Questions moving to covered moorage

S

seahooked

New member
Seahooked is making the move from dry storage to covered wet moorage at Edmonds marina later this month. Bottom paint is scheduled for next week, along with zincs on the trim tabs. Some questions since this is new territory for me:
- What cleaner can you use in the cockpit and on the exposed hull without sudsing up or polluting the water? Something that can kill mildew.
- I've always used the solid pellet dehumidifiers to keep the cabin dry. Since I now have power available should I switch to a small heater? If so, use a separate extension cord instead of the shore power cord because of possible issues with galvanic corrosion?
- How long do the zincs typically last when the boat is always in the water?
- I like to do my own engine maintenance but I'm the thought of changing oil and gear oil on the water scares me. I've read some prior posts about how this can be done successfully but I'm still nervous. The alternative is an expensive haul out fee (I have no trailer). Has anyone else faced this scenario?
- In Puget Sound does everyone leave their engine down in the winter to keep trapped water from freezing?
- Any other tips are appreciated as well.
Thanks,
 
The West Coast definition of mooring gets me every time. Ha ha, the East Coast version means connected to a permanent anchor off shore. Similar issues apply though....

I take delivery of my Tomcat in March. With my previous boat the zincs would last two seasons (salt water). My season is April through November. This was an I/O where part of the engine was always submerged. The beauty of outboards is that you can raise them fully from the water as you know. I would expect your zincs to last much longer. For metal kept in the water, zinc life really depends on your electrical setup and current near your boat.

If I am not mistaken, even tilted your outboards will drain out fully. The proximity of the tilted engine to the (warmer) water will protect it to some degree in the winter as well. It's a good idea to check with owners in your area for local knowledge. In Boston, owners keep engines tilted out all winter.

One thing you may have to deal with is Sea Gulls. My boat looks like a nest of bird **** in a week if I don't put up my Gull Sweeper. This does not show a good picture but here it is:

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/st ... 4&cid=6111

It's basically a wind driven device that will spin and harmlessly keep gulls from landing. It's worth every single penny....

You of course need to make sure you are set with good lines, fenders, and anti-chafe gear. I also think it's important to keep the curtains drawn (if you have them) to keep out interested eyes. Lastly, you will need to check on your boat more often to make sure batteries and bilge pumps are keeping her topside, lines are in good shape, fenders in place, not bumping the docks or other boats, etc. There may be some storms where you will want to remove her from the water.
 
Chris,

We've met and talked. My boat is currently moored in Edmonds under cover. I too do not own a trailer.

1. Cleaner: Don't know about that one. I just make sure to spray down my boat very well after each use. The marina encourages boat owners to spray down the boats to avoid the use of cleaners.

2. Humidity and heater: I use two of these http://www.drytheair.com/xcart/store/ca ... appys.html , which I just plug into the outlets in the boat. They keep the air 'warmer' (about 10 degree F) than the exterior and don't get hot so there is less of a risk of a fire. I haven't had any galvanization issues...at least not that I am aware of. Additionally, I have two of the water absorbing pellet containers and I keep the cabinet doors open. Maybe it's overkill, but then again it's cheap insurance.

3. Zincs: I went online and read that Bennett suggests that you only have zincs on the top of the trim tab, not the bottom. (Other opinions may vary) I have heard and I *believe* that Edmonds is a 'hot' marina. I change my zincs every 6 months. They're cheap.

4. Working on the boat: The marina is a certified green marina and they do not let you work on the boat motor in the water. Adding oil and changing fuel filters is ok, but you can't drain it. If they catch you it is a huge fine....maybe even expulsion. It cost approx. $160 to have the boat pulled from the water, pressure washed and returned to the water. Add some money to have it blocked, a plastic drop cloth and $25/day to store the boat in the work area. I think the last time I did this it was around $250 round trip + the oil change. It ain't cheap, but if you're like me and don't have a place to store a trailer, at $50/month to store it, if you only pull the boat every 6 months it breaks even.

5. Engine up or down: Up! This is my first winter in the marina, but all the boats with outboards around me have their motors up. If they do this same thing in Boston where it gets much colder (air coming off of land and not warmer sea water) then I think the practice is safe.

Theft - I've only heard of one theft from a boat in the 9 months that I've been in the marina. There are quite a few live-aboards who keep an eye on things.

Monitoring the boat - I only live 1 mile from the marina so I try to check in on the boat at least once a week. Trinity is my slip mate so I keep an eye on her too. Seeing that she's a beautiful Ranger Tug, it makes it a pleasant experience.

Winds and current - hopefully you have a slip near the middle of the marina. These C-Dorys can be a little squirrelly in the wind especially when you have to dock next to another boat every time you return to port. If you are on U dock - good luck! The wind blew me around a lot on that dock.

Birds - I have had the occasional bird dropping, but nothing too severe.

Dock - I purchased the end of dock wheel and had the marina put in the clips for my shore power cord. I thought both were good investments.

Dock lines - I have found it best to have 2 lines off the bow, and a spring line off the stern. This keeps my boat steady, but not constantly rubbing against my fenders.

Best of luck,
 
This is a great thread, with a whole bunch of questions that diversify into many more questions.

I'm particularly interested in the question about the necessity of tilting the motor up out of the water to avoid freezing of the remaining water trapped in the lower unit which could result in a cracked lower unit housing. If the unit does really drain, and tilting up is therefore harmless, a lot of us could do away with a great deal of algal and sea creature growth on the lower end. There are some solutions, discussed last month, but if we're only being intimidated by an old wives tale, it's time to dump the witch! (Hope I spelled that right!)

I 'll guess Bennett doesn't want zincs on the bottom of the tabs simply because of the drag they would produce. Most sources say replace zincs when they're half gone, but you can go somewhat further if you watch them carefully. Too bad we can't have a corrosion control system like the Mercathode system on my Mercruiser drives on my Sea Ray where the unit senses the electrolysis potential of the system and charges the drive unit with a charge to neutralize the corrosion potential. I honestly don't know if this system also works to control the electrolysis from stray currents, but it probably does at the same time as it can't differentiate between the two, although there would be a limit as to how much compensation could be done if the stray voltage is high enough to defeat the system.

Having water and Shore Power available at your slip and being in a covered berth are invaluable. Shore power turns your boat into a condominium, and the covered slip gets you out of the worst of the elements, making for a much more pleasurable situation and cutting down the weathering on the boat by about 3/4ths, except for the underwater portions. Roosting birds in the rafters can be a problem, but there are some ways to minimize this and frighten the birds down the line to dump on someone else's pride and joy! The water is useful to refill your tanks and wash the boat as necessary. My present slip doesn't have pressurized water available, so I bought a suitable pump to hang in the freshwater and power my own water system from the Shore Power. Makes washing the boat a lot easier.

I learned a lot from my first slip down in the California Delta at Ox Bow Marina in Isleton. We had all the amenities available, even cable TV, which I turned down. But the big discovery was about which side of the covered slips to be on. Half faced South, the other North. South facing slips got rained on heavily during storms, and got the hottest of the Sun during the summer. I even constructed mesh screens across the back of the slip to block out the rain and sun, which, incidentally, provided some extra privacy, though that wasn't important to me, although YMMV! Not much fun living 75 miles away from your slip, knowing that it's raining cats and dogs in the back of your boat! When I moved to Redding and had a sailing club friend as the moorage manager, I was able to get moved to the front of the waiting line for a slip, then pick out the one I wanted, where I wanted, with all the connections nearby.

Having a trailer is golden! I spent $5000 on one for my Sea Ray just to be able to do all the things you can do with one and can't do without one! Trailer storage for me I no problem. I'll get some of the cost back if I sell it with the boat someday, and if I sell the boat soon, will sell the nearly new trailer separately to better recover the cost. There are a lot of projects that are many times harder or nearly impossible to do while you're in the water than when you're at home with all your shop, tools, supplies, and convenient work situation.

I don't think you can have too many dock lines! The wind, waves, and current work 24/7 on your boat. Fenders shouldn't even have to work as the hull should be kept suspended between dock fingers w/o contact with them.

I've got 4 lines on each side of my C-Dory and 6 on the Sea Ray. Setting up and adjusting these lines is worth every minute of time it takes, Use elastic nylon lines to reduce shock on the boat's cleats, and keep the fenders out just in case something happens. I don't use elastic rubber snubbers, but in more challenging situations, they might well be necessary.

Another thought is to not only check on the boat at least weekly, but to start the motors to drive out moisture and lubricate everything with oil. Warm the motors up throughly, charge the batteries, and work fresh gas into the fuel system. Stay overnight if you can, and enjoy your boat throughly. The cost per hour goes down the more you use it! Using it helps drive out the nuisance moisture, too!

Make friends with the neighboring boat owners, live aboards, dockmaster, and night watchman. You can't have too many friends. They'll help watch out for your boat and be a lot of fun in a lot of other ways.

If you're afraid of docking in the wind, etc., you'll have to practice, which makes it easier each time and eliminates much of the anxiety. When I first thought about docking a 8000 lb.boat with a flying bridge in a covered space with only 1-1/2 foot on either side of the boat and less than a foot of clearance on the bridge binini, I thought of devising a "catch net' set of lines to coral the boat into the center of the slip, but found out I could usually get it in without touching the sides of the docks. It's a short learning curve, I guess. Helps to have twin engines with vectored thrust, too.

(I may add to this, but have to go for now!)

Joe. :thup :teeth
 
Joe,

Your comment:
the big discovery was about which side of the covered slips to be on. Half faced South, the other North. South facing slips got rained on heavily during storms, and got the hottest of the Sun during the summer.
Click to expand...
is a good one.

At first I wanted a slip on the North side of the docks, for all the reasons you mentioned. I was offered a slip away from U dock, but it was on the South. To get away from U dock I jumped on it. Up here the sun beating on the boat isn't as much of a problem as it is down in California (where I am originally from). The rain from storms can be. People solve the problem in several ways. I bought a camperback canvas so my rear deck stays dry during the storms. Others back their boats in so that the bow gets wet and the stern deck stays dry.

The other thing is wind direction and which side of the boat you want to dock on. In Edmonds we share slips so you can have a port or starboard tie (assuming you face into your slip). This may take some conceptualization but...if you have a North slip (boat facing South) with a starboard tie and the winds come from the North-West (blowing South-East), docking the boat can be a total pain! You're docking up wind with a boat right next to you. It takes a lot of practice to feel comfortable docking a flat bottom boat in those conditions all the time. Good thing is that you can get on a waiting list and over time figure out where you'd like to be...North or South, Port or Starboard tie.

Food for thought.
 
Chris,

About leaving the outboard up or down during freezing weather.

IF ALL the water actually drains out of the powerhead, leg and lower unit, then the motor could be left tilted up.

However, if any debris plugs just one drain hole, the freezing of that water can split open the lower unit or powerhead. As I recall, even salt water freezes at about 25 degrees F. That freeze damage is not covered by warranty and may be excluded by insurance policies.

If the motor is left down, the temperature of the sea water can help keep the entire motor from freezing. Puget Sound water is about 45 degrees, and the aluminium leg of the motor conducts that relative heat up to protect the motor. Outboard motors also drain better in the vertical position.

I would leave my motor down during periods when the temps are projected to go below freezing. I would also leave heat on inside the boat to protect the fresh water system from freezing.
 
I leave my TomCat in the water under a covered slip all year long. In Oklahoma. I had planned to keep the engines tilted up, but the marina owner and mechanics all said to keep the outboard down in the water to avoid freeze damage, so that's that for me! I am not in a position to outvote ppl who've been raised in the area on the water and worked on boats longer than I've lived!

John
 
Well, this is my first winter with the boat in the water, so maybe the motor should be kept in the water. Here is an article from October of 2007 on Boats.com that states as much:

http://www.boats.com/news-reviews/artic ... aintenance

(I added this comment later)

One thing about Edmonds...it doesn't really get that cold. All the snow that the PNW has been having lately, none fell at sea level in Edmonds. Last year, maybe a dusting on one day. East of Edmonds, above the 'bowl' it gets much colder. 25 degrees F...I'd be curious to know how often it has ever gotten that cold in downtown Edmonds or the Edmonds marina.
 
Cleaner: If some bio friendly thing like "simple green " doesn't work (which is rare), then I use Bar keeper's friend. It is much more friendly than chlorine based cleaners.

I prefer the Mighty dry, dehumidifier--it is a marine refigeration type unit, but in the PNW, a heater will do just as well. I prefer the oil filled heaters; they are safer. Techinically you should use the power--and if the boat is properly wired, with a galvanic isolator, there should be no problems.

If there are not miss wired boats around the marina, or the marina is not misswired, then the zincs should last at least a year.

I would NOT leave the motor down. After shut down, let it drain in the water, full down position, then bring it up, out of the water.

If you can change pull the oil out thru the dipstick hole (it will leave some in the lower crank case), then this is a simple way, to use a suction unit. This can be manual vaccum or a motor driven unit (like Jabsco or shureflow) Don't try and drain the oil directly from the lower crank case drain when in the water.
 
Don't forget also that some PNW marinas are in river estuaries (Such as Everett) where the fresh water outflow sits on top of the salt chuck and freezes first. Fortunately the movement helps a little but even last year we had reports of hitting ice floes in Saratoga passage.

Merv
 
Lots of great information. Certainly more things than I had crossed my mind. Thanks guys.

Sarge,
What do you mean in stating you purchased the 'end of dock wheel'? Also, I'll be a new neighbor. I'm on the south side of D dock with a west-side tie (D54)
 
Regarding dehumidifying the cabin, I've often thought of getting something like this:

http://www.naturestapestry.com/dehumidifier2.html

taking out the tub that collects the water and sitting it either in or suspended over the sink. When it removes the moisture from the air, in theory, it would then just drop the condensed water into the sink to trickle out the drain.

Seems ingenious to me, which makes me think there is something seriously wrong with my idea.
 
FWIW, almost all the boats with outboards in my marina are moored with the motors tilted up and out of the water, winter and summer.
 
Sarge":257v2kjw said:
Regarding dehumidifying the cabin, I've often thought of getting something like this:

http://www.naturestapestry.com/dehumidifier2.html

taking out the tub that collects the water and sitting it either in or suspended over the sink. When it removes the moisture from the air, in theory, it would then just drop the condensed water into the sink to trickle out the drain.

Seems ingenious to me, which makes me think there is something seriously wrong with my idea.
Click to expand...

Sarge-

I sounds like it would work to me, but there are some considerations:

1. Price tag ='s $240.

2. Uses 440 watts when on, and therefore must be used with Shore Power.

3. Would the dehumidifier up at the counter level remove the humidity down at the floor level where it is the coldest? Does moisture condense there because of the cold condition of the hull with the water on the outside? I think most heater units for dehumidifying boats are to be placed somewhere down in the lowest part of the boat.

4. Would logically need a timer to sequence it on a few times a day or at an interval of a few to several hours, alternately one could use the humidity settings and automatic control system.

5. Will the machine fit in the small sink? If not, it would fit in a tub that could have a hole in it above the sink.

6. It might just be easier to have a heater in the bottom of the cabin and a small vent open to exchange the air.

But then don't take advice from me, I got caught being wrong today once already!!! Ha! :lol:

Ideas like this are fun! :idea Get some more! :idea :idea :idea

Joe. :thup :teeth
 
Sarge,

Get a portable room A/C unit like the De Longhi 9,000 which has dual intake/exhaust tubes and it evaporates and expels the water from dehumidification. It has a setting for Dehumidify.

John
 
Well, I live at the top of the bowl in Edmonds and the temperature right now is 31 degrees F. I ran down to the boat to check what the temperature was in the marina. It was 35.6 degrees F.

I also made a point to look at every boat I could that had an outboard motor to see how they were positioning their motors - every boat I saw, without exception, had it's outboard raised.

Maybe if Edmonds, WA was further north things would be different...
 
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