BayStar Hydraulic Steering

RobMcClain

RobMcClain

Member
Our Venture is powered by a Honda BF150 and the steering is assisted by a BayStar hyrdraulic unit. This is the first powerboat I have owned that has hydraulic steering so I am not accustomed to it. I am used to having a quickly responsive helm so that when I turned the wheel (or tiller) the engine (or rudder) also moved at a similar rate and the boat noticably began to respond. I guess you might call it "tight" steering, like in a car.

With our current BayStar system, it seems to take several rotations of the wheel to get the engine to meaningfully turn. Even little course corrections take a lot of wheel movement, not just a slight turn of the wheel but a big rotation to get any response. Maybe this is normal with hydraulic steering, but I really don't know. The wheel certainly turns easily; it is just the amount of turns required that I don't like.

The hydraulic fluid is properly full and when I had the boat serviced many months ago the tech said the system operated just fine. So is this normal and something I just need to adjust to? I would really like a tight responsive system, one that quickly responds to movement of the wheel and not one that is so loose. Is there something I can do to tighten it up?

Rob
 
Hi Rob,

The easiest way to figure out if you have an issue is to count the number of full wheel turns, hard over to hard over. The Baystar system states that it should be 5 full wheel turns, lock to lock.

http://www.seastarsolutions.com/products/hydraulic-new/outboard-new/baystar/

If it takes you more than 5 turns, then you have an issue. Most likely air in the system and it needs to be bled. If it's 5 turns, then it's working as designed....unfortunately. In order to reduce that number, you'd need to get the pump to push more fluid than it's designed to. I'm not aware of any way to accomplish that.

You could change out to a bigger helm pump in order to push more fluid (reduce lock to lock), but you'd need to be sure that the cylinder could handle it.
 
Thanks Rob. I suspect it is 5 turns side to side but will check. I've also downloaded the manual from the website for reference. Should have done that before... Might be I just need to adjust to this.

Rob
 
Hi Rob. The Baystar is rated to 150hp so you're right at the limit. The seastar helm and ram may be a better fit. We have the Seastar on 90 hp mostly as I wanted the tilt helm. We're 5 turns lock to lock. One thing I've noticed is quite a few people want to "steer" the boat a lot. My partner was oversteering for quite a while. You don't need to correct for every little deviation from course. It results in PIO. Pilot Induced Occilation. The c dory tends to want to go strait. It may take a few hours to get used to. Enjoy the boat! George
 
It it takes a a revolution of the wheel to begin to turn, there is most likely air in the system, and it needs to be bled. Look at the engine when at rest, as you turn the wheel, the engine should begin to noticably turn, with a 1/8 of a turn of the wheel. There is a little slack in hydraulic steering--but not as much as you describe.
 
It shouldn't take several rotations of the wheel to get the engine to turn. Sounds to me like there's either air in the system and it needs to be properly bled, or there is some component(s) in the system that has failed - possibly a bad check valve in the helm.

I'd contact customer service at SeaStar Solutions and ask them what they think.
 
I switched from cable to hydraulic. The cable was more responsive in that it took 3 1/2 turns stop to stop but was a lot harder to turn & gave quite a workout. I put a suicide knob on my wheel that makes turning much easier & I can turn with one hand. I'd never go back. Vern
 
The Baystar system is prone to leaking at the cylinder at the engine . Feel around the splashwell for oil and see if you feel some where the shiny stainless shaft comes out of the cylinder . The oils is clear and light .
They are max rated at 150 HP . They often have issues in the first couple years .
Marc
 
FYI........the seals in the cylinder end caps can be replaced with new ones for approx. $28 from a good hydraulic shop. The new end caps from SeaStar are approx. $125.
 
Not an informational comment, because I don't have any, but just to say I'm reading with interest. My boat has cable steering, which so far seems to work fine, but.... a couple of hours running is a bit of a workout, which seems to "settle" into my neck muscles. So I have hydraulic steering on my list of potential future upgrades. It's more complicated than just that though (of course, it's a boat! :cry) because my autopilot is not one that would work with hydraulic, so that would also have to be replaced. Hence I'm reading and considering future moves.

At any rate, if Freedom's steering was "normal," I was thinking I would rather have the cable, which at least feels like "direct drive." But reading further, it sounds like the hydraulic is normally tighter, and would likely be an improvement I would enjoy. Good discussion, thanks :thup

Sunbeam
 
Sunbeam":3pzns82m said:
.... a couple of hours running is a bit of a workout, which seems to "settle" into my neck muscles. ...

Sunbeam
Click to expand...

That's why I'll never own a cable steered boat again. I've found that hydraulic steering is much easier on the captain - especially during long runs.
 
nordicstallion":38pzbd01 said:
I switched from cable to hydraulic. The cable was more responsive in that it took 3 1/2 turns stop to stop but was a lot harder to turn & gave quite a workout. I put a suicide knob on my wheel that makes turning much easier & I can turn with one hand. I'd never go back. Vern
Click to expand...

I too installed a suicide knob / necker knob, on our boat and it is a great way to get the steering wheel turned in a hurry. I have found it to be very helpful for manuvering in tight quarters and you can turn the wheel with your left hand quickly while maintaining throttle control with the right hand.

Highly recommend it as an inexpensive $20 upgrade.
 
We've put 1100 hours on our Baystar steering. Had to replace end seals on the piston at the engines at about 800 hours. The steering is tight, just a slight movement to get movement on the engines. No problems with broken or rusted cables, no need to take them out every year or two to re-lube; we're happy with the hydraulics. By the way, if you look at the baystar owners manual it will note that several brands of aviation brake fluid are approved substitutes for the very pricy Baystar fluid, cuts costs by about 50-75%.
 
We've put 1100 hours on our Baystar steering. Had to replace end seals on the piston at the engines at about 800 hours. The steering is tight, just a slight movement to get movement on the engines. No problems with broken or rusted cables, no need to take them out every year or two to re-lube; we're happy with the hydraulics. By the way, if you look at the baystar owners manual it will note that several brands of aviation brake fluid are approved substitutes for the very pricy Baystar fluid, cuts fluid costs by about 50-75% when you have to do maintenance.
 
AK Angler":1zabzxd8 said:
Sunbeam":1zabzxd8 said:
.... a couple of hours running is a bit of a workout, which seems to "settle" into my neck muscles. ...

Sunbeam
Click to expand...

That's why I'll never own a cable steered boat again. I've found that hydraulic steering is much easier on the captain - especially during long runs.
Click to expand...

Thanks, now you've just cost me a few "boat bucks" :mrgreen:

But really, that's good to know. It also tells me it's not just my particular steering cable.

I can see where a knob would be great for close-quarters maneuvering. Those of you who have the steering knobs installed: I've seen either "cheapies" on places like eBay (which, I wonder how or if they would fit on my wheel), or the very expensive Edson knob. From all reports the Edson one is fantastic, but is there any middle ground in price/quality? Anyone have specific ones they like or dislike?

I was reading that some fit onto the spokes (out near the rim, but inside the rim) and then you can still steer the regular way (hands going around the rim) if you want to. Anyone have one of those and is it something worth pursuing, or a non-issue?

I have the bare stainless wheel, btw, without the black foamy grip stuff on it.

Sunbeam
 
Sunbeam.......

I have the Edson knob on the rim but inside the rim as it will not clear the cabin wall when outside. My wheel has the rubber foamy stuff on it and it is not real tight but worksgood for me after using it for awhile.

Jack
 
Sunbeam

I was reading that some fit onto the spokes (out near the rim, but inside the rim) and then you can still steer the regular way (hands going around the rim) if you want to. Anyone have one of those and is it something worth pursuing, or a non-issue?

I have the bare stainless wheel, btw, without the black foamy grip stuff on it.

Sunbeam
Click to expand...

Sunbeam-

Here's a plan for you:

Get a regular type auto knob.

To mount it on one of the spokes on your existing wheel….

Get a dowel of the diameter the knob is adjustable for.

Drill a hole down the cylinder of the dowel the diameter of your spokes.

Cut the dowel in half longitudinally with a saw.

Cut off a length of the split dowel that will fit into the knob.

Put the two halves of the split dowel on opposite sides of a spoke, slide the knob sleeve over them and tighten the knob down on the split sleeve and spoke underneath.

Like my Dad always used to say :

"Where there's a will, there's a way." :lol:

OR: You could get a 1940-something Buick steering wheel with a built-in spinner handle:

102911_G.jpg

(Section on left of wheel center rotates within it's circle, allowing hand to turn wheel 360+ degrees without letting loose or turning over.) CLEVER!

I have also seen this steering sheel attributed to a 1938 Chevrolet!

_master_deluxe_1940_accessory_steering_wheel.sized.jpg

Joe. :teeth :thup
 
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