North Pacific 28?
- Thread starter Best Day
- Start date
I have to laugh--we go around again about the speed. I only wanted to point out to you that there are lots of folks who are more than happy with low speed boats. The issue is that the smaller engine boat is more economical--be it a 50 foot trawler or a 22 foot trawler.
Putting a large engines in the boat designed for fast running will not give the same economy as in a boat designed for slow running at displacement speeds. For example, I had a Symbol 42 foot Motor Yacht with Cat 3208s--running at 8 knots, it got 2 miles a gallon. (2 gallons an hour per engine or 4 gallons an hour) To sustain the larger engines on a plane, you have to have a different hull form. At 18 knots---slurrp! This planing hull form will not be efficient at lower speeds. On the other hand, a Willard 40 with a 80 hp engine cane get close to 6 miles a gallon.
Some people want fast boats--they should buy boats which are designed for that type of running. Some people are satisfied with a slow, efficient boat. I have over 200,000 miles at sea--rarely over 8 knots--it works for me--and thousands of others.
As for outrunning storms. I believe that you have lived in the S. Florida area, and realize that it is difficult to outrun a squall approaching at 30 knots--which is not uncommon. I deal with this much of the time. My 18 foot deep V center console will run at about 40 knots--and I cannot outrun storms. (I also avoid going out in really bad conditions) I have owned a number of Deep V's where in rough water I had to slow down to 8 knots--and this can be miserable in this type of boat.
Dene--I wonder what Sam Devlin would think about 120 hp in your boat? Devlin has designed some fast boats. Another issue might be the way the boat is put together. Maybe time to buy the Ranger 25 if you are unhappy with the Devlin.
Putting a large engines in the boat designed for fast running will not give the same economy as in a boat designed for slow running at displacement speeds. For example, I had a Symbol 42 foot Motor Yacht with Cat 3208s--running at 8 knots, it got 2 miles a gallon. (2 gallons an hour per engine or 4 gallons an hour) To sustain the larger engines on a plane, you have to have a different hull form. At 18 knots---slurrp! This planing hull form will not be efficient at lower speeds. On the other hand, a Willard 40 with a 80 hp engine cane get close to 6 miles a gallon.
Some people want fast boats--they should buy boats which are designed for that type of running. Some people are satisfied with a slow, efficient boat. I have over 200,000 miles at sea--rarely over 8 knots--it works for me--and thousands of others.
As for outrunning storms. I believe that you have lived in the S. Florida area, and realize that it is difficult to outrun a squall approaching at 30 knots--which is not uncommon. I deal with this much of the time. My 18 foot deep V center console will run at about 40 knots--and I cannot outrun storms. (I also avoid going out in really bad conditions) I have owned a number of Deep V's where in rough water I had to slow down to 8 knots--and this can be miserable in this type of boat.
Dene--I wonder what Sam Devlin would think about 120 hp in your boat? Devlin has designed some fast boats. Another issue might be the way the boat is put together. Maybe time to buy the Ranger 25 if you are unhappy with the Devlin.
thataway":249a63v6 said:
Sam has done it although I don't know the exact evolution. My 27' Devlin is called the Black Crown and Sam still makes them in a 29' version with a private head and a 150 hp stern-driven diesel. There are a couple on Yachtworld for a cool 150k. He also has the layout displayed on his website.
I'd love to have a Ranger 25 and have every intention of buying one when I retire in 5 long years. The Devlin is a stepping stone and it's nice in many respects. Right now, we're at Blake Island State park by our lonesome. It's 40 outside and 65 inside, with virtually no condensation (a nice trademark of a wooden boat). Even better, we used a whole gallon to make the 9 mile trip from Brownsville to here. The previous boat, a Carver, would have slurped 12 gallons.
Good points about the reality of outrunning a storm. Avoidance is the best measure.
-Greg
Hey this is 2009, not 1968.
When I bought my Woodson Tri-hull in 69, I had a 150 hp Johnson engine on it, everyone just gazed at the engine and asked me what in the world do you need all that power on a 19 ft boat. Now they install 150 hp on 15' skiffs.
When it comes to Ranger, the best thing I every did is make the investment and spring for the Cummins 150. Even though the boat will do 24 mph, most of the time, I run 6-8 mph. However, if i need it, it's there!
Like I said, the 40 hp engine is not in that boat to save fuel - it's in there to compete with other boats with "Real" engines in them. They should be ashamed offering that boat under-powered. Heck, that's not much more power than the Ranger 21, and remember, it's not that fast either.
When I bought my Woodson Tri-hull in 69, I had a 150 hp Johnson engine on it, everyone just gazed at the engine and asked me what in the world do you need all that power on a 19 ft boat. Now they install 150 hp on 15' skiffs.
When it comes to Ranger, the best thing I every did is make the investment and spring for the Cummins 150. Even though the boat will do 24 mph, most of the time, I run 6-8 mph. However, if i need it, it's there!
Like I said, the 40 hp engine is not in that boat to save fuel - it's in there to compete with other boats with "Real" engines in them. They should be ashamed offering that boat under-powered. Heck, that's not much more power than the Ranger 21, and remember, it's not that fast either.
IdleUp,
Time and memory!! :crook A google search shows that the J/E V-6 engine was introduced in 1976, not 1969! :wink
Link: http://www.sterndrive.info/outboardmotor/engine_history.html
A V-4 was the largest J/E in 1969.
Larry H
Retired J/E mechanic.
Time and memory!! :crook A google search shows that the J/E V-6 engine was introduced in 1976, not 1969! :wink
Link: http://www.sterndrive.info/outboardmotor/engine_history.html
A V-4 was the largest J/E in 1969.
Larry H
Retired J/E mechanic.
Rob & Karen
New member
Edited....I decided it was not worth commenting. I can't delete, so I will leave it at this.
IdleUp":1rtz61mz said:
Getting back to the boat in question--which is the Chesapeake Marine design 28 trailer trawler. The company sells plans, and can arrange to have a boat built--but they are not putting in a low HP engine for price point--they are doing it to keep running costs economical. The whole "Trawler" name has become corrupted, since "Trawler" means a commercial vessel which is designed for dragging nets. Probably the use of the word Trawler Yacht came with the importation of the Malhide (Scotland) converted fishing trawler hulls which were made for the yacht market. The word trawler evolved first to be any slow displacement motor vessel, then came "fast trawler"--an oxymoron, and now some which can make as much as 30 knots.
I predicted from the plans that the Ranger 25 would not meet performance expectations. I didn't buy one for several reasons--including that the boat would have lower resale without the ability to plane.
I first owned power boats in the late 50's: a 13 foot Wolverine with a 25 hp Johnson--and a 15 foot ZinCraft with a 35 hp Evinrude--both of these boats were adequate to pull me on a solom ski. As Larry noted I believe that the largest V outboard by Johnson in 1969 was the 115 hp: Merc had a 6 cyl inline engine. I had a 115 hp Evinrude (same as Johnson) which was a V 4 on an 18 foot runabout in 1969.
Actually it is still 2008, and trawlers are very much in--with many boats going only displacement speeds, and selling for millions of dollars.
IdleUp":178nkd5q said:
Bob can speak for himself, but I'm sure he wasn't referring to your Cummins powered R-25.
Bob correctly predicted, that the initial R-25 performance numbers Ranger was hoping for with the original Yanmar, would not be achieved - he was spot on, as many early buyers validated.
Use the search if you are interested...
Good thread. I agree 99% with Bob. I bite on the printed word. Printed word being, no weight in the boat at all. No water , no fuel, no girls, no beer. and one little skinny guy running the boat, 20 knots. But my wife and I thought it was cute. The 1% I would disagree with Bob is, it still had good resale value after two years. Like he said there are lots of people that buy a boat to slow down their life, kick back and relax. That is what boating is all about. So loaded down it was a 10 knot boat, bottom line.
Right now the displacement hull boats are what have the resale value. :thup :beer :beer :wink:
captd
Right now the displacement hull boats are what have the resale value. :thup :beer :beer :wink:
captd
Sorry, I should have stated " with the 125 hp engine". I also agree that the 25 has had great resale value--and will continue to have it. The boat is definately capable of planing. We did run one of the early boats with a 125 and with 4 people aboard it was marginal at WOT. Going to the 150 Cummins was a great move by Ranger.
At this point in life, speed was important at times--and even more important was draft. We have a sand bar at the entrance to our bayou which prevents a boat with more than 18" draft from getting in and out during our winter low tides (Northerly wind blows the water out of the Gulf of Mexico, causing tides during the winter to be at least a foot lower than during the summer). Plus we wanted the ride of the Tom Cat.
At this point in life, speed was important at times--and even more important was draft. We have a sand bar at the entrance to our bayou which prevents a boat with more than 18" draft from getting in and out during our winter low tides (Northerly wind blows the water out of the Gulf of Mexico, causing tides during the winter to be at least a foot lower than during the summer). Plus we wanted the ride of the Tom Cat.
Bob,
We have a good friend in Panama City. His home is right on St Andrews Bay. In the summer at low tide he has to wade out to his little 12 ft boat. That is if there is a enough water to wade into. He just pulls the boat in and parks it in his yard on the trailer for the winter. Nice spot though......
Now there is a red neck town if I have ever saw one. Having nothing to do with Doc J.
One of these days we ought to catch you at Wefings or somewhere in the vicinity. Met Byrdman one day a year or two ago. I pulled a Ranger up your way for Marc for the boat show. Should have hung around and met some of the Brats. We are going to do more of that in the future. Summers, we hope to join some of the gatherings in the Northwest. I think Mis Dee is starting to get interested in some of this flat water boating. She is planning on getting off the boat in Palm Beach and an old buddy is going to join me for the Abacos toward spring. This time it will again be " the Bahamas or bust." I'm banking on the the 150 Cummins to get us there this time. ( not that there is anything wrong with the Yanmar.)
captd
We have a good friend in Panama City. His home is right on St Andrews Bay. In the summer at low tide he has to wade out to his little 12 ft boat. That is if there is a enough water to wade into. He just pulls the boat in and parks it in his yard on the trailer for the winter. Nice spot though......
Now there is a red neck town if I have ever saw one. Having nothing to do with Doc J.
One of these days we ought to catch you at Wefings or somewhere in the vicinity. Met Byrdman one day a year or two ago. I pulled a Ranger up your way for Marc for the boat show. Should have hung around and met some of the Brats. We are going to do more of that in the future. Summers, we hope to join some of the gatherings in the Northwest. I think Mis Dee is starting to get interested in some of this flat water boating. She is planning on getting off the boat in Palm Beach and an old buddy is going to join me for the Abacos toward spring. This time it will again be " the Bahamas or bust." I'm banking on the the 150 Cummins to get us there this time. ( not that there is anything wrong with the Yanmar.)
captd