State of Florida. report on anchoring & Mooring fields

T

thataway

Active member
The State of Florida Dept of Fish and Wild life Commission report on anchoring and mooring fields has issued an interim report on the various mooring fields/anchoring services. The final report will be no sooner than mid 2017. The experiment has been going on about 5 years.

However, anyone who is considering anchoring in the future in Florida waters may find this report interesting... It is a bit more critical of the cities than I had anticipated.. For the majority of small boats like our C Dorys not a lot of impact except in very specific areas---but the laws derived from this experiment may become state wide.

One concern which hit me on fairly quick review of the document, was about "marine sanitation". One local enforcement officer suggested that "portable toilets be banned in Florida!". One other field manager commented on proof of pompous--including receipts from portable toilets dump facility! (So you cannot dump at your own home?)... For those of use in small boats with out fixed toilets and holding tanks (composting toilets were not specifically addressed.), this can be a dangerous precedent.
 
We had legislation passed a few years back, here in the province of British Columbia, that looked at first glance like it was outlawing the use of porta pottis of all kinds on boats. In the end there was nothing to be concerned about because there were allowances made for "permanently anchored porta pottis that were plumbed with self contained black water holding tanks".

The main concern for the law makers was the fact that the older boats had heads that vacated the untreated sewage directly into the waterways. The laws were likely drafted by folks with little to no actual knowledge of the evolution of marine heads over the past 50 or so years. We have been stopped by the Coast Guard and the local RCMP water patrol for inspections on a number of occasions and the porta potti aspect of our current boat has never been an issue. At the time the law became official our marina did cap off the outlet from the old marine head just so the boat would pass future surveys.
 
We were in B.C. late this past summer. I noticed that a lot of marinas did not have any pump out stations available. We did pay to use them when they were available. It seems funny that they would ban porta potties when all of that boats that cruise up into Desolation sound have very limited or no pump out stations available at marinas and fuel docks. Given the situation people with macerators or buckets have no choice really. It was great heading back into the U.S. for free pump outs available as I imagine the U.S. government subsidizes marina pump outs in an effort to keep the waters clean. Given the number of boats in Desolation Sound in August I would think Canada might consider doing the same. At the least require marinas have pump outs at a cost. My thought is the area is certainly beautiful enough that they would want to do everything possible to keep it pristine. I know the pump out program here in the states has cleaned up the waters significantly and especially in Florida. Just an observation not meant to poke the bear here.
D.D.
 
More mommy gobment. I'm so tired of the rules, regulations, orders...all ties to fees, of course. Gobment is way too big and way too intrusive.

My nine gallons of water and pee are not gonna kill the environment.
 
Maverick boaters having no intention of following overboard discharge rules or
common sense and decency ruin popular anchorages for the rest of us.
It's another case of a few rotten apples... It seems to always happen.
It's not new. I've seen it in several areas and it is disgusting.

Popular anchorages attract many. With many comes 'The Bell Curve' of those
who are responsible and expect the same from others only to be disappointed
by the others. It's a sign of the times and most distressing to me is there is not
much you can do about it except complain, explain and refrain.

Like Malibu was once paradise. Once 'found', kiss it goodbye.

Aye.
Grandpa used to say, "Had enough? Call Dr Kevorkian."
 
Foggy, I don't disagree with you in principle, but what are you supposed to do when there are NO pump outs or porta-potty dumps? We have a composting toilet, so the only issue is the liquid bottle (urine). And while we can argue whether urine is sterile or not (it technically is not but practically is), when there is no alternative available, it IS going overboard!
 
localboy":3p9qci23 said:
...My nine gallons of water and pee are not gonna kill the environment. ...
Click to expand...

Get enough people with that attitude and things get really mucked up.

Seems to be happening a lot lately. "My [whatever] won't hurt anything, the rules are ridiculous (i.e. inconvenient), and they aren't really talking about my situation anyway."
 
Pat Anderson":21tx60ej said:
Foggy, I don't disagree with you in principle, but what are you supposed to do when there are NO pump outs or porta-potty dumps? We have a composting toilet, so the only issue is the liquid bottle (urine). And while we can argue whether urine is sterile or not (it technically is not but practically is), when there is no alternative available, it IS going overboard!
Click to expand...

You can argue about whether urine is sterile or not. However, it is definitely not chemically inert. The ammonia can affect marine life and water quality. Excretions of medicinal byproducts or excesses can also affect marine life and water quality. A bunch of snorkelers ("Ooh, isn't that fish pretty! .....aaahhhh....") peeing on a reef will definitely affect the coral.

The logic that everything else that comes out of the human body is a biohazard except urine just does not make sense.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-new ... 180954809/
 
Looks like we are gong to have to get rid of all of those pesky fish and mammals who "pee" in the ocean....oh wait...there is good evidence that when fish urine content is decreased the reef health diminishes...
The "evidence" that human urine might be harmful to coral reefs, is due to algae blooms--which are increased by increased nitrogen in the water.. (Ie urea). The "Study" which suggested this had to do with sewage off the coast of Mexico...

There are natural cycles--and too much of anything is an issue...also pathogens are a problem--so caution needs to be exercised...

I am not encouraging discharge of pollutants in closed systems, or near shore...

The mention of holding tanks/portipotty is incidental to the study.

Ken--I have skimmed each page, but will be reading it in detail over the next day or so...
 
thataway":37jee7xm said:
Looks like we are gong to have to get rid of all of those pesky fish and mammals who "pee" in the ocean....oh wait...there is good evidence that when fish urine content is decreased the reef health diminishes...
...
Click to expand...

On the other hand throw a bunch of fish and a marine mammal or two in your swimming pool. You might not be too happy with the result.
 
Adult Potty Training 101

Those who put their excrement (solid and/or liquid) into the water that
belongs to all of is not acceptable. If you are doing this, stop. If you are
doing this, you are part of the problem (the proverbial rotten apple), not
part of the solution.

What can you do? Folks, it's not that difficult so please don't snivel about it.

Like in some/most land based National Parks, leave everything as you found
it. This means everything. Used to be OK to bury your waste but now many
places you cannot. What do you do? Anticipate your needs, prepare and
"pack it out". In boats, bring an extra container or so and dispose on shore
in appropriate sewage site.

"No alternative" to dumping overboard only exists for the thoughtless.

Aye.
You don't want to know what Grandma used to say.
 
So, pee while swimming, fine, pee off the side while fishing, fine, pee into a bottle--then go pour that bottle overboard--and the result is now somehow a discharge of toxins?
At one point all the sewage produced by the town of Key West ran straight out to sea, untreated in any way. The sea life probably loved the nutrition.

I see a big difference between solids and urine, which is instantly diluted way beyond what is required for safety.

But yes, I know that some pigs would discharge 30 gallons while tied up at a marina. So don't swim near the marina!
 
ssobol":2idl5nnq said:
localboy":2idl5nnq said:
...My nine gallons of water and pee are not gonna kill the environment. ...
Click to expand...

Get enough people with that attitude and things get really mucked up.

Seems to be happening a lot lately. "My [whatever] won't hurt anything, the rules are ridiculous (i.e. inconvenient), and they aren't really talking about my situation anyway."
Click to expand...

How much urine, feces etc do orca produce? Seals? Sea lions? Salmon? Again. My NINE GALLONS is not gonna do any damage. It's mostly water. I've attempted to use myriad pump stations in the PNW. Most don't function. So I'll mix my minute amount into the Sound and it won't keep me awake. Perhaps I'll just start standing on the swimstep and peeing directly into the water...
 
ssobol":b8bac2mr said:
thataway":b8bac2mr said:
Looks like we are gong to have to get rid of all of those pesky fish and mammals who "pee" in the ocean....oh wait...there is good evidence that when fish urine content is decreased the reef health diminishes...
...
Click to expand...

On the other hand throw a bunch of fish and a marine mammal or two in your swimming pool. You might not be too happy with the result.
Click to expand...

A swimming pool is a closed/finite system. The ocean is not. I can make absurd comparisons too but what's the use.
 
I have been following along with this thread and there are some very interesting points that have been made.
On the subject of raw sewage being discharged in to ocean and inland waterways, It is a fact that the greater metropolitan area of Victoria BC on Vancouver Island, Canada (population of over 300,000) has been discharging all of their untreated raw sewage in to the strait of Juan DeFuca for ever since anyone can remember and is still doing so to this day. They do have plans to build a treatment plant someday, but who knows how long it will take.
http://www.victoriasewagealliance.org/i ... liance.htm

While I am not saying that this is a good thing, in comparison to what we are talking about here it makes you wonder.
 
It's pretty amazing these countries worry about boater porta potties and let a whole cities dump all it's crap via straight pipe right into the water. I was reading a cruising guide for Cuba and they don't have boat pump outs there either. They say that your not supposed to discharge in the marina but some do. Just another reason I don't think I'll be going there. I can't even imagine pumping out the turd tank right in the marina. That's down right offensive. That would make for a very funny commercial for pushing an Airhead composting toilet. No wonder I did not see any Orcas up there in B.C. They're probably all are sick with cholera. If urine isn't so bad it sure gets pretty funky if you leave it around in a container for a day or two. Diapers are so gross, and what about diaper rash. I'm done!
D.D. :mrgreen:
 
We're talking Florida anchoring and mooring fields here - where folks swing on
the hook, swim, maybe fish - not open ocean.

It makes a difference discharging effluent in close quarters where people
congregate opposed to the open sea.

Aye.
 
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