of the engine (easy and quick), there is a pully there that is attached to the crankshaft. Put a small steel pry bar under that pully and see if there is any play. I was told that if the thrust bearing starts to go, and you replace it (along with the re-designed heavy-duty spring that keeps the crankshaft properly suspended in its vertical orientation), the problem can be fixed for perhaps $3000. My re-power all told was closer to $25,000!......but I ain't looking back. I LOVE THE 200.

 

[BTDT]

Yes, it was a sad story, but I am super happy with my new Yamaha 200! The CD25 sings with 200 horses, and given new engine technology, it weighs no more than the Honda 150 did (important since CD25s are stern heavy).

At 2500 hours who knows, but I'm keeping an eye on them and if one is failing I will put new powerheads on both.

As I undersand it, it is quite easy to check this. Once you remove the cover on top of the engine (easy and quick), there is a pully there that is attached to the crankshaft. Put a small steel pry bar under that pully and see if there is any play. I was told that if the thrust bearing starts to go, and you replace it (along with the re-designed heavy-duty spring that keeps the crankshaft properly suspended in its vertical orientation), the problem can be fixed for perhaps $3000. My re-power all told was closer to $25,000!......but I ain't looking back. I LOVE THE 200.

Thanks Tosca and based on your initial ‘catastrophic Honda 150” post I immediately checked my thrust washer/main bearing play and both engines were OK. I also did a Google search at the time and your post was the first to appear so it doesn’t seem to be a huge Honda 150 issue. I did find that Honda Marine did a TSB for 200+ outboard engines for thrust washer and/or bearing play, but the Honda 150 problem appears to be a limited issue.

That said, my previous experience with a Suzuki 150 outboard was fantastic, and I congratulate you on your new Yamaha 200 acquisition, as it too is a great motor in my humble opinion. I was a little surprised the conversion to one Yamaha 200 cost you $25k, but then again I live in the mid-west where stuff is priced pretty low :thup

 

[smckean (Tosca)]

I was a little surprised the conversion to one Yamaha 200 cost you $25k......

Well, I fib a little :wink:

That was the total cost including tax and everything; however, included in that cost was a number of other changes I made. A big one was to go with digital controls; others included: the install of a new battery charger, water supply filter, repair of some battery switches, complete re-design of the helm station console to adapt the new Yamaha digital gauges that replaced the Hondas, and several other things. I was able to take advantage of a Yamaha deal which lowered the engine price a bit. I don't remember exactly, but I think the engine alone, delivered and ready to install, was around $15,000 (no tax).

I also did a Google search at the time and your post was the first to appear so it doesn’t seem to be a huge Honda 150 issue.

Hmmmmmm......I found quite a lot about this problem on the internet. All the Honda mechanics I checked with around here have seen it (usually multiple times). The most common estimate I got was that about 10% of that vintage engine ends up with this problem. That 10% seems to be mostly a matter of luck of the draw. Note that this issue only applies to certain model years. At some point Honda beefed up the support spring for the crankshaft and the problem no longer occurred.