Bring Unconscious MOB Aboard

[True North]

I have started this thread after asking Thataway a question about how he used his davit to get an MOB back onboard. I hope other C-Dorians will share what they do.

The conversation so far:
MY QUESTION
Bob, I'm researching how to get an unconscious MOB back aboard a C-Dory 25' and was struck by your stating that you practiced with your dinghy hoist. My husband and his wet clothes would weigh about 225 lbs if he were the MOB. If unconscious, he would need to be winched aboard somehow and a dinghy davit seems to be the only way to do this.

So... many questions: Where was the base mounted on the boat How much did the boat heel when you were lifting and swinging aboard the MOB? Can the MOB be swung into the cockpit? Could you have attached a "net" to the davit arm so that you could lift the MOB horizontally (to prevent circum rescue collapse)?

So... many questions: Where was the base mounted on the boat How much did the boat heel when you were lifting and swinging aboard the MOB? Can the MOB be swung into the cockpit? Could you have attached a "net" to the davit arm so that you could lift the MOB horizontally (to prevent circum rescue collapse)?

ROBHWA's RESPONSE

Fellow C-Dorians; Bringing a "dead-weight" (i.e. can't help in their rescue) heavier person over a ledge is a common problem practiced and unfortunately sometimes done in mountaineering rescue. I had the opportunity many years ago to participate in such a rescue on Mt Rainier. Approaching it with a fiberglass "ledge" on a C-Dory poses a similar problem to bringing the person over the edge of the crevasse. I also recently helped pull a 170 lb halibut into a boat, not a C-Dory but with similar relatively low gunwales. One person tried but couldn't lift into the boat themselves. 2 people couldn't easily either. I was surprised that it took three people to wrest it over the side. Basically, you're going to need "mechanical advantage" with a pulley system and a firm place to anchor it. I've practiced doing this with 250 lb people over the edge of crevasses using a 3:1 mechanical advantage "Z-system". Not easy but doable if you place a pack at the edge of the crevasse so the rope doesn't dig in. You are able to use your legs, which might not be easy on the boat. I wonder if such a system might be adapted to rescue on a C-Dory? The crux of the problem is probably bringing the person over the gunwales of the boat. Has anyone tried this in real life?

 

[Pacificcoast101]

 

[True North]

Thanks for the link! That's an impressive product. It's similar to the Jason's Cradsle MOB system in that they both keep the MOB horizontal and then roll him aboard (https://www.survivalsystemsinternational.com/middle-east/jasons-cradle/).

Howcould it be adapted for use on the C-Dory 25' itself? There doesn't seem room on the side deck to roll the MOB aboard in that location. While I think it could possibly be suspended from the davit and lowered into the water, I can't think where the MOB could then be rolled aboard.

We boat in the PNW, where Cold Water Shock can be triggered by sudden immersion. As my husband and I boat as a couple, if he goes overboard, I will need to recover him alone. I do not discount the use of a Mayday call, but I will need to get him out of the water and horizontal immediately, if I possibly can.

I do not have the upper body strength to roll an MOB aboard even on a boat that facilitates that manoeuvre. Hence my question about the use of a davit, and where it could be positioned --- and also whether it could even lift 225 lbs.

 

[thataway]

I am a bit confused about this post where:

I have started this thread after asking Thataway a question about how he used his davit to get an MOB back onboard. I hope other C-Dorians will share what they do.

I have combed my direct messages from the C Brat web site, emails and messages --I do not see any such question from True North. He does quote a message from "robhwa"

My apologies to True North, if my 90 year old brain has forgotten some "conversation about this subject recently". I have been involved with my 90th birthday party, which involved flying 5 people from all over the US, plus inviting some 40 who lived in our adoptive home of almost 30 years.

I have a unique prospective, having met the invertor of the "Life Sling" on his wooden boat when he stopped propr to tranciting the Pamana Canal while circumnavation of Soouth America, starting and ending in Seattle Wa.

I have two places for the Guarhart Davit-one on the side deck for the base-and it has baried from just where the aft part of the cabin begins, and this alows the davit to pivot to place an item Inflatable Tender" on the cabin roof. It could have been used to also place an obj object in the cockpit. It also requires a ciustom davit, with longer longer pole and arm.

I have a second floor ball and the upper brace on the C Dory 25 railing, so I lift directly from the ground to the cockpit, or a MOB to the cockpit. You have to have enough space in the 6:1 hoist to allow for a human body to be pullover the railing. A parabuckle to the railing, might work but it would be rough, and even dangerous to a disabled person.

We had an incident where I had fallen partway into the water, in a marina with the warning signs "do not swim" because of possible mains power 120 Volts leaking into the water. My right leg was injured and no strength there. I had my hands on the bow railing, but both legs were in the water, and I did not have enough strength to pull up onto the boat or dock. Marie was not able to get me in the dinghy, and eventually I hung onto the dinghy as Marie pulled it to the ladder and swim patform at the stern. I was then able to pull with my arms, and push with the uninjured leg. Fortunately I had added extra grab rail in the splash well above the swim platform, and could use this to pull up on to reboard the boat.

Later in this cruise, one of the other boat's skipper was in the water swimming, and could not get aboard his boat. So we picked him up with our inflatable, and Marie and I had the strength to pull him aboard the inflatble, and then to his boat. Be sure you can reboard your boat in some way in case of MOB. It could be a long, or fatal swim "home".

We have done some experiments with standing on the antiventillation plate on the outboard, and then raising the moter with the Tilt Trim switch,, to allow the person to get into the splash well. This works better if you have a quality suction cup handle on the cowling of the outboard on the swim deck side.

 

[True North]

Bob, I am so sorry for the confusion. The question I asked you was posted in the thread Inflatable Preservers which I read only a day ago. In October 2024, you had written "The other thing to think about is how to get back aboard the boat. We had practiced using our dinghy hoist to get a person back aboad."

I started this new thread to address the question of how to get an unconscious or incapacitated MOB back aboard.

There are a number of devices which can bring an incapacitated MOB onboard while keeping him horizontal (critical in the under-60-degree waters of the PNW). All of them require either two or three strong people to position the MOB and then roll or lift him to a horizontal surface on the boat. A single person would need a davit system --- at minimum --- to accomplish this.

I am hoping one or more C-Dorians will have done this, and describe it.

 

[KC99]

“Parbuckling”… mentioned by Thataway above.

That’s what the product on the Zodiac video accomplished. In contrast Jacob’s Rescue Stretcher is a pure lift system, but Jacob’s Cradle is for parbuckling.

The method can work for people but you need a safe base/cradle for them. If I wanted to establish such a capability without purchasing a dedicated product, I would cut down a splash pad to a reasonable size and maintain this aboard for max protection of the parbuckled person.
Or possibly use a polyester web (seatbelt material) cargo lifting net, kind of like Jason’s Stretcher, which appears to be stiffer plastic.

Then rig 2-3 equidistant lines to effect the parbuckle. If a crew of only one is all you expect to remain aboard when the other goes overboard, you’ll need to add in more mechanical advantage to your rigging (as shown in the video). Horizontal pull will be your goal versus actual lifting. The body itself is the first “pully” establishing the first level mechanical advantage.

If not parbuckling, the other direction you could potentially go would be pursuing a solution similar to those handicapped chair lifts we see at some pools. But for a badly injured or unconscious person, crew would need to lower the chair, enter the water, secure the MOB in the chair, re-board the boat and crank or power the chair lift. But that’s probably too big for anything under a 25’ or maybe it won’t even work on a 25’.

Good luck in your quest of rescue solutions!

 

[True North]

When I began researching how to get my husband back aboard, the Jason's Cradle and Dacon Rescue items looked promising --- but one sees that the MOB needs to be rolled aboard onto a surface long enough and wide enough to allow his body to be released from the parbuckle system. The only exterior place on a C-Dory that is long and wide enough for a person to lie down flat is the cockpit, lying athwartships.

I think that a lift-and-swing approach is more promising. Hence my question about the use of a davit to lift an MOB horizontally, in a sling, from the water and then swing him into the cockpit.

I asked three of the Training and Charter companies in our area (Bellingham) what hands-on training they provided ---AND what equipment they used --- to train their students to bring back onboard an incapacited MOB. The answer was "None. We train the crew to get back to him, full stop."

 

[KC99]

Rescue practicioners (coast guards worldwide) use Stokes Litters (for injured/unconscious) & aerial baskets (uninjured or minor issues only). We had a folding litter on our 45’ rescue boat. We had none on our smaller boats.

I’ve hauled some people over gunwhales, it’s never easy - never solo unless the PIW is helping and uninjured. In the event of the MOB needing to be placed in a litter (consider if you’ll even be capable of doing so), you’ll be faced with the same geometric challenges you’ve mentioned when discussing parbuckling upon hoisting the litter.

So yes, a chair based system seems to have the best chance of being effective and fitting within your space constraints. They’re engineered to hoist and swivel, but you’d need to sacrifice at least half your cockpit to install/carry such a system. In a cold water environment, it would need to be kept 100% ready to use disallowing any partial disassembly/stowage in an attempt to reclaim some space. Lastly, you would need to don a drysuit to enter the water (an immersion suit likely wouldn’t allow the mobility needed), be capable of loading and strapping your husband into the chair, be capable of climbing back on your boat without aid, and finally hoisting the chair (a power-winch version preferably). That probably isn’t even a reasonable expectation of yourself though.

The righting moment of your C-Dory should handle the lifting load w/o capsizing as long 4-5 people don’t all rush to the same gunnel for aid. But you’ve been talking about just you two aboard. On occasion I have needed to intentionally divert crew to the high side so we can work the low side without rolling the boat.

*So… I’m at a stage to ponder PREVENTION of MOB now. Maybe take a page out of sailing practices and decide that you’ll both clip into JACKLINES & WEAR HARNESSES whenever you leave the cabin offshore and prevent this unsolvable problem from ever happening. Certainly cheaper than a lift chair and you retain your precious cockpit space.

Hope this discussion helps

 

[True North]

Hope this discussion helps

It does, indeed, help. We, also, have come to the same conclusion: prevention. We've always worn inflatable PFDs at all times underway, when working outside the cockpit, and also inside the cockpit when there's a chance of a wave hitting us hard.

Since I began this thread, I've researched the lifting capacity of the Garhauer davit; it's only 150 lbs. Anthing that can lift more than that cannot be safely mounted on the C-Dory without major structural modifications.

We'll now look at how and where to tether ourselves to the boat to prevent falling overboard in the first place. That is likely to be a more fruitful continuation of this conversation.