Another Leaky 25

C

caution

New member
After almost two years of trying to find out why our cabin floor keeps getting wet, we think we may finally have tracked it down to 2 problems:

* The shower drains into a small plastic box that houses a sump pump that is supposed to pump that water over the side. The sump pump quit working, so any water in the shower ended up in the cabin. (This is now fixed.)

* The current problem is the exhaust pipe from the Wallas stove. I think the actual problem is that when we're in rough water, spray enters the exhaust pipe, then shoots up past the end of the pipe and leaks back down the outside of the pipe. (Because the flexible metal tube that connects from the stove to the exhaust pipe does not make a perfect seal around the pipe.) I pretty much proved this by spraying a hose at the outside exhaust pipe opening and watching it drip out.

So my plan was to:

1) re-seal the flexible tubing to the exhaust pipe so that any water that entered the pipe would not be allowed to leak back out.

2) install a big clam shell over the exhaust pipe opening on the outside of the boat, to stop spray from getting in in the first place.

The question is this: when we talked to a local marine shop about this, (Harbor Marine, in Everett, WA), they advised not to install the clam shell. The said that the heat from the exhaust would damage the gel coat and result in fibreglass repairs down the road. Does anyone have any thought on this? There are some very large clam shells that stand off a good inch or two from the mounting surface, I have a hard time believing that would allow the exhaust to heat up the gel coat enough to damage it. But I'd hate to find out the hard way.

Any thoughts?

Thanks in advance...

Tom and Sherry on the Caution Horse
 
I think we sometimes go too far in getting the "factory" involved. The wallas issue doesn't sound like a factory issue. The factory has bent over backwards in fixing stuff but if we press them too hard, it'll end. At some point, we have to take responsibilty for out boats. IMHO.

Let's find out if anyone else has had the problem and fix it ourselves and save the factory for the major issues.

charlie
 
I would advise against the clamshell. It might impart resistance to the free flow of air through the stove. I was able to seal my joint with foil tape.
 
Yeah, I'm going to handle this one. Just to clarify, the factory has been very helpful and supportive all along, this has just been a tough one to nail down for various reasons. (Long story.)
 
I haven't had the second problem of a leak from the Wallas exhaust, but I want to address the first issue for any new 25 owners.

We had this problem the first season that we had our 25. We replaced the first little bilge in there with a Rule. That helped a lot, but it still didn't solve the problem. In researching it I discovered that this is a universal problem with these little sump pump arrangements on boats. The problem seems to be that the float valve gets sticky when sitting for long periods between use. One solution is to use a product called CP (found at West Marine) in the drain occasionally. It will lubricate the float switch and help prevent this problem.
Lyle
 
Just finish reading C-Dory warranty. Pretty self explanatory, if the factory installed it they should fix it . Providing the owner uses common sense , there is a 5 year limited warranty that is included when buying a new C-Dory .


SEARAM
 
I agree with Gary. You should get a boat that's water tight. And if not, the factory should make it water tight. That doesn't seem like too much to ask.
 
Maybe the Wallas outlet should be installed above the gunnel or with an inverted gooseneck to prevent water intrusion?

This siimilar to gas vent problems that we've had on older model boats.

Water entered the gas tanks through the vents in heavy water from the splashing.

The old style vents, which went straignt down into the tanks, were replaced with newer ones that had inverted goosenecks.

Joe.
 
I installed a modified charlie nobel on my sail boat that worked quite well preventing any wave splash from entering the the Wallis exhaust port. The ends are cut back slightly so that the hot exhaust clears the hull. See the 4th picture over under additional detail images on my Web page.

http://home.bendcable.com/brooksfamily/

However, I have not had any problems on my C-Dory's straight through exhaust.

Hank Brooks
 
I tend to go along with Charlie's comments. Our boats are used in so many different ways and every owner expects different things from the boating experience. For me, few things give me as much satisfaction as solving a tricky boat repair and being able to do it myself. I have often gotten good advice on this site which steered me in the right direction. Of course I often find the repair beyond my capabilities, but even then a basic understanding of what is wrong will give me a leg up when dealing with the dealer, factory, etc.
 
Tom-

Here's a photo of the Force 10 Cozy cabin Charlie Noble type of exhaust outlet on my boat.

Exhaust_cap_installed.jpg



Although it's vertical, it could be easily mounted sideways. It has a heat resistant gasket that can help retard hull problems from the hot exhaust gases.

I't still follow Dan's advice of using a heat resistant RTV sealant on the joints, however, and build in an inverted gooseneck to stop any water intrusion, whether running in the stove on or stove off mode.

I don't think the gooseneck would be any problem, since the Wallas stove has a fan powered forced exhaust system.

However, the Wallas is a somewhat overly complicated and engineered product, so you might consult with Karl at Scan Marine before making any changes!

Ley us know how it goes!

Joe.
 
The wet cabin sole in Jammin took a while to track down because it seemed to originate in the aft part of the boat when the water was actually coming from the anchor chain locker and flowing down the hidden concave channels in both chines. It would appear mostly after the boat went on plane and the bow rose.

Porbably not your problem as you have most likely looked in the cabinets for wet chines.

Dennis
 
I suppose its time for me to chime in about the challenges I've encountered in working toward a dry cabin sole in my new (July 2004) CD25.

First there were the leaking screws from the house top hand rails.

Second there was the aft deck hatches that needed replacing to become water tight.

Next was the flooded cabin sole I encountered after the boat was left to its own for a month on the mooring. See pics in Seasprite subalbum "Leaks" (good thing the bilge pumps kept pumping)

Currently I am in process of curing a still leaking forward hatch and another leak in the o-ringed access port on the aft deck.

I will describe my solutions in a later post on this thread when I get some more writing.

To the factory's credit I must say that I enjoy a good relationship with Jeff and Brett and they have paid for materials while I devoted my time. The actual cures were not very time consuming but were vexing in that as soon as I thought I had one fixed, the floor stayed wet and I had to keep looking and testing. The hunt was confusing since water tends to pool under the cabin step where the thru hull is located and the source for the worst leak (anchor locker floor to hull joint drain hole) was in the bow. This leak only occured when the drain was submersing in waves while underway or at the mooring, so it was intermitent. I do believe that C-Dory has modified some of their design, construction and quality control procedures by now to eliminate issues in new production.
 
I don't mean to minimize the frustration of wet feet in the cabin, but sometimes I think we can have too high of an expectation of perfection on these boats. My 25 had a variety of small problems when I got it, and I got very worked up about it. Most of them are solved, but I've also learned that this is also part of the learning curve with boats.

It is a water sport and sometimes you're going to encounter some water. I checked out some quality new boats that cost $400,000 and up at the boat show and they all had some water in the bilge. I think the fact that there is no bilge under the cabin of the C-Dory makes them seem more prone to leak problems. It's not draining down behind paneling and furniture and going into the bilge, it's ending up on the floor.

In particular, the more I learn about boats with self bailing rear decks, the more convinced I become that it is almost impossible to keep the bilge areas in them completely dry. If you read about other quality boats with self bailing rear decks and plastic hatches you'll see that this is a universal problem. These areas aren't really designed to stay dry and they don't. The plastic hatches just won't keep all of the water out of the bilge compartments below. C-Dory has replaced mine with different styles and rebedded them. I have much less water in them now, but they still leak when the cockpit gets water in it from rain or cleaning.

I'm not trying to start a controversy here. I know that when we spend this much money on a big toy we want perfection and lack of problems that lead to stress. This is my first real boat and I'm learning that boats will always have problems and need upkeep. The bigger the boat and the more systems, the more problems that you'll have. We've found that our 25 has created so many pleasurable opportunities and moments that it's worth the occasional hassle.
Lyle
 
Yes, with any NEW design comes the tried and true testing of the folks who buy them putting them to use in ALL conditions. Some things simply can not be figured out sitting at a computer looking at CADs, at a drawing desk drawing and re-drawing, ......ya just gotta build a few, and adjust fire on items and make changes as we learn things from our boats.

I think those of you who put your money down on new designed hulls and are the leading edge users for the rest of us who buy the hulls after a dozen or so are out on the waters are under appreciated. I thank each of you for your willingness to just jump on board and GO!!

At the same time, we can do this with C-Dory boats for the reasons of knowing the factory will stand behind the boat and make things good, and, if needed, change the design/assembly methods as to eliminate the problems for follow on hulls.
 
Well said Lyle. I was getting water in the bildge when not taking any water in the cockpit. I traced the problem to the bronze boat plug. It was not sealed when it was installed and water was getting in. The factory replaced with a new sealed plug assembly. I still get water in the bildge but only when it rains.
 
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