how about that stock market
- Thread starter patrick and linda
- Start date
Bill and Warren have got it right. Look back. Look around. In all the history of our species (count however you like) those of us alive in this country in this time are among the luckiest 1% of the luckiest 1% of humans who have ever walked this planet. Heck, many of us who regularly regale each other with whiny complaints about one thing or another have already far outlived the average life span of most of those fellow beings, past and present. It doesn't mean there aren't wrongs to right, beauties to preserve, and tragedies to grieve, but to paraphrase William F. Buckley, Jr., - who can dispute that this is the best time in history to be alive when you consider that masterful performances of the complete works of J.S. Bach are readily available to anyone who cares to listen?
Indeed, there are some opportunities. Anyone looking at paying a capital gains tax on the sale of an asset this year (an investment property, sale of a business or a stock) can reduce that tax to zero by selling some stock you've got a long term loss on that equals the taxable gain. Furthermore, if you have faith the stock you're selling is coming back, all you need to do is sell the stock and not buy it back for a month.
I was reviewing my personal situation with my CPA on Monday and he earned his fee developing a plan along these lines. So while I'm not happy with the hit I've taken over the past several months, I'd be really pissed off if I also had to write a check to the government next April 15th :cry
BTW: this tax saving strategy works only on securities you own outside retirement accounts.
I was reviewing my personal situation with my CPA on Monday and he earned his fee developing a plan along these lines. So while I'm not happy with the hit I've taken over the past several months, I'd be really pissed off if I also had to write a check to the government next April 15th :cry
BTW: this tax saving strategy works only on securities you own outside retirement accounts.
Da Nag":28cxfpzo said:I'm big into looking for silver linings...they're almost always to be found, regardless of how bad a given situation appears. The current economic downturn is no different.
Perspective - it's a great thing. It's also incredibly easy to lose sight of, but once obtained, can provide much relief and clarity. With respect to the current financial mess, I've lost a ton of $$'s, and my early retirement plans are now up in the air. However, it's nowhere near the worst thing that's happened to me. It's not even in the bottom 20, and I'm guessing an honest assessment of most peoples' lives will reveal the same. Same goes for times of great prosperity. A huge upswing in the market or a booming economy, while certainly gratifying, means nothing to me in the grand scheme of things. Love, health, friendship...good or bad financial times, don't hold a candle to these priceless experiences.
Closely related to perspective, is focus...and it's so easy to lose in times like this. The background noise is everywhere...turn off the TV, stop reading the gloomy headlines, and think and act more like a surfer. "Enough of these negative waves, man..."
The best things in life, don't cost a damn thing. A great conversation with a friend, a walk in the woods with your spouse and hounds, a beautiful sunrise/sunset, the smells that linger after a heavy rain...the best life has to offer, have little to do with one's financial well being. Spending more time enjoying these simple and precious moments is not only fulfilling, but an excellent alternative to activities that cost money. Don't look at the loss of costly activities as necessary belt tightening...look at it as an opportunity to invest in mental health.
Perhaps the above is too simplistic and unrealistic for some...but it works for me.
Here's to you Bill :thup :beer Works for us too.
Wonderful post and philosophy. Expressed exactly how we feel. Never in our younger years as we were going through trying times and severe losses dreamed we would be in as good a position to continue following our dreams as we are at this very moment. Jo-Lee's and my only real concern is for our health and the health of our loved ones and to stress over economy ect is only going to be detrimental to that.
Jay
Da Nag":31728t04 said:
And even if the silver lining is hard to see, there are always blessings to be counted.
I still have my home.
I still have a job to go to and a way to get to it.
And just down the street is a real cheap place to eat.
And setting aside the joking (but only for a moment!) the real blessing today is that those pictures are actual scenes from another time.
OK - it's off to the VP thread to try and make some sense of this.
My wife reminds me of the things Bill wrote about being really important, and I, of course, agree, but I can't quite easily accept the legitimacy and necessity of some of the events that are happening to us in the world, much of which is perpetrated by our own greedy people and our implicit stupidity in accepting it without reasonable response and recourse, and even going so far as to give them more of our own and future generations tax money as a reward, fearing even worse consequences if we don't.
If some street gang of thugs came up to you on the corner and forced you to go to your bank and withdraw $150,000 for their weekend party, you' d scream bloody murder and call the cops.
If the boys on Wall Street and Washington perform a similar stunt, we are told it was only a "paper loss" and to sit tight so they can do it to us again down the road. So when's the next time we get to bend over and pick up the soap?
Even more disturbing is the changing position of America on the world stage, but no one wants to seriously discuss it as long as they have their own butts covered with enough greenbacks to see themselves safely into the grave.
So who cares if there's a world-wide economic depression and re-alignment of wealth, economic and political power? Is there beer in the fridge?
Joe :disgust
If some street gang of thugs came up to you on the corner and forced you to go to your bank and withdraw $150,000 for their weekend party, you' d scream bloody murder and call the cops.
If the boys on Wall Street and Washington perform a similar stunt, we are told it was only a "paper loss" and to sit tight so they can do it to us again down the road. So when's the next time we get to bend over and pick up the soap?
Even more disturbing is the changing position of America on the world stage, but no one wants to seriously discuss it as long as they have their own butts covered with enough greenbacks to see themselves safely into the grave.
So who cares if there's a world-wide economic depression and re-alignment of wealth, economic and political power? Is there beer in the fridge?
Joe :disgust
Joe,
Everyone has a different view I guess and thats the really great thing about this country. But rather than taking a walk in the park, listening to music or enjoying the family; why not call or write your senators and congressman about what just went on in the banking industry. Some people did some really slimy bank moves, sold worthless paper secured with worthless mortgages etc. and now the taxpayers are paying once again, does that make you a little upset? Sure this was fueled by greed and people who were not credit worthy, and no one seems to be taking much in the way of responsiblity but there really ought to be at least some stop gap measures to prevent anymore bonuses or money spent on lavish trips, paychecks to worthless executives by companies operating now on taxpayers money. The people who have done everything right and paid the bills, taxes and their dues deserve better than what they are getting. Sorry for the rant but sometimes it helps in a democracy if you actually take part in the process at least a little bit. Hooray for me the hell with you is how we got here in the first place.
D.D.
Everyone has a different view I guess and thats the really great thing about this country. But rather than taking a walk in the park, listening to music or enjoying the family; why not call or write your senators and congressman about what just went on in the banking industry. Some people did some really slimy bank moves, sold worthless paper secured with worthless mortgages etc. and now the taxpayers are paying once again, does that make you a little upset? Sure this was fueled by greed and people who were not credit worthy, and no one seems to be taking much in the way of responsiblity but there really ought to be at least some stop gap measures to prevent anymore bonuses or money spent on lavish trips, paychecks to worthless executives by companies operating now on taxpayers money. The people who have done everything right and paid the bills, taxes and their dues deserve better than what they are getting. Sorry for the rant but sometimes it helps in a democracy if you actually take part in the process at least a little bit. Hooray for me the hell with you is how we got here in the first place.
D.D.
marvin4239
New member
I'm embarrassed to say I know very little about this and have actually learned more from this website than the media but I'm appalled at the recent get away weekend that was just reported. Why aren't these people that participated in JAIL! The Department of Labor has been really aggressive in investigating Labor Unions over the last 8 years. No small surprise here but where were/are they in investigating these autrocites committed against the American Tax Payer. These CEO's are thumbing there nose's at us. These guys are profitting from a disaster that has driven our country into even deeper bankruptcy. Dave I will write my Congressman and Senators thanks for the suggestion. Perhaps we need demonstrations at our state capitals but in todays climate you could easily be arrested for terrorism.
. . . and according to the news this morning, the same company recently bailed out by the government, is sponsoring ANOTHER retreat at a large resort in California.
As a hobby, I make quilts for family and friends. We have a saying, "when life throws you scraps, make a quilt." Instead of watching TV, I'm going to my studio and sewing away. Someone I know will benefit from my labor and will be a little warmer this winter. And that makes me happy! It truely is the little things in life that make it worth living.
As a hobby, I make quilts for family and friends. We have a saying, "when life throws you scraps, make a quilt." Instead of watching TV, I'm going to my studio and sewing away. Someone I know will benefit from my labor and will be a little warmer this winter. And that makes me happy! It truely is the little things in life that make it worth living.
marvin4239
New member
mbwf":32geewzz said:
Great point as a hobby I make rope hammocks and cast nets. Heven't made one in years and the stress level is building so... it's time to make a hammock. Maybe by the time I tie the last knot this crisis will be over and another will begin...
patrick and linda
New member
byrdman and his wife are in a bar having a late night drink. byrdman looks at his wife and says, look at that old couple at the end of the bar, do you think that will be us in twenty years? his wife says, you idiot, that's a mirror, it is us.
where have the years gone and how have of goals changed!
bill (da nag) AND HIS PARTNER, who's name escapes me, have a way of honing in on the true value of life, without regard to one's net worth.
here, here!
pat
where have the years gone and how have of goals changed!
bill (da nag) AND HIS PARTNER, who's name escapes me, have a way of honing in on the true value of life, without regard to one's net worth.
here, here!
pat
Like quite a few others we saw this crises coming like a tsunami several years ago and put our financial house in order the best we could before the waves starting rolling in and our heads are not presently buried in the sand singing cuumbaya through a straw. We continue to adjust our plans for the future with the reality of what has already taken place and our best estimate of whats to come.
The tendency of many is to rant, rage and point out all those to blame without ever looking in the mirror and seeing who may well be the most guilty culprit. We as a society have either been on or allowed this extended unpaid binge and most of us have benefited from it, but now the piper is demanding his due.
Love the boom hate the bust. We are likely staring into the start of another great depression or maybe even worse and for most of the same reasons and I can't see where anything was learned from the last one. Seems I remember something about if you don't learn from it your going to repeat it and its very apparent there's very few history buffs among us. I do believe it likely the ship as we know it is in the process of going down, but I will not let that stop me from enjoying life and making the best out of what ever is ahead.
Jay
The tendency of many is to rant, rage and point out all those to blame without ever looking in the mirror and seeing who may well be the most guilty culprit. We as a society have either been on or allowed this extended unpaid binge and most of us have benefited from it, but now the piper is demanding his due.
Love the boom hate the bust. We are likely staring into the start of another great depression or maybe even worse and for most of the same reasons and I can't see where anything was learned from the last one. Seems I remember something about if you don't learn from it your going to repeat it and its very apparent there's very few history buffs among us. I do believe it likely the ship as we know it is in the process of going down, but I will not let that stop me from enjoying life and making the best out of what ever is ahead.
Jay
Regardless of how much personal happiness or worth have have, I don't take it lightly when so many of my countrymen turn into ruthless, immoral, and greedy criminals and thoughtless and irresponsible politicians that sacrifice all the values and progress that this nation and it's people have made over the past 350 years.
I really don't care if we are the number one power in the world, nor the wealthiest nation, nor the world's policeman, but I do care if the average Americans' indifference to such developments in a changing world make it impossible to continue our journey towards reasonable freedom, justice, and equality for our people.
We have served as a noble example to the world of what can be accomplished through democracy and free enterprise. Why give that up for an image of a nation of hoodlums, bullies, and clowns? Do you have any idea of how America's image in the world has changed over the past few decades?
Joe. :amgry
I really don't care if we are the number one power in the world, nor the wealthiest nation, nor the world's policeman, but I do care if the average Americans' indifference to such developments in a changing world make it impossible to continue our journey towards reasonable freedom, justice, and equality for our people.
We have served as a noble example to the world of what can be accomplished through democracy and free enterprise. Why give that up for an image of a nation of hoodlums, bullies, and clowns? Do you have any idea of how America's image in the world has changed over the past few decades?
Joe. :amgry
Another big hit on the market today... well below 9,000 for the first time in years. Over 5,000 point drop since the high. My take is that people are fed up... individual investors no longer trust fund managers... there's probably very little trust for anyone in the financial/investment business, in fact.
Until the perceptions of greed and incompetence are purged, I don't think you'll see many people anxious to get back in the market.
Until the perceptions of greed and incompetence are purged, I don't think you'll see many people anxious to get back in the market.
Westfield 11
New member
I saw a guy with a Bush/Cheney 2004 bumper sticker today at the gas station. I motioned to his bumper and asked "How's that been workin' out for you?" for some reason he got all bent out of shape with me....
Hi Folks,
Well the market was down again today, but I find that drinking Dogfish Head 90 Minute Imperial India Pale Ale makes it much more palatable. I ran into a buddy of mine who grew up in Argentina today. He thought there was really nothing to worry about, He thinks this is a great country, and these problems shall soon pass. He's seen much worse and he's probably right.
Best wishes to all,
Mike
Well the market was down again today, but I find that drinking Dogfish Head 90 Minute Imperial India Pale Ale makes it much more palatable. I ran into a buddy of mine who grew up in Argentina today. He thought there was really nothing to worry about, He thinks this is a great country, and these problems shall soon pass. He's seen much worse and he's probably right.
Best wishes to all,
Mike