New 22 Cruiser Molded Interior - Good or Bad?

New C-Dory Molded Cabinetry - Good or Bad?

  • Good

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Bad

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Don't care

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • I'll decide once I see it

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    0
Da Nag

Da Nag

Administrator
Staff member
C-Dory has introduced many new features to the 22 Cruiser in the last couple of years, most of which have had positive reviews.

However, the recent decision to move away from the hand-built Decraguard cabinets to a molded solution has not been met with universal appeal.

What's your take on this decision? Vote, and let's let C-Dory know how the community feels.
 
Me...I understand the appeal from a manufacturers point of view, and don't discount the the beneficial aspects mentioned by those who have them in other boats, i.e. the Cape Cruisers.

However...my initial reaction is not positive. I think a huge part of the appeal to C-Dorys, is the ease with which owners can modify things to suit their individual tastes, wants and needs. Our albums are filled with customizations that make each of our boats unique, and I can't imagine not having that ability...assuming a molded interior precludes such modifications, or makes them substantially more difficult.

Still, I'll hold off on condemning the decision completely until I see them, and get feedback from the new owners. But as of now...I'm sure glad I have the old style.
 
I'd like to see some photos of what they are doing. Generally, though, I would not
favor a molded interior. If I had a choice between a used boat or a new with
molded, then I would probably go with the older.

Molded cockpit...mmmm. Probably prefer one, so long as good clearance is
given to cleat backsides, etc.

Mike
 
I just posted on the other thread about this. But I think it could be a huge improvement. First of all a flat floor, in the cabin would be much nicer in my mind, and I would be more inclined to make a custom carpet that buttoned down to the insert. I don't like drilling holes in the current floor though, even if sealed well. Plus this is one thing my wife doesn't like is the floor in the cabin, or the old style floor in the cockpit ( she loves our cockpit floor however) The cabinets while easy to customize, seem harder to keep clean than fiberglass, and more difficult to repair when banged up or scratched ( I have two young boys) where if it was fiberglass you could probably match the gelcoat and make it look pretty new again. Plus if it is more quiet at slow speed, being less seperate pieces to rattle that is nice.
I am going to add shelves etc.. But will not really change the exterior of the cabinets etc, so for me there is no real benifit of the decraguard interior. I can see where some have made custom countertops etc, it is easier to work with and leaves alot of options open. But what is the real percentage of people who have done that sort of thing to boats sold? I would think 10-15% (total guess) maybe have customized that much, which is by no means a majority. If more than 50% of the owners did mods, I would think it might be worth leaving as is. Plus with the type of owners here ( read creative), I think we will still see some pretty neat custom stuff done anyway, just a different medium to work with. Billy did that extension for his boat, and I have no doubt that others could do some sweet glass work.




$.02

Sark
 
I voted for the "I'll decide when I see it" opinion. Of course, by the time you see it, it's a done deal. :wink:

When we first looked at a C-Dory, the interior did have a bit of a "home made" feel to it... not as finished appearing as many other mass-produced boats. You folks here helped me "see the light" and appreciate that interior. When I've shown our boat to others who have never seen a C-Dory before, there is often that first "kinda spartan" look on their faces. More from the interior walls, though, than from the cabinetry.

I did have a sloop that had a molded interior - more of a stark white interior. Owners of those boats still did many modifications to that plain interior. Some owners removed the plexiglass cabinet doors and installed wood, others laid down a teak & holly floor. The description "chlorox bottle" got used a lot. A lot of things were done to try to "warm up" the feeling of that interior.

I thought I'd ask for a woman's point of view... the first thing Joan noticed when we looked at the Cape Cruiser at the Seattle Boat Show was the molded interior. I thought she'd like it better because it was more "finished" looking. Not the case - she thought it was cheaper looking. Asking Joan now about the possibility of C-Dory making this change: "Why? The two boats are so similar as it is. Why would C-Dory do anything to make their boat more like the Cape Cruiser?" Good point.

Well, I understand the economics of manufacturing. There is a reason SO many boat builders have a molded liner: it costs less and requires less craftsmanship to assemble. More uniformity.

I like my interior just the way it came: functional, just like the boat itself. I got some of the decreguard (sp?) from the factory to be able to add a few details. A change of interior wouldn't sour me on these great boats... it would just change some of the "personality".

Yeah, I'll wait and see what the factory thinks the next buyer is going to want.

Best wishes,
Jim B.
 
I voted "good". I think in the long run the molded cabinets will be more durable. You can still change fiberglass, or put in other cabinets if you desire. The console is fiberglass--weren't some of the origionals wood?
 
By the time we see it, it'll be a done deal, they will have invested in the molds, etc, etc. Guess we'll have to live with whatever they do, could change in the future if sales go down. May make it less expensive though, or (since nothing gets less expensive), no more expensive than it is. I'm sure thats why they're thinking about going that way.

charlie
 
OK, here's a wannabe's first impression . .

"Change" always produces "stress". This is true whether the change is 'good' (new house; marriage; new boat . . . ) or 'bad' (divorce; foreclosure; death in the family). So I have to admit, this move away from the familiar seems a little stressful.

Our ultimate goal (for the present time, at least) would be a 25-C. Given the expense, however, and the very good re-sale value of all the CD's, there seems to be a significant advantage to getting what we can ASAP, and then moving up as it becomes possible. This gets us out on the water sooner rather than later. For a variety of reasons, anything less than '90 CD-22C doesn't seem to feel like the right fit, so that would be a good start. Re-power might be necessary, but that only adds to the value, so the out-of-pocket cost will probably not be too great when the boat is re-sold.

Now, moving to the question at hand.

- Recent articles by several experienced surveyors DEPLORED the existence of liners which literally prevent them from doing their job.

- I'm not sure I agree with the modest percentage of 'interior re-models' described above. I DO find the ABILITY to re-model/revise to be an extremely valuable topic on this site, providing lots of ideas, examples, and techniques for those that choose follow this path.

- Bill and El (and others) have made the point that a LOWER center of gravity for one's feet adds considerably to one's comfort and safety. As a boat rolls from side to side, your motion is minimized (in contrast to sitting 8 feet above the water on as flying bridge, for example). I would assume a modest increase in deck level would not be too much of a factor here, but again, I can't personally attest to this either way.

- Will ANY systems become less accessible? Plumbing? Tanks? Cleat backings? Anchor lockers? WIRING?

- The change will almost certainly (?) be more economical from a production standpoint. Will this ultimately be more profitable?

- Will the result look like the proverbial 'chlorox bottle?'
- Will this change ADD VALUE to the end-result?
- If less desirable, will it decrease demand, and potentially decrease profits?

- The recent helm seat addition (Discovery) looks great. How easy, or hard, would this be with a molded interior?

- Several owner have created a starboard settee in place of (or rather, a modificaton of) the standard table/seat/bunk configuration. Again, looks like a great idea. Still possible? Harder?

- Of most concern (sitting in my living room), would be the ability to install new cleats with SOLID backing, or to upgrade original cleats as desired. Possible? If so, how much more difficult?

Current impressions: I could see the answers to all these questions tipping the balance for me toward a later ('98 - '06) model, rather than buying new from the factory.

Having not seen the proposed changes, it would be unfair (and obviously premature) to 'condemn' this decision. However, a HUGE advantage to the current design is the STARK SIMPLICITY of the underlying platform. Given a solid hull, EVERYTHING can be upgraded over time. "Model years" (with a few notable exceptions) become virtuallay irrelevant. If the proposed changes mean that the 'current factory design' becomes more influential that the 'underlying platform', this may create a fundamental shift in the philosophy behind this boat, and the 'cult following' that has developed around it. (Think Sea-Ray? Think Bayliner?)

Again, "change" is always "stressful". How this will play out remains to be seen.

e.g.
 
I guess if an owner of a new boat wanted to change anything (assuming the molded thing is going to happen), just grab the ol' sawz-all and let her rip! Build any kind of cabinetry desired after tearing out the molded stuff. I'm happy with our 2001 model and never want another boat. She's all we want or need, so not really an issue for us. I like the interior material as it is. One thing I find interesting is the factory's total silence on the issue. What does that tell you?

Rick
 
I have an old boat with a flat floor already so thats not a problem for me and I happen to like the work boat look and feel. My boat is like my favorite recliner, well used and comfortable.

I dont like a molded liner on any boat for many of the reasons previously mentioned; particularly the lack of access to through bolts and backing plates. I also think that a lot of production ills can be hidden behind a molded liner.

Having said all that, I suspect that people that buy them will be just as resourceful and enjoy their boats as much as everyone else. I just hate to see anything that changes the charcter such a unique boat. It will be interesting to see how this turns out.
 
While I like the idea of being able to do some customization on the interior, I have to admit - I HATE the decagard. It's hard to keep clean (especially for those who fish and go in and out a lot with occasional blood on their hands), it looks kinda cheap, it weighs a far amount, the installation is so-so (attached to the floor with steel - not ss steel - angle brackets and screws) and it doesn't hold it's shape well (my cabinet doors are not as flush as they used to be). I've been tempted to yank out my entire interior and re-do it in some decent teak and teak plywood. Would look a LOT nicer and be easier to keep clean. And while I'm a mediocre carpenter, I could do a better job than what was put in. Just my 2 cents worth. Oh yeh, and I still love my C-dory regardless of my complaining 'bout this.
 
It is simply a catch 22 situation in my opinion. I'm a 25 ft guy so there is no real relevence but here is my opinion anyway.
1. Yes it may be more difficult to outfit / upgrade a molded interior due to problems fastening or in consideration of the other limitations of fiberglass.
2. As bad as everything leaks on my boat I see future problems with the wooden cabinetry in the cabin that will need addressed in the future due to inevetable water damage.
In conclusion; those initial dissapointments could be offset with future maintenance cost savings!
Being as resistant to change as we seem to be I am sure this subject will get a lot of press in the future. By the way has anyone confirmed the validity of the new interior? Mike on Huda Thunkit
 
I don't know what is planned, but molded componenants are not the same as a full hull liner. My recollection is that there is already molded foreward furniture in the 22 (the V berth and bulkhead). If just the cabinets are molded, this is not a full liner--and accessability is no different. A full molded liner would add weight--and that should be avoided. The TC 255 has a molded cockpit floor and sides--not a disadvantage. The aft bulkhead is molded (some of the older C D 22 were wooden). I would think that the seat and shelf modification is just as easy with glass as with wood. Part of the problem is that people are not as used to working with glass panels, as they are with wood. If one has skills in glass working, all sorts of things can be done. In our boat bulding days, we made major modifications to the hull, cockpit etc in the glass, and it was fairly easy to do.
 
While I can certainly see some advantages to a more rigid, fully formed and integrated molded interior for the average boater, I still like the wood interior, especially the older Decaguard with the wood grain look, which I think looks a bit more traditional and fitting with the rest of the boat's appearance, right down to the real teak handrails and wooden door.

There is no question that the designs up to now have been more easily modifiable that the new molded system will be.

Perhaps they can offer the older Starboard or even the wood grained Decaguard interior, wood door, etc. as an option for some additional $ if it costs more to build. Someone just the other day on the site here showed us a very recent boat with wooden hand rails, so that option at least did exist recently.

Old School Joe's $.02.
 
My vote is unqualified "bad." The molded interior was one of the negatives on the CR25 Tug. Bob Austin may be able to deal with a molded interior as easily as Decraguard, but most folks find the interior customizations a LOT easier to make with Decraguard and teak trim than glass...would there be a Barber Chair with a molded interior? All the drawer and shelving modifications? Our own (David designed) under-galley floor and pull-out baskets? The under helm-seat cutting board? Of course not. Decraguard is by its nature infinitely modifiable, molded interiors are not...QED.
 
Molded fiberglass interiors are rarely done nicely. Typically, wiring and
hoses are run before the molded components are dropped in, resulting
in inaccessable wires or hoses, and the interior of the cabinetry is
usally rather rough, or the roughness is covered up with carpet.

The other day, we realized there is no vinyl and no clear
plastic on this boat. We were left wondering why there is a can
of spray 210 plastic cleaner left on board by the previous owners, but
no matter. It's nice not having to deal with these cheap, unstable
materials.

It has been said a number of times that the molded component
would be quicker and cheaper to install. I wonder if that is true if
properly glassed in and finished inside and out?

The current materials are much easier to work with. I can drive a
3/4" screw through something and install it in the cabinent. Not so
easy when dealing with thin fiberglass.

C-Dory needs to really understand who buys their boats and why.
Rushing off and making their new boats look like all the other
boats available may not increase sales like they think. Or
perhaps a new type of boater will start buying C-Dory and the
older ones will increase in value since they will be in demand by
those whose needs are no longer being served by the new boats
C-Dory makes.

Mike
 
That
very recent boat with wooden hand rails
Click to expand...
was probably mine... or, at least she's mine for the next day or so. But I requested that the factory omit the handrails (read; no holes) and had Les install the wooden handrails so that the outside rails are through-bolted with the inside handrails (again, read; minimum no. of holes). This was just something that I REALLY wanted to have, and it was inspired by all the photos of the older boats posted on this site.

Corwin
 
I could see an advantage . You could hose out the cabin floor with out the ply-wood ends getting soaked. Done properly it may offer some really nice dry storage space. However A fiber glass sink top looks cheap something I disliked immediately about the "CC".


May also add a little strength to the hull.(not that its needed)

I wonder how you would deal with the water tank access ect....

Yep I'm sceptical. We will see.

Chris Bulovsky
Washburn Wi
 
Seen alot of comments about the difficulty in cleaning cabinets. Initially I found the shoe scuffs ect were almost impossible to remove. Then I tried one of those "magic eraser" foam pads. They truley are magic. Just a little water and no soap and no scrubbing and all those marks wipe right off. Just thought I'd pass this on. I know some of you already use these.

200.jpg
 
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