colbysmith
Active member
As I look for a used C-Dory 22 Cruiser, can anyone tell me the pros & cons regarding carburated vs. EFI engines? Thanks. Colby
EFI vs. Carburated
- Thread starter colbysmith
- Start date
There is a fair amount of discussion on that here on the site. The main (for me) difference is that the EFI may be more reliable when the ethanol issues are considered. The Carbed models tend to have more trouble with ethanol if allowed to sit for extended periods of time.
Go up to the top box on the page, and click on Search. Put "EFI AND carburated" or some version of that into the search topics. There should be enough to keep you busy for an evening or two. Not being a mechanic, I'll stick to the VERY basics.
Good luck in your search.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
Go up to the top box on the page, and click on Search. Put "EFI AND carburated" or some version of that into the search topics. There should be enough to keep you busy for an evening or two. Not being a mechanic, I'll stick to the VERY basics.
Good luck in your search.
Harvey
SleepyC :moon
colbysmith
Active member
Thanks. I tried that earlier, and didn't seem to come up with much, but maybe I mispelled something or it was the way I entered it. I'll try again. And thanks for your thoughts. I was sort of thinking the same thing, but know that many have the carburated engines. My other wonder was if the EFI actually got a better fuel useage (or should I say used less fuel.)
No matter which that you end up with the EFI engines start up pretty easy. Carburated engines have less electronics to fail but often have lower output alternators mostly because newer boats have more demands on batteries from newer options requiring more power, i.e. windless,stereo,inverters,lights,etc. This evolved newer motors having high output alternators. Some older boat owners offset their charging output with solar panels.
I use the Blue Marine Stabil in any ethanol fuel I add to the boat along with Yamaha ring free to deter any carbon build up behind the valves or on top of the top ring on the pistons. Some folks when laying up(not using for a month or more) carburated engines run them dry of fuel and drain the float bowls which is not all that hard to do. Once you get a bill for new carbs or an extensive cleaning you will develop an excessive compulsive disorder about making sure to do whatver it takes to avoid that expense in the future. Some of the older carburated Honda 90's have been reported to have up to 8000 hours on them. If you are going to keep a boat a long time repowering is a consideration. In the short term repowering will usually result in you having more invested than you can get for the boat. Any of the newer 4 stroke engines well cared for I think will provide decent mileage and a long service life.
D.D.
I use the Blue Marine Stabil in any ethanol fuel I add to the boat along with Yamaha ring free to deter any carbon build up behind the valves or on top of the top ring on the pistons. Some folks when laying up(not using for a month or more) carburated engines run them dry of fuel and drain the float bowls which is not all that hard to do. Once you get a bill for new carbs or an extensive cleaning you will develop an excessive compulsive disorder about making sure to do whatver it takes to avoid that expense in the future. Some of the older carburated Honda 90's have been reported to have up to 8000 hours on them. If you are going to keep a boat a long time repowering is a consideration. In the short term repowering will usually result in you having more invested than you can get for the boat. Any of the newer 4 stroke engines well cared for I think will provide decent mileage and a long service life.
D.D.
potter water
New member
If you have a choice, I think is' a no brain'r to go with EFI. More fuel economy, fewer issues going from mountain waters to sea level, no fuel gum up problems, less pollution, easier starts. Yes, its got a computer, but so does your car, airliners, etc. So, electronics versus mechanical isn't an issue. I've owned many of both, and given any kind of choice, including paying more money, EFI wins. HOWEVER, if you are getting a good deal on a low time carb's engined boat, show no fear. Just take care of the carb and you will be good for years.
matt_unique
New member
I would never again own a carbed engine. EFI is better is virtually every aspect.
I agree with the comments made and add that I use the storage level of Blue Stabile in all of my carbureted engines, which includes lawn mower, snowblower and portable generator. I don't drain the carburetors, and instead start these engines approximately once every one or two months. The same was true for my carbureted Yamaha outboard sold last year. I've observed from the past, that if you live in warmer climates, it is hard to completely drain all the gas out of the carburetors. Sometimes, just a little residue is enough to gum up the needle valves and other components. Keeping the carburetors fueled seems to work out best for me. Interestingly, the Honda user manual (EFI models) states that you can store the engine for the season with fuel in the engine if you "...add fuel stabilizer to fresh gasoline...drain the vapor separator...run the engine in water for 10 minutes to be sure that the treated gasoline has replaced the untreated gasoline in the vapor separator."
Rich
Rich
T.R. Bauer
New member
I can't imagine intentially choosing a carbed motor over EFI. I have stuck floats every year with my BF 45s no matter what I do for storage. The best thing I have found to prevent this it to squeeze the primer bulb about once a month or so to refill the carbs with fuel and keep the needle and seat wet with fuel. I actually think the fuel stabilizer contributes to the problem as it is actually sticky when gas evaporates from it. I'm not proposing not using it, just staing an observation. BTW, they always free themselves up, but it is annoying. In a nutshell, I think I would much rather have EFI 50s on the back of my boat.
When we bought our CD22 Honda had just started selling the 50's with EFI. I would have went a different direction with the engines otherwise. We wanted the same secured feeling that we had when starting our Tug with the diesel (without the smoke of the diesel). Our experience with carbureted boat motors has not been good. Hard to start, smokey on start, gummed carbs,etc. We can only boat 4 months out of the year, so for 8 months those carbs are getting ready to cause problems. We have a ski boat that always have carb problems.
The EFI's start like a car without any smoke - would look hard for the EFI.
The EFI's start like a car without any smoke - would look hard for the EFI.
We have twin 2001 Honda 40hp outboards on our boat. They are ten years old last July. I always run blue stable in the gas, drain the carbs before winter storage and spray some winter storage goop into each cylinder and then turn the motors over so it coats the whole cylinder. I also change the oil and filter yearly.They fire up and run like brand new each year. If I was replacing them I might look at fuel injection, but I have been very happy with the carbs. I will admit they start harder from a cold start, but after running a while they start instantly. Just my experience.
Lots of accurate advice here, most all of it favoring modern EFI motors, and I'll second it all.
Best way to describe a modern EFI/computerized motor is to simply say it's virtually trouble-free, is turn-key, and runs like a new car!
EFI engines virtually eliminate storage issues, get better gas mileage, cold start easier, automatically adjust for elevation differences (fuel/air mixture), run cleaner and smoother, etc.
Don't forget too, that they will hold their value better and make for a higher retail value of your boat when it's time to sell or move up!
Another, less frequently mentioned advantage, is that they have computers as part of the EFI system which record all operation time, including time at various operation ranges, temperature of operation, error and diagnostic codes, etc.
This information is available to your engine technician (via his computer), and can be printed out for the owner to have a copy, and peruse.
Think of all the advances in automotive engine technology from the 1960's, 1970's, 1980's, and 1990's:
All of this has been applied in marine engines when suitable. Would you want to go back to Old School Technology?
Maybe in your restored 1958 Chevy Pickup, but how about for your commute or family car?
Not me, anyway!
Joe. :teeth :thup
Best way to describe a modern EFI/computerized motor is to simply say it's virtually trouble-free, is turn-key, and runs like a new car!
EFI engines virtually eliminate storage issues, get better gas mileage, cold start easier, automatically adjust for elevation differences (fuel/air mixture), run cleaner and smoother, etc.
Don't forget too, that they will hold their value better and make for a higher retail value of your boat when it's time to sell or move up!
Another, less frequently mentioned advantage, is that they have computers as part of the EFI system which record all operation time, including time at various operation ranges, temperature of operation, error and diagnostic codes, etc.
This information is available to your engine technician (via his computer), and can be printed out for the owner to have a copy, and peruse.
Think of all the advances in automotive engine technology from the 1960's, 1970's, 1980's, and 1990's:
All of this has been applied in marine engines when suitable. Would you want to go back to Old School Technology?
Maybe in your restored 1958 Chevy Pickup, but how about for your commute or family car?
Not me, anyway!
Joe. :teeth :thup
We went thru this when we purchased our 2006 C Dory 22, which had the last of the Carbureted 90 HP Hondas. The engine had just had a carb rebuild, and they were drained. The Alternator is only 16 amps vs the 40 amp of the newer EFI engines (late 2006/2007). On the other hand, people have many thousands of hours on these engines, and they have been very reliable. A carb is fairly easy to rebuild--even in remote areas--or at least to clean the jets and adjust. Try that with plugged up injectors!
I prefer to use gasoline with no ethanol, if available-and you can usually find it. I add SeaFoam to the gas, as well as stabilizer and Startron. If the boat is not run for any length of time the carbs will be drained, after the fuel system is filled with treated fuel. (to assure that any lines and filters have treated fuel in them.
If I had a choice of boats where the price was the same, then I would go with the EFI--but in the recent purchase, the price was $10,000 to $20,000 less than other comparable boats. I have run carbureted engines for many years with minimal issues, and if necessary I will probably buy a Honda generator for the air conditioning---so if I really need a lot of battery charging, it will come from a good 3 or 4 stage battery charger. (Total cost there is about $1,000, plus it gives me a back up). But since we are running a very simple boat--no refer or windlass--the power demand is minimal.
I prefer to use gasoline with no ethanol, if available-and you can usually find it. I add SeaFoam to the gas, as well as stabilizer and Startron. If the boat is not run for any length of time the carbs will be drained, after the fuel system is filled with treated fuel. (to assure that any lines and filters have treated fuel in them.
If I had a choice of boats where the price was the same, then I would go with the EFI--but in the recent purchase, the price was $10,000 to $20,000 less than other comparable boats. I have run carbureted engines for many years with minimal issues, and if necessary I will probably buy a Honda generator for the air conditioning---so if I really need a lot of battery charging, it will come from a good 3 or 4 stage battery charger. (Total cost there is about $1,000, plus it gives me a back up). But since we are running a very simple boat--no refer or windlass--the power demand is minimal.
colbysmith
Active member
Thanks all for the comments. Sounds like either way, I'd be happy. As I look at C-22's for sale, I have three fairly close to me, two that have peaked my interest, but are currently unavailable to see, as they are in winter storage. One with a 115 EFI Merc, the other with a 90HP Honda carburated. Either of them sound like possible options, with some price negotation... but one has a single axle trailer (as I'm discussing in another forum here) and I see that as a big negative. Unfortunately, the other doesn't have a canvas over the cockpit, and that too is a big negative. But I know anything can be added later, at a cost. ;-)
Speaking of engines, and I did get a few comments earlier on another thread, what thoughts prevail on a Honda 90hp (Carburated) vs. a Merc 115 EFI? (Both 4-stroke). Would anyone weigh one over the other? Thanks again in advance of your comments. Colby
Speaking of engines, and I did get a few comments earlier on another thread, what thoughts prevail on a Honda 90hp (Carburated) vs. a Merc 115 EFI? (Both 4-stroke). Would anyone weigh one over the other? Thanks again in advance of your comments. Colby
colbysmith":3u7l099v said:
The first Merc 4-stroke EFI's were Yamaha power heads on Mercury lower units.
Check into that particular engine. Is it a Yamaha painted black?
I'd take the Yamaha 115 EFI over the Carbureted Honda 90 for both the EFI and HP, any day!
Lower ends are probably somewhat equal, though the Honda has a reputation for a lower unit that is easy to corrode!
Joe. :teeth :thup
colbysmith
Active member
[The first Merc 4-stroke EFI's were Yamaha power heads on Mercury lower units. Check into that particular engine. Is it a Yamaha painted black? I'd take the Yamaha 115 EFI over the Carbureted Honda 90 for both the EFI and HP, any day! Lower ends are probably somewhat equal, though the Honda has a reputation for a lower unit that is easy to corrode! ]
How would I know if it's a Yamaha? It's on a 2007 boat, and I assume the same year.
How would I know if it's a Yamaha? It's on a 2007 boat, and I assume the same year.
OK, here is a theory I have been working on. Probably has no value so I would be happy to hear why it is not true.
My 2006 Carb Honda 90, after sitting for 3 to 5 weeks does not start right up but cranks for maybe 30 seconds total before sputtering, stopping, then starting etc. When it starts there is then a little blue smoke which looks like oil.
Any start after a short warm up is instant and just like an injected engine and has no smoke even the next day.
So not letting the engine fire right up may bring a little oil into the cylinders which then burns off quickly. I think this might be a good thing where the cylinders, etc. are dry after not starting for weeks. Is there a reason this would not be true? This would not be a problem in a car that is started every day.
Further these Honda 90 carb engines often have very long lives and some forums here point to shorter lives on the newer fuel injected model.
Don't know if there is any correlation but I guess it is a question in my mind.
Ron
My 2006 Carb Honda 90, after sitting for 3 to 5 weeks does not start right up but cranks for maybe 30 seconds total before sputtering, stopping, then starting etc. When it starts there is then a little blue smoke which looks like oil.
Any start after a short warm up is instant and just like an injected engine and has no smoke even the next day.
So not letting the engine fire right up may bring a little oil into the cylinders which then burns off quickly. I think this might be a good thing where the cylinders, etc. are dry after not starting for weeks. Is there a reason this would not be true? This would not be a problem in a car that is started every day.
Further these Honda 90 carb engines often have very long lives and some forums here point to shorter lives on the newer fuel injected model.
Don't know if there is any correlation but I guess it is a question in my mind.
Ron