25' C-Dory Sedan vs TomCat

E

edc

New member
Hi all, I am new to the forum and am interested in a C-Dory. I have owned many boats small to large. We currently have a couple of open cockpit boats. We live in northern Calif and want to explore/boat/fish in the northwest -- San Juans, etc. We have always liked the looks of C-Dorys, have heard many good things about them, and like traditional looking boats with proven classic designs. I am interested in some information on the trade-offs between the 25' Sdn and the TomCat. I tried searching but didn't find much. Any guidance on how to find such info on the forum -- it has to be a topic that has been discussed before. Thanks in advance, Ed
 
thks Roger, good info. I like lots of things about the 25' cruiser however being only able to go 6 to 8 knots in a 2 to 3 ft chop seems very limiting. I am not a speed freak (although one of my current boats runs 60+) but find that being able to cruise about 20 knots or so is very useful -- and sometimes safer when maneuvering around commercial traffic etc. I also hear that high tidal currents are part of the northwest boating reality so a little more comfortable speed is a plus. However a cat hull is a real reach for me -- I had the same problem going from inboards to outboards even with all their obvious advantages. thks again for the link and the sedan correction. Ed
 
Based on my experience with a 22 and a much faster 20 foot Whaler, the C-Dory does just fine avoiding commercial traffic and powering through PNW tidal currents. My 22 is plenty fast/powerful enough to go through any tidal rapids that I want to, and I'm sure an adequately powered 25 would do just as well if not better. I wouldn't make a decision between the 25 and Tomcat based on those two factors. If you want to run fast in moderately choppy water, or want a bigger berth and easier access than the 25 offers, the Tomcat is a great choice.
 
edc":1i81fr6y said:
thks Roger, good info. I like lots of things about the 25' cruiser however being only able to go 6 to 8 knots in a 2 to 3 ft chop seems very limiting. I am not a speed freak (although one of my current boats runs 60+) but find that being able to cruise about 20 knots or so is very useful -- and sometimes safer when maneuvering around commercial traffic etc. I also hear that high tidal currents are part of the northwest boating reality so a little more comfortable speed is a plus. However a cat hull is a real reach for me -- I had the same problem going from inboards to outboards even with all their obvious advantages. thks again for the link and the sedan correction. Ed
Click to expand...
edc,

I'm not sure where you saw the information that said that a CD25 would only go 6-8 knots in 2-3 foot chop. Even with our CD22, we go anywhere between 9-12 knots in 2-3 foot chop. I would imagine you can go a little faster with a CD25. We boated almost exclusively in the San Juans for the last 6 seasons and our average cruise speed was between 16-20 knots in our CD22. And the water was rarely "glassy", mostly small chop and of course, sometimes much bigger. It also helps that we have both a Permatrim and Bennett trim tabs, although we mostly use the Permatrim to get the bow down and the trim tabs for lateral adjustments.

I'll await CD25 owners to add their opinions on the ride but I'm sure you'd be very happy with the boat ride the CD25 offers.
 
I agree with Peter on the speed in 2-3' chop. Another option to consider would be the Venture series, a bit more deadrise, the 26' would be the ticket if your looking for the head.
 
I agree with Peter on the higher speeds in chop. We have a 25 with twins, trim tabs and permatrims and only have to slow down to 6-8 if the waves are over 4ft, steep, and we are running upwind. This does happen of course but the boat still handles well in the larger waves.

One note. Don't use the visuals on this page to compare the boats.

http://www.c-dory.com/boats/

They represent the Tomcat as being much larger/wider than the 25 cruiser but they actually have the same width and nearly the same length. Try to see them both and tour the interiors before you really make the decision. We were gunning for the TomCat until we actually saw a 25 cruiser inside and loved the larger table, prefereed the cozy Vberth to the open bulkhead queen, and liked the look of the cruiser much better among other things.
 
I think the 6-8kts thing comes from a post by Bob in the thread I referenced. My experience with a cruiser is with the 22 and is as follows - in chop much over 1', I slowed from mid 20's down to around 20. In chop from 1-2' I was slowing to around 16-18kts. In chop from 2-3' I was down in the 8-12kt range and in chop over 3' I was generally below 8kts (all speeds going into the chop/waves - speeds would generally be higher with the waves at the stern).

In the sound and the San Juans, I rarely had to do under 16kts. Going W into the open swells of the ocean at Neah Bay, I was rarely able to go much faster than 16kts even with the bow trimmed down with Permatrims. With the Tomcat, I would be doing 26-30kts in similar conditions.
 
thks to all for the excellent insight. Any pros and cons to the 25 cruiser vs the 26 Venture other than the obvious cost and availability -- when did the venture come on the scene? thks again, Ed
 
Lets just say that I have seen a lot of blue water, and for our bodies, that going over 8 knots in true 2 1/2 foot seas will beat the heck out of you in a C Dory 25. The Tom Cat 255 will do 25 to 30 knots in true 3 foot chop--but much over that, then you are not going to keep that speed up.

The Tom Cat has a much bigger berth, easier to get in and out of. The entire interior, seems bigger and more comfortable to us--and we have owned both a C Dory 25 and a C Dory 22 at the same time, as the Tom Cat 255. The C Dory 25 will get slightly better fuel economy, but not a lot.

PM sent to edc.
 
edc,

This will give you an idea of where the extra size is in a TC255, on the Left and a CD-25 on the Right.
Broughtons_2008061.jpg
You can probably guess which one I'd recommend :wink:
 
Here is a link to a highly unsuccessful attempt to document more measures of at least the CD25.

http://www.c-brats.com/viewtopic.php?p= ... c9d2d8211b

It would be great if more detailed measures were available on the C-dory website or at least here.

Maybe I can dock next to Roger at Friday harbor and we can do a pictoral and dimensional comparison between the two models and post the info in a thread and one of our albums for future reference.

I don't have a recommendation for you other than to check them all out. j That can be a bit tough sometimes but use the C-brats to view the boats you are interested in if your local dealers can't provide the appropriate models. I would even recommend considering the 27. The interior of the Venture is significantly different than the 25 so again it is worth a look. If you were to post more specific needs and preferences, we could elaborate on more details for you as well.


Greg
 
I have a Tom Cat and love it, but it is more challenging to launch and retrieve, primarily because it sits so high on the trailer (see the photo above). All other things being equal, you need a steeper ramp with more water for the TC. It is also heavier and taller going down the road. And, of course, it costs more new but used ones are going at a greater discount.

Once on the water, those issues are moot.

Warren
 
I don't have a dog in this thread but, from reading your post speed is still important to you,
There the TomCat wins
Ride in a nasty chop Tom Cat wins.
Roomier cockpit bunk etc TomCat wins
Price new or used Cd-25 wins if less is better
If overall economy is a consideration Tom Cat loses big.
The TomCat is more to tow
needs two 135hp or 150 hp instead of one
uses more fuel
maintaining two engines instead of one
over cost to buy New comparing a Venture 26, or a C-Dory 25 and the TomCat I'm thinking the TomCat has to cost more
The trailer for the TomCat will cost more
The insurance will cost more
If you have the money the TomCat is the real deal, if ecomomy is part of the story a used CD 25 might be the ticket. It's your choice to make both great boats just different. Like others have said if buying new and you did not for some reason want to go TomCat I would go with a New Venture 26 instead of a CD-25. But that's just me.
D.D.
D.D.
 
Roger, are you sure that's a 25 next to the TC in your picture? Looks more like a 22 but I can't figure out where it came from. The TC is a little closer to the camera too, which makes it look bigger! My TC looks HUGE when it's out of the water...

Charlie
 
After considerable brainstorming, I have decided what you should do about this important decision. Buy one of each and keep the one you like the best. The other one, whichever it is, you can give to me and then we will both be happy. Please check your pms for shipping information..... :mrgreen:
 
Will-C":13qn8i5v said:
If overall economy is a consideration Tom Cat loses big.
The TomCat is more to tow
needs two 135hp or 150 hp instead of one
uses more fuel
maintaining two engines instead of one
D.D.
D.D.
Click to expand...

I agree with most of what D.D. says, except there is not that much difference in fuel economy. We get 2.2 to 2.3 miles per gallon on the Tom Cat at about 25 knots. We got about 2.5 miles per gallon at 17 knots on the C Dory 25. (Our over all "mileage" was more than this because we ran the 25 at displacement speed more than the Tom Cat--which is only at displacement speed in "no wake" zones. At least with the Suzukis the engines are loafing at cruising speed. Some of the 25's have dual engines--but the oil change and maintenance is a bit higher.

Towing costs--may be slighty more, but not that much difference if you are using the same size diesel truck. (and you do need a bigger truck for the Tom Cat than the 25). I cannot speak for the Venture 26, but comparing boats which I have owned with much more dead rise than the 26; the Tom Cat or any of the cats rides much better. I sold an 18 foot Century (18 degrees deadrise)--which was a better ride than the 22 and 25 in most cases-- and went to the Caracal Cat 18 and the ride is very similar to the Tom Cat.
 
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