Etec fumes??? - Honda ?? repower for 22

J

jstates

New member
I have read hundreds of posts here for last 2 months regarding repowering the 22 - from a 75 Honda that runs great to an Etec 90 or 115 or Honda 90 - + kicker I am about to make the final decision - clearly most of the new engines are great - what I have taken from many posts:

Choose engines that can be serviced locally? = Honda and Etec at Pickering Marine [Suzuki / Yamaha would be great if I had local service]

Choose engines that can be serviced in the areas you plan to explore

Be sure to have enough HP for future endeavors. Loaded to go to Alaska, more grandchildren on board etc.

Because my boat is on the water all year - and used all year - close to 160-200 hrs - planning on an increase in 2010, I am more inclined to go etec due to service and ease of fogging.

I am very sensitive to kerosene, oil fumes. I read the Etec site about EPA awards etc but a friend of mine has 125 or 150 etec and when trolling has fume problems.
I don't fish - hope to some day - and would like to troll on a Honda Kicker 9.9 or lower - as well as do hull speed on a kicker for mellow travel.

So does any one have a problem with etec fumes from a health point. I read some posts about people having problems a few years ago - but what about the etgec engines in the last 2 years. -

I realize all 4 and 2 stroke engines create exhaust that easily gets trapped in cockpit - one friend indicated the slight etec odor at least warns you

Any other thoughts about repowering. I will have a Honda 75 to sell at some point. 650 hrs just tuned it and lubed. Thanks

Jim
 
My experience with E-tec 90.

With a net positive following wind, at lower rpm's you will smell engine exhaust, although its invisible.

At cruising speed, its never an issue.

Avoid trolling on the main, it will eat your spark plugs platinum tips.

I like my E-tec, and it has over 300 hours now.
 
I would go with a 115 either yamaha or suzuki I'm sure you can find service in olympia. If you truly plan to cruise loaded down more power would be better. :thup
 
Verle's in Shelton sells both Yamaha and Suzuki. I have a friend that has had trouble with an Etec on a new North River. It's been in the shop quite frequently. He's a retired machinist so its not like he doesn't know what he's doing. I know one of the problems was fluctuating RPMs while underway.
Forrest
 
A few months ago Trailer Boat Mag had an article on the Etec 115 High Output Very favorable write up. If I remember right, almost 10 hp more at the prop.
Chuck
 
Before anybody panics, please note that all engines put out exhaust.

The Honda on Journey On is no exception. At cruising speeds, we have to close the cabin door to keep fumes out of the cabin (and it makes it quieter, too.) It's not the motor, but the squared off aft cabin and transom which creates a low pressure area and sucks up a small amount of exhaust.

The ETEC does mix some oil with the exhaust, but the quantity is small enough to qualify it for a clean engine rating. I think either engine would be a great choice. The ETEC is lighter, but in both cases the money leaves the US: ETEC to Canada, Honda to Japan.

Boris
 
The ETEC is built in Wisconsin. I Had one on a previous center console and loved it great power and light weight. The exhaust smell I did have had a slightly sweet smell (due the synthetic oil I presume), I used the XD100 oil and with 100 hours of ~4400 rpm a summer would use 1 gallon of oil ($38.00). All that being said, If had to do it again , I'd probably pick a 90 Yamaha over the ETEC due to the incredibly smooth idle of the YAMI. :P
 
Jim,

I'm totally biased towards Suzuki's after my experience with our Suzy 90hp, therefore I would choose a Suzuki 90 over a Yamaha. Plus, the new Suzuki's are lighter than their predecessors (our model).

In the words of Jim (jennykatz) from the Cruiser 22 w/ 115 thread yesterday,

jennykatz Jim":394jetv4 said:
We had a c-22 cruiser with a 06 suzuki 90 which the suzuki rep said was a 100hp we ran a 14by 18 suzuki s/s prop she would top out at 34-35 mph at 5800rpm the rep said with 115 it would rev tp 6200rpm and give a few more mph These are great engines I now have the Yamaha what a whimp compared to the suzuki
Click to expand...
 
Well, the capital Sea is powered with the new Honda 90 and a Honda 9.9.
We did Desolation Sound loaded to the gills with prawn and crab traps and two weeks of non-perishable food. We also had an inflatable and a small Honda for it. We covered a lot of water and cannot imagine needing more HP.
We have not noticed any exhaust and the 90 runs very smooth at all speeds. When the boat was first delivered the 90 was running cold and Tom's Outboard in Olympia communicated with the factory and changed the thermostat. Since that time smooth as silk.
Tom's is a great dealer and is as honest as they come. He even deterred me from buying the 9.9 from him as J & E Power of Olympia has the lowest prices in the region. Not sure about pricing for the 90 but I would get quotes from those two.
We have the 9.9 tied in with the 90 for steering with a removable link. The 9.9 is an electric start /tilt and we did not have the throttle cables installed so it still has the tiller arm. We installed a fishpro servo so we have throttle on a leash that works both at the helm and throughout the boat. With this set up the 9.9 must be mounted on the starboard side in order for the 9.9 to not run out of room in the well when turning to port. I think you would have the same issue if you hardwired the 9.9's throttle and eliminated the tiller arm.

Redundancy: The 9.9 can be pull started and has solid charging power, so your dead battery will be charged in no time, should you ever need that. I had a "t" installed with a fuel line branch long enough to reach a small Honda tank (that comes with the 9.9) so if the larger tanks get fowled you can get a good long way on a separate gas supply. That small tank fits in the center rear, just aft of where the floor drops off between the fixed tanks.
 
Last year I was stopped by Marine Patrol for a safety check on the lower Saint Johns River. The Marine Patrol was in a Boston Whaler with what I think was a 115 E-Tec. He rafted up to us and let his engine idle while conducting the check the fumes were so bad I was sick for the rest of the day ( I have emphysema). My GF noticed them also and asked the officer if his engine was a diesel because it really stunk. In all fairness the area we were in was about a 5 mile stretch of now wake zone so I expect he did alot of operating at idle speed. If you are sensitive to fumes I'd defiantely stay away from and e-tec. I troll with my Suzuki 90 4/S for hours and never notice any fumes.
 
Tom's is a great dealer...
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I agree with Capital Sea (great name for an Olympian :wink) on this.

As I think about repowering I keep Tom's in mind. In '06 they quoted me $1800 to overhaul the original Johnson 70. As I recall it was something that they could do in a day. I still might go that way...

At different times I've been excited by the Yamaha, then the E-Tec.

Right now the new Suzukis have captured my imagination. Big prop. Light(er) weight.
 
I also have the EFI Honda 90 (BF90D) and it's a fantastic engine. We use our boat to get to a cabin in the San Juans and I've never been wanting for more power, even with 6 people, 2 golden retrievers, and gear for the weekend. Perhaps tpbrady will respond to this thread. I recall that he had an E-Tec originally and re-powered with the Honda BF90D.

In terms of smell from the engine, the Honda is hardly noticeable. In fact, I've never been bothered by it in 200+ hours of operation.
 
I found the ETEC had many of the problems pointed out here.

a. Don't troll with it unless you like to buy plugs. After about an hour, at least one of them would foul.
b. XD-100 is expensive. You can end up using a lot of it in certain operating conditions. At 36 dollars a gallon and a gallon going about 50 hours (I never saw more than 30), you could change the oil twice in the Honda 90 for the same money if you change it yourself and use good oil.
c. Yes it does smell if idling with the wind blowing the wrong direction.

After working on the Honda and working on the ETEC, one thing stands out, the Honda build quality is head and shoulders above the ETEC. Little things like replacing the plugs is easy on the Honda and just as easy on the ETEC until you get to the one on the bottom. Honda puts a little removable panel there to remove the bottom plug. The bottom plug on the ETEC is a chore with sockets universal drives an the like. The wiring is not nearly as well done and secured to prevent chafing. On the ETEC, I managed to cut a wire to the tilt trim switch just putting the cover back on. My information is dated though since I swapped out the ETEC in 2006.
 
Not sure if this matters, but it seems to me it would:

E-Tec 90: 81 amps , 25 dedicated = 56 remaining.

Honda 90: 44 amps, 9 dedicated = 35 remaining.

Honda 9.9 kicker puts out 12amps


Every hour you run with an E-tec you get an additional 21 amps of battery power. On a sail boat people spends lots of money to get that amount of power, that's equal to about 250 watts of solar panel in full light.
 
I have 1990 22 cruiser and repowered this year with a 90 etec. Im not sensitive to smell. To me the smell of a traditional two stroke is just part of boating. The first time I got a wiff of the etec I was entering a tidal river, wind from the rear cruising slow, cabin door open with the bimini up. The motor was at factory setting for twc or Evinrude 50 oil and I was using the Evinrude 50. The smell sucked I was hoping it was the lobster boat that I just past, it wasn't. I have since changed to 100% synthetic Evinrude oil and engine is still set at the factory setting. I havn't noticed any more smell after 80 hrs of use. The snout full occurred when engine had only a few hrs on it. Maybe someone that has one set for the 100 % syn oil can tell you what they have notice. I like the engine seems to be a good fit for the boat. Ive never owned or even been in a boat with four stroke so I can't make a comparison. Oh ya! I never told my wife I switched oil she claimed she smelled something while entering the river. The wind was off the bow no way did she smell anything. The next time I find a hook up for 45 years its going to be a woman that dosn't speak english.
 
Love our Suzuki 150. Small, effecient and quiet (you don't even know it's idling).

Let me put a plug in for Kitsap Marine, the Suzuki (and Yamaha) dealer in Port Orchard.
 
localboy":vzu5bgcr said:
Let me put a plug in for Kitsap Marine, the Suzuki (and Yamaha) dealer in Port Orchard.
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And Evinrude!

RonMac-

The Evinrude does oil heavier during the first hours of use for break in. The computer does this, which is why there is no break in period for the motor. You can run them as you would normally right out of the box.

As for price- yes, the XD100 Synthetic oil is more expensive, but after the break in period, it will use significantly less than the regular TCW-3 (XD30).
 
Thanks for the thoughtful comments from everyone - and the recommendations to consider Toms Outboard and Kitsap Marina -The crew at Toms Outboard was very patient with questions & pricing. Matt at Kitsap Marina has been very helpful on the phone, offering various technical and trade in options.]

We are fortunate in South Sound to have Kitsap Marina, Toms Outboard, Verles, & Pickering Marine - all nearby. I plan a little contemplation time before final choice.

Thanks again - great discussion -

Jim
 
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