Elbows on Racor fuel/water separator? +Splashwell location

[Sunbeam]

Short question:
How many of you have 90º elbow fittings coming off the Racor filter, and do you have any fuel starvation problems?

Background:
I'm trying to decide where to mount my Racor fuel/water separator. Originally the boat had a large/crusty Racor on the inside of the transom above the sump, but I have tossed that filter and filled those holes, so I have a clean slate.

That same, under-splashwell location would be nice for hose routing, but I'm a bit concerned about spilling fuel into that area when servicing the filter, and/or hitting it with stuff I toss under there.

So, the outside splashwell location is looking good :thup I think I can make a small cover for it to reduce corrosion. The remaining decision points are exact location and hose routing. I looked at as many photos as I could find in the albums - there is quite a variety of locations. I mean, they are all in the same general area, but some are above the boot, some beside it, some more aft or forward.... I wonder which is best since I have a clean slate?

I originally ordered straight fittings to lead the hoses into the Racor, but in the splashwell it looks like that would make for some big, messy hose loops. I saw that many of the filters in the album photos had 90º elbows coming off them and that made for very tidy hose routing. I thought I had read that was a bad idea, but it looks like a lot of people use them and are apparently putting along just fine. I can't find what my Yamaha "drinks" per hour in the manual, and the elbow people were not able to really help with a flow rate reduction (just the diameter inside the elbow). I'm sure a physics person could figure this out, but on the other hand, as long as I know that many of you have the elbow fittings and no problems, that seems like it should be good enough? I would really like to get the fittings ordered and decide on an exact location for the filter.

My 22 has an 80hp Yamaha and an 8hp Honda. Both will run through the filter (but not at the same time).

BTW, I have read all the old threads on this, but didn't find too much specifically about elbows or exactly where on the splashwell (I did find lots of basics about splashwell vs. inside transom, which was good reading).

Thanks!

Sunbeam :hot

 

[thataway]

No problem with "elbows" on the Racor as long as they are sized correctly. I have used them on large diesels, as well as outboards.

 

[Sunbeam]

Okay, great! When you say sized correctly, do you mean simply that they be, say, 1/4" male NPT to 5/16" hose barb (those are the sizes of my Racor inlet/outlet and fuel hose)?

Darn, should have posted here before I spent an hour trying to figure this out through "official" channels

If anyone has comments on where is good to position it in the splashwell, and/or "darn, if I were going to mount this again I would move it up/over/down, etc." I'm all ears.

Thanks,
Sunbeam

 

[colobear]

Ours is on the starboard wall of the transom splashwell and is about 6-8" down from the top. It has been in that location for about 3 years with no trouble at all. I kept it high to make changing filters easier; I can get a strap wrench on it easily and it is high enough to allow me to put a bucket under it when making the filter change. I originally planned to make a protective cover but didn't and now don't see a need to.

 

[Sunbeam]

Ours is on the starboard wall of the transom splashwell and is about 6-8" down from the top.

Great info - I appreciate it. Can you tell me how far forward or aft it is?

Also, do you ever lob fenders into the splashwell? Or other "stuff"? I was trying to envision that and how or whether it would cause interference. Of course I'm making all these decisions not having used the boat, but then I can't use it without a fuel system so... here I am

Sunbeam

PS: I was very attracted to the tidy house-routing/no visual clutter location under the transom, but I really, really hate the smell of fuel, and the idea of spilling fuel "into the boat" (cockpit) when servicing the filter is very unappealing to me. Hence I guess the splashwell is the place.

(I am going to be mounting a Honda quick release fitting on one Racor port, because I read that as a suggestion so that one could change the kicker over to a portable tank if need be. That sounds like a good option. Of course if the Racor were under the splashwell, and the portable tank right there, how convenient! But I suppose it would be a rare thing, and I could just lob the hose over the top of the splashwell and down.)

 

[k-p pelican]

My Racor filter is mounted on the starbord side of the splashwell. The filter is just high enough to place a small pan under it so I can drain water or change the element. It has a 90 deg. elbow for the inlet and outlet with a quick disconect on the outlet side. This allowes me to change the outlet line from the main motor (90 hp Mercury 4 stroke) to the kicker motor (5 hp Marcury 4 stroke). Since the motor will run at factory recomended wot I don't believe there is too much restriction from the elbows. Hope this helps.

 

[potter water]

The filter system is really very stout. HOWEVER, you need to be careful about chucking hard stuff into the splash well anyway. You will always have fuel hoses to the motors, and they are more likely to be damaged than the filter assembly itself no matter where you put the filter assembly. I do put soft fenders in the splash well, but still have to be careful how I place them as they can keep me from tilting the motors full up in an emergency. Nothing with hard edges ever goes into the splash well on STILL CRAZY.

 

[Chris]

In my opinion...the splashwell is not a good place for fuel filters and hoses. Too wet...too much sun...too much junk. I would mount it in the void over the starboard fuel tank behind the battery compartment. Depending on your particular set up...you might need to make adjustments to accommodate filter changes. What little fuel would be spilled during changes can be handled with a pan and /or paper towels. Hose routing is tidy and not exposed...and handy to the fuel valve if your using it.

 

[Sunbeam]

In my opinion...the splashwell is not a good place for fuel filters and hoses. Too wet...too much sun...too much junk.

Augh, the reply that confirms my doubts - thanks a lot!

I would mount it in the void over the starboard fuel tank behind the battery compartment. Depending on your particular set up...you might need to make adjustments to accommodate filter changes.

Hmm, well I have some space there. Just yesterday I finalized the trim-tab HPU mounting there. It's tucked up against the underside of the "floor" of the battery compartment, above the fuel tank, against the hull side. My tanks are out now, so it's all pretty easy to reach; but I was thinking maybe I should only have things there that I would never need to get to in a hurry (?). I was thinking about putting the washdown pump there as well (under the battery compartment, with the hose leading out to where I would use it). Those things will be hard to get to once I mount the fuel-tank cover panels. Not impossible, but just not something I'd want to need in a hurry. Figured neither the washdown pump or the trim-tab HPU should need quick or frequent service.

Not sure exactly where you mean though: Are you thinking up on the level of the battery compartment, but right aft -- on the inside of the rounded "wing" of the transom? Like as if the battery shelf continued aft it would be on top of that (but of course it doesn't so that area is "bottomless")? I thought maybe I would need to get to the filter in a hurry some time, but then I have never used this style of Racor on an outboard, so I don't know. I'm not challenging your suggestion in a negative way - I'm very interested, as I've been procrastinating putting it in the splashwell due to ... messy hose routing, etc.

There is also the battery/spark factor, but then the Racor is normally sealed and that battery compartment is open to the cockpit regardless, as it does not have complete sides or bottom.

Last thing is that I was going to put a Honda quick connect on the outbound Racor fitting leading to the Honda (kicker), so that if I ever needed to I could pop it onto a portable tank. Not sure how common that scenario might be though, or even if I will keep the Honda.

What little fuel would be spilled during changes can be handled with a pan and /or paper towels. Hose routing is tidy and not exposed...and handy to the fuel valve if your using it.

I like tidy hose routing So ... I'm totally open to changing my mind, but not completely sure where you mean or how often (ever?) I might need to get to it underway.

Sunbeam

 

[thataway]

One of my C Dories had the Racor in the splash well. No issue with getting hit, but it did corrode. The other two had the filters in one of the lazaretts or cockpit. I like in the lazarette-but agree that it is not as convenient to work on, and there is a slight risk of fumes in the cockpit--but the gas tanks and all fittings are there.

Using 1/4" NTP fittings are fine--

Most of the Racors have two inlets and two outlets. (I think you address this) I would consider putting the Honda fitting on a separate outlet with its own squeeze bulb. But also if you are going for the kicker to be a separate fuel system....then the separate 3 gallon tank...get complicated and you cannot have everything!

 

[Sunbeam]

One of my C Dories had the Racor in the splash well. No issue with getting hit, but it did corrode. The other two had the filters in one of the lazaretts or cockpit. I like in the lazarette-but agree that it is not as convenient to work on, and there is a slight risk of fumes in the cockpit--but the gas tanks and all fittings are there.

One of the lazarettes would be great, but my Starboard one is "spoken for" with the batteries and electrical in it. There is space left over, but I don't want to put the fuel filter there. That just seems TOO close to the electrical. The port lazarette is wide open, but I'm "saving" that in case I want a propane system. I mean, until then I will use it for stowage, but I don't want to mount a "permanent" system there until I decide one way or the other on propane.

I can live with the risk of fumes in the cockpit - because I think it is low (as you say, the fuel tanks are already there), but I would hate actual fuel spilling (for the nuisance/gross factor). I also thought I might want to "toss" stuff under that center area. But... I'm already going to have a bilge pump there, so maybe I should reconsider that location (augh! )

Most of the Racors have two inlets and two outlets. (I think you address this)

Yes, my new one does have the four (two in, two out).

I would consider putting the Honda fitting on a separate outlet with its own squeeze bulb. But also if you are going for the kicker to be a separate fuel system....then the separate 3 gallon tank...get complicated and you cannot have everything!

Well the way I was planning to do it seems fairly uncomplicated, unless there is something I'm not considering - there very well may be.

So the Honda already has its own hose and squeeze bulb, and it would have (did) gone to one of the "out" ports on the Racor with a cut end of hose and a hose clamp. What I was going to do instead, is just screw a Honda quick connect fitting that I have into the Racor out port (instead of a barbed fitting), and then have a quick connect on the end of the Honda hose, and snap the two together to have the Honda (normally) on the Racor and drawing from the main tanks, just like the main engine. But theoretically, if I needed to, I could then "unclip" the Honda hose from the Racor and clip it onto a portable tank. I already have a portable tank that came along with the Honda, so it has the ability to be clipped onto. Figured I might bring that along between the two main fuel tanks sometimes. So except for having to order that Honda quick connect-to-1/4"-male-NPT (which I have on hand now), I think it's good to go.

Now if I could just decide where to mount that darned Racor! Sometimes it's a pain having a clean slate, because then you have to decide, and if you mess up, you can't even blame the DPO ("dreaded previous owner") :lol:

 

[Chris]

Yes...mounted inside on the splashwell wing...next to the fuel valve...aft of the battery mount. My primer bulb is also there...I can reach in above the fuel tank and squeeze the bulb...or change the filter. I relieved the tank protector board to give clearance for the filter when changing it out. Since that area is all open...the proximity to the battery really isn't any more of a concern than anywhere in the cockpit.
I do think it is important to keep the filter accessible...not buried. Never know when you may have to drain or change them out once or twice after taking on some water or other junk with your fuel!

 

[Sunbeam]

Yes...mounted inside on the splashwell wing...next to the fuel valve...aft of the battery mount. My primer bulb is also there...I can reach in above the fuel tank and squeeze the bulb...or change the filter. I relieved the tank protector board to give clearance for the filter when changing it out.

Ah okay, now I understand where you mean. Funny, that's the first place I mocked it up! Then I decided to put in the "solid" fiberglass fuel tank covers like the newer boats have (they go all the way up so the top edge is under the splashwell lip) and so then it didn't seem like such a good idea, as I'd have to remove the panel to get to the filter (not that that would be difficult, but not something I'd be doing in five seconds). It's too bad those panels look so nice because I was just going to make a Sunbrella cover panel, like the older boats had.

Hmm, maybe I can still put it there, and just mount the cover panel so it's easy to take on and off.... that would be handy for accessing the trim-tab HPU as well. I'll mull that over right now, while I go put some epoxy "topping" on a few filled holes wherein the top sank in slightly as they cured.

Thanks for the additional ideas and discussion (to everyone else too, and feel free to keep it coming).

Sunbeam

 

[colobear]

Our filter was initially in the starboard lazarette but I did not like it being so close to batteries and bussbars so moved it. No problems with things hitting it. Here is a picture:

 

[Robert H. Wilkinson]

Sunbeam, not sure about the Honda fitting as all my outboard boats have had Merc fittings but here's some food for thought.

On the Merc quick connect fittings the female end has a ball seal which is spring loaded. The male end has a pin which is also spring loaded. When they are pushed together they unseat each other. The female end with the ball seal is designed so that as it is uncoupled any gas will not siphon down from the motor. Also on a hot day any pressure will only serve to seat the ball tighter. The pin in the male end on the tank seats so that gas will not leak from the tank. Likewise on a hot day any pressure will only cause it to seat tighter.

Now here is the delima that came to my mind when trying to figure out how to splice into the main tank for a kicker. If you use a quick coupler like the Merc - it is designed to seal in both directions but when you introduce pressure or a vacuum on the wrong side then you are relying solely on the spring pressure behind the ball or pin. Now say you are running at WOT - say maybe your filter is starting to plug up a bit - say maybe you were bbqing and put one of those rubbers over your tank vent and forgot to take it off - you could now possibly have introduced enough vacuum in the system to unseat the pin against its mediocre spring tension. You would now be sucking air into the fuel going to your main. Maybe the Honda connectors are different but I would recommend installing a shutoff valve behind the quick connect.

I have a 16' Thundercraft that I use for fishing. It has a 4.5 kicker as well as a Minkota bowmount. I used to just have one line that I switched. After getting caught out on Lake Erie a few times in rough seas, it came to my attention that if my main died I could very well find myself broadside to a big wall of wet by the time I got the lines switched and the kicker started. I sprung for a second line with filter and prime bulb for dedicated kicker use. I kept it connected to the spare tank and primed all ready to go. It can also serve as a spare if something happened to the line or filter going to the main.

Not trying to make a simple project complicated for you but this is something I thought about years ago with my Campion. In that case I gave up and just carried a portable tank for the kicker. The only problem there is - if you only have the kicker for an emergency - then you have to stabilize and/or rotate the gas in the portable.

Regards, Rob

 

[Sunbeam]

Thanks for the photo - I wouldn't have thought to put it that high/aft, so it's good to see it there (and know that you have had success). I can see why you moved it out of the lazarette proper - I don't think I'd want it in there either.

I realize now that I haven't really asked the most basic question, which is how often does one actually interact with the fuel filter? In the past I've only used the drop-in type Racors, and there were two so one could just switch over and then deal with any issue later (when there was time to open hatches, etc.).

So... two factors I'm just guessing on:

1) How often will I be likely to interact with it, once it's installed? I mean, beyond visually looking at the bowl.

2) How much of a bear is it to get the spin-on filter to "spin off" the housing? I know from reading that getting the bowl off the filter is :amgry, but that can presumably be done out in the open after the filter is off the housing.

Sunbeam

 

[mgarr682]

If anyone has comments on where is good to position it in the splashwell, and/or "darn, if I were going to mount this again I would move it up/over/down, etc." I'm all ears.

Thanks,
Sunbeam

The dealer mounted mine a bit low. There is only an inch or two under the drain which will be an issue when draining it before filter changes.

 

[Sunbeam]

Thanks for the photo and your thoughts. Very helpful. That looks like the same filter I have, too.

Sunbeam

 

[thataway]

I check the water in the bowl of the Racor at least once a month, by opening the drain. If I am am starting on a long trip, I will do it on each leg. I use a plastic bowl which fits under the drain and let what is in the bottom drain out.

 

[colobear]

I change the filter about every 100 hours, visually inspect it before starting the engines. I've only had to drain water from the bowl once in over 1000 hours of engine operation. I put a pretty good lubricant on the "O" rings, therads and mating surfaces but it is still a little hard to get the filter off the head. I carry a strap wrench on board for that purpose and a spare filter in a vacuum sealed bag in the port lazarette. (They seem to work very well keeping moisture sensitive things, i.e. in line fuel filters, dry)