Bilge pump and wiring

F

ferret30

New member
My bilge got something stuck in the impeller that prevented it from running when I hit the manual on switch. It fried the fuse (10A) which I can replace, but should the pump still be ok after this? From the dash light it looks like it might have been turned on for >30s seized before the fuse burnt.

Second, the wiring for the pump seems hacky. It's got regular (non-waterproof) wire nuts in the starboard hatch and in the bilge 6" away from the pump. These wire connections were wrapped in some black tape that didn't seem water resistant either. I know there are "waterproof" wire nuts but I'd prefer to use something like a waterproof inline crimp splice that can be cleanly wrapped with thick self-sealing electrical tape stuff (don't know what it's called).

Sorry for multiple threads but it's probably better for future reference to keep topics separate, right?

Thanks!
 
Captains Cat":3rb155pg said:
Clean out the pump suction, put in a new fuse and try it. Hard to tell from here! :roll:

Charlie
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Ok, maybe I wasn't clear. I know I can test out the pump myself. What I meant was:

Even if the pump still works after cleaning it (which I did) and replacing the fuse, should it be trusted? The boat only has a single bilge and this one was turned on while stuck for >30s until the fuse burnt up.
 
Two year's ago, I had a 5-amp fuse for the bilge go bad, but it passed a continuity check! When I put the voltage meter on it, it would only allow about 6 volts to pass -- not 12. Essentially, the metallic element was corroded, and it would not allow the bilge pump to operate. After replacing the fuse, everything worked fine, so I agree with Sea Wolf that to be safe, just replace it.

Rich
 
Yep, I found a RuleMate manual online, and I don't currently know which pump it is (the boat is stored 15 miles away) but the recommended fuse size is 1.5A or 2.5A. The installed fuse was 10A! Might be good to keep a replacement on board at least! Actually, I need to dig around a little since I think the boat may have come with a spare...

If my driveway wasn't off of a 15% inclined street I'd keep my boat in my driveway and work on it anytime!

Thanks guys
 
C-Nile":3kc4sfd2 said:
Two year's ago, I had a 5-amp fuse for the bilge go bad, but it passed a continuity check! When I put the voltage meter on it, it would only allow about 6 volts to pass -- not 12. Essentially, the metallic element was corroded, and it would not allow the bilge pump to operate. After replacing the fuse, everything worked fine, so I agree with Sea Wolf that to be safe, just replace it.

Rich
Click to expand...

Are you saying to replace the pump or the fuse? I was thinking of replacing the pump since it was powered so long while the fuse burnt, but your message is making me think you're talking about just replacing the fuse.

In my case the 10A fuse (too big according to the RuleMate instructions) is definitely burnt and the plastic part of the fuse is deformed.
 
Dreamer":fmhb47xu said:
f-30,

Drop by Fisheries Supply in Seattle and get some ofThese They'll keep water out of your connections.
Click to expand...

Perfect. I suspected there was an ideal connector. Time to get rid of some big wads of tape and wire nuts!
 
I once owned a boat where the connector of choice was wire nuts, and the fastener of choice were sheetrock screws. Ugh. The things some guys do....

If the pump runs, I think you may be okay, but if you have doubts, replace it for the peace of mind. A few hundered bucks for new pump and connectors is better than lying awake at night!
 
I believe the Rule 1100 specifies a 5 AMP fuse. By having a 10 AMP fuse in place, it allowed 10 AMPS of current to the motor windings, creating a lot of heating, and possibly melted the windings' insulation coatings. So it is best to replace the motor, and insure that the fuse you use is the one specified by the manufacturer. If you had a 5 AMP fuse in place, and the motor seized, you might have gotten away with not replacing the pump, but at 10 AMPS, you're taking a chance in using the old pump.

I apologize for the confusion I caused on my previous post.

Thanks!

Rich
 
Just because there's a 10A fuse in place that burned out doesn't mean that 10A went through the motor windings. The motor (when working properly) will only draw the amount of current that 12V through the motor windings will allow - in this case < the 1.5 or 2.5 A or 5A fuse that Rule specifies (it's hard to tell what Rule really specifies from the above collection of posts). The purpose of the fuse is NOT to protect the pump but rather to protect the wiring to and from the pump. If a 10A fuse blew, it suggests a leak to ground someplace in the wiring system as opposed to burn pump windings. Given the brief description of the less than quality wiring job that the previous owner did, my bet is that the pump is just fine. I'd replace any connectors that look bad with proper marine connectors and assure that marine grade wiring was used. A bilge pump should be able to run many, many minutes without burning up (>30s is not a problem).
 
rogerbum":hmenslaa said:
Just because there's a 10A fuse in place that burned out doesn't mean that 10A went through the motor windings. The motor (when working properly) will only draw the amount of current that 12V through the motor windings will allow - in this case < the 1.5 or 2.5 A or 5A fuse that Rule specifies (it's hard to tell what Rule really specifies from the above collection of posts). The purpose of the fuse is NOT to protect the pump but rather to protect the wiring to and from the pump. If a 10A fuse blew, it suggests a leak to ground someplace in the wiring system as opposed to burn pump windings. Given the brief description of the less than quality wiring job that the previous owner did, my bet is that the pump is just fine. I'd replace any connectors that look bad with proper marine connectors and assure that marine grade wiring was used. A bilge pump should be able to run many, many minutes without burning up (>30s is not a problem).
Click to expand...

Hi Roger, I believe the pump was seized and powered for >30s, not running dry. It has run fine until this weekend and I verified by hand that something was keeping the impeller from spinning. When I tested it, I turned the pump on with the manual override on the console and it lit up for 30s or more but the pump was silent because it was stuck. at least tours that's what I'm thinking.
 
Contrary to what others have said here, I would assume the pump saw 10amps. An electric motor that has voltage applied is almost a dead short (limited only by the winding resistance which is not a lot) until it starts to turn and then the counter electromagnetic force reduces the current flow. If you hang up a downrigger ball , you blow the fuse because the motor won't turn.

The pump , if working, is likely OK but you seem worried about it, so for a few bucks buy another and take a load off your mind.
 
I agree completely with Papacorn. In addition, if the person has only one bilge pump, the possibility for Murphy to strike should not be overlooked: the pump could fail at a time when it is most needed.

Rich
 
I agree, this is a good time to install a back up bilge pump after you fix the connections on the primary pump. Redundancy in this area is a great thing.

On a 22' a quick install which avoids another through hull is to plumb the outflow up through the base of the motor well and to install a manual switch in the battery compartment. Dead rise is only a few inches and the pump puts out a strong flow as installed. I keep a plug in the exposed opening to prevent anything from falling into the opening when not in use.

My primary pump periodically gets fouled with pine needles and this setup allows me to evacuate the water so I can work in a dry bilge well.
 
I would suggest you replace the pump based on two points: 1) The motor was shorted for greater than 30 seconds with a 10A fuse and 2) The pump uses a brushed motor. During the 30 second short, the brushes likely arced to the armature. While the damage may not be significant initially, the brushes could be damaged enough to start self-destructing quickly.

My recommendation would be to replace the pump and make sure you've fused it with the correct fuse. With due respect to one of the posts, with a higher amp fuse, your pump will see higher wattage (volts times amps) than with a lower amp fuse.

As always, great recommendations from the C-Brat folks!

DaveM
 
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