Additional aft bilge pump

BobArrington

New member
I'm interested in knowing who has felt the need to add a second aft bilge pump on a 22C and if so did you tee it into the existing plumbing and through hull or did you plumb it separatly to a new through hull. This is for a new 22C we're taking delivery of on April 6th, it is our first C-Dory.

Thank you.
 
Hi Bob, and welcome to the Pub. Congrats on the new CD!

I did just what you were saying on my CD22. I had a small auto pump back there, but wanted a larger manual for when I hosed down the deck. At first I used a tee and it worked OK, but there was always a little water that ran back down both hoses instead of just one and it bugged me. I put in another thru-hull right next to the original. It is simple to do, and probably simpler for you because all you need to do is have your dealer order it with two outlets or put the second one in themselves. You could also do it yourself, but the first hole in the side of the boat is really hard to drill!
 
Thank you for your thoughts. Having run the 22, how often does the aft bilge work when running in heavy weather/seas/spray? It concerns me just a little that the cockpit is not self bailing.
 
...how often does the aft bilge work when running in heavy weather/seas/spray?

Only often enough to keep up with the rain and any water you put in there on purpose. The cockpit stays surprisingly dry, even in bouncing splashing seas. I one time had a wave curl onto the bow with the foam hitting the windshield (once was enough!) and did not get any water to speak of in the cockpit. The small auto bilge pump they provide is mostly for keeping the rain water emptied when docked.
 
Bob,
I think since you are getting a 2007 the only bilge pump is in the back. I thought when they put the molded floor in it eliminated the forward sump under the sink?
 
Hey Marc-

How would you rate the quality of the various centrifugal pumps today?

It seems a lot of the brands are either Rule brand or another brand made by Rule, which is a Jabsco division or subsidiary, and ultimately owned by ITT.

Joe.
 
Not only should you have a second bilge pump but you should consider a bilge pump a bit bigger than what is typically installed. Spray or rain - anything can keep up with that. The bigger concern is a wave over the back. This won't happen under most sensible situations - but sensible situations are not what get boaters in trouble. The most common ways to get a wave over the back are - backing down on a fish, shrimp or crab pot and anchoring from the stern. The last one's just plain dumb, the first one is sometimes necessary. One little wave can easily bring in 10 or 20 gallons of water (80-160 lbs), a bigger one can (of course) bring in more. An 1100 gallon per hour pump removes about 18 gallons/minute, waves are typically spaced <10 sec apart. Just 3 gallons over the stern per every 10 sec wave is 18 gallons per minute - the capacity of the typical pump. Once you get a good bit of water in the cockpit, the stern sits lower and the waves come over more easily. It doesn't take very long for a boat in this situation to fill the cockpit. The floundering boat then capsizes. Add in a second pump at say 2000gph, and now you've got a total of 3100gph which gives you close to 50 gallon/minute of capacity.

Other considerations -
* One of the most important things to do if a wave comes over the back is to get on the throttle such that you can prevent additional waves from coming over. Those who manage to flounder and capsize their boats often don't realize how much potential trouble they're in until it's too late. With waves 10 sec apart (a relatively long period in the NW), it only takes a minute to get hit by six waves. If you're worrying about gettting your fishing tackle stowed up your downriggers up prior to getting on the throttle, it may be too late. One should also infer that it's a good idea to have the engines running when ever one's in large waves. This may sound obvious, but the people that were rescued last year by our own Starcraft Tom and Sark made the mistake of shutting down the engines in following seas (plus many, many more mistakes) and didn't recognize the seriousness of the problem early. Their self bailing cockpit (in a Trophy) didn't help in this situation.

* Check the bilge pumps prior to each outing. Clean the screens - especially if you bring pets on board. With out dog, it seems like every hair that comes off him in the boat, finds it's way to the bilge pump. If you leave your boat outside and uncovered, leaves and pine needles find their way there too.

* Where are your batteries? How much water has to be in the cockpit before your electric bilge pumps won't work? If the batteries are on the floor and the terminal exposed, it doesn't take too much water to short things out (especially in salt water).

* A manually operated bilge pump is not only a good idea, it's required in some places (like Canadian waters).

* Always size the hose and through hulls to the manufacturer's specs, don't use more hose than is necessary and limit the rise on the through hull to what is needed. Small hoses, long hoses, small through hulls and a having to raise the water very far all reduce the pumping capacity.
 
hi bob,
on my boat i was concerned with water accumulating in the cockpit area, as most boaters are. so i installed a pump connected to a auto float switch, and then directly wired the pump to the battery. i ran the hose up and behind the starboard fuel tank and vented out, just below the green gelcoat line. the second concern i had was with the original bilge pump, located under the galley cabinet. i didn't like the idea of mice, spiders and the occasional snake getting thru that slit, which is designed so that water could drain from the cock pit area into the pump well. so, i fiberglassed the slit and used the correct colored gelcoats to finish it off. the final product came out well and the original slit is not distinguishable form the rest of the deck. hope this helps.
best regards and good luck with your project.
pat
 
This all seams like good advice.

I've heard the argument that on a non self bailing deck you can't pump the water out fast enough. I say that it is better to be prepared than not. It's true that in a really bad situation (dead in the water with waves breaking over the stern) you can't pump the water out fast enough. But you might as well add a second larger capacity pump so that if you are ever in a less serious situation you have the extra pumping capacity. You might as well do all you can to be prepared.

Bill
 
Hey Bob... good subject...I installed a second pump..one of the first things I did with my new boat... I hated that automatic pump the boat came with...so I moved it to the back...and installed a large pump in it's place...with a float switch....I hated that Buzz-buzz-buzz every minute or so with the automatic switch... now I never hear it....and it has it's own control circuit so it won't kill the battery when the boat is in storage...(the dealer forgot that and I had a dead battery first week)
I think Marc has a great point... I think it is real easy to buy a cheep pump that fails when ya need it..... buy the best..and check it often.

After all that.. I will say the boats are really dry, and the only thing I need the pump is to remove rain water...I never get much spray, and never even come close to a wave over the back....

Joel
SEA3PO
 
Settled. I've asked the dealer this morning to install a new pump with its own through hull. It will be an 1100 GPH pump with a manual override switch at the helm. The boat will be kept under cover when not in the water so rain is not the issue it is while underway that I feel it is important. Thank you for all of your thoughts. We are very excided to take delivery and start to explore in our new C-Dory.

As I mentioned once before it is in large part due to all of you that we chose this boat.

Thanks again!
 
Hi all!

First thing I did to my 22 is throw the "toy" pump that came with the boat away.

I re-plumbed with 1 1/4 tube.
heres what I installed

http://www.johnson-pump.com/JPMarine/pr ... eries.html


the L2200.

with a electronic float switch.

I also have a rule 1100 in the cutout under the sink.


I have to admit to doing something dumb this last weekend,
after I had got my boat on the trailer, i noticed it was way off center...told my wife we need to put her back down the ramp and float her so we can recenter her. backed down in the water got out to center her up look over at the starboard side and water was gushing out the L2200's thru hull, took me a second to figure out what was going on....
I forgot to put the drain plug back in. major DOH!

sure was glad I had put that big of a pump in.


James
 
James-

Is your electronic switch one of those that detect water by electricity passing between two probes (electrodes)?

I think they'd be great, except I'm not sure about crud and particularly oil getting on those detectors.

Works fine, huh?

Joe.
 
Is your electronic switch one of those that detect water by electricity passing between two probes (electrodes)?


Not sure whats inside, it's just a slender black box.
it seems impervious to problems that you mentioned.
so far it has worked great. I did have one before on my carver I/O
it worked fine also.
I glued it down with 3m 4800, hate screws where there is water.


James
 
I have only one automatic pump that came with the boat and a manual pump that is for sucking puddles and on reserve if the electric fails.

Truthfully as Tybo said the cockpit is pretty dry. Rain and kicking the end cap off the cooler is the only water my cockpit gets. I think you have to almost try to get water into the back.

I too have thought about a second pump when under way the rain water likes to settle near the gas tanks. A sponge is my current solution. Low tech. but it works. Not super fun to do but the sponge always starts and never blows a fuse. (that was an attempt at some lame humor)

I read somewhere that there is no better bilge pump than a scared sailer and a bucket........... Thinking back this has some merit. :shock: :lol:


A second electric pump is on my wish list and has good logic.

Chris Bulovsky
Washburn Wi
 
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