110 yanmar for 25 ranger a complete horror story

F

FGRVONROTH

New member
Today marks the end of the 4th week my Ranger 25 has been on "the hard". the reason for this is because my new boat with 50 hours on it seemed to have a serious problem (bent valve).When this happened I heard a large bang and killed the engine. After being towed to the marina the boat was hauled,engine removed, then the head was removed. At that point the Yanmar distributor was contacted and after another week decided the head should be sent to them for inspection. Several days past, at that point I figured if i wanted to use my boat at all this season I had to get involved. I called the person who sold me the boat and explained to them what I had been told."There was no replacement head available in the US" and they hoped they could rebuild the head? That being unexeceptable to me I pushed further and found that a new head would be shipped to the yard that was working on my boat from Atlanta GA. A few more days past and i got in contact with the distributor for Yanmar on the East coast, the person there informed me that the head was not being shipped to my yard but was sitting at their shop in Mass. When i asked them why, they informed me that thay didn't have a gasket set for the 110 Yanmar and it had to shipped from Japan which could take as much as 2 weeks but it was "rushed" and maybe would arrive in as little as 3 days. Well that was 6 days ago and after callling Ranger who put me in touch with their distributor on the West coast to help expedite the problem called me back 3 days later and told me that this was indeed a problem and that they were tryng to remedy the situation & would let me know. Well its now Sunday (the beginning of the 5th week) and tomorrow I will call and find out what is happening.
I guess I just want all to know that I am completly distraught with the service Yanmar has provided me and their lack of response to the end user. I thought all potential buyers should know this.
I would also like to say that Ranger has seemed to try to help though to no avail thus far.I also want everyone to know that the people who represent Yanmar in the US have been polite and tried to answer my questions & have done their best but this has not got me back on the water. I feel their hands are tied by lack of customer satisfaction by the parent company,Yanmar.
Is there no such thing as Fed ex in Japan? Is there not such thing as dealing with a customer with a brand new boat which has failed? Is there no commitmetment by Yanmar to back their product? Should Yanmar have replacement parts available for immediate shipment to fix engines that they sell in the US? I mean how can a company with international sales have such a weak excuse?
In this day of age I find this completley unexcusable.
I have cruised over 6000 hours in my life time, and even stuck in Puerto Rico because of a major failure, Cummins got me back on the water in 24 hours. So if your thinking of having a boat powered by Yanmar you might want to consider my story.
 
I don't blame you for being upset! Any idea why the valve failed? This sounds like a manufacturing defect. The other question I would ask, is how about a new engine? If the valve broke, it may well have hit the piston, and may have had an effect on the cylinder, connecting yard, bearings and even crank shaft???

We have had Yanmar engines mostly in our gensets. In some countries we found no parts, in others we found that even small villages had parts. Our experience was "sporatic" at the best.

One of the spares we always carried for all engiens was a spare set of gaskets, including a head gasket. But one would not think that would be necessary in the US.

If the dealer is not doing his job, then I would put pressure on the factory. Of course, the engine is the engine's manufactuer's problem!
 
Hi Bob
Thanks for your support. When the failure first happened there was talk of a new engine replacement. The head was removed and I was told that the piston in question had a very slight mark, but it was doubtful after viewing it that the damage went beyond the head.
I have done everything from starting with the yard working on the engine, to Ranger who got me in touch with their Yanmar supplier on the West coast, who also can't explain Yanmars lack of customer concern, I also contacted the dealer who sold me the boat who helped me get the head shipped from Atlanta Ga. The last people in the chain and the only contact in the US is the distributor for Yanmar on the East coast. All of these companies and the people I have been able to speak with, have done what I assume to be their best effort. They all seem to agree with me and can't understand Yanmars lack of concern. I must say I cannot contact Yanmar direct as they have insulated themselves behind there distributors and I have found no way to contact them, thus leaving me in the position I am in. Of course this will be the last product I ever purchase with a Yanmar name. Ironically my 53' trawler has a 57 horsepower Yanmar "get home engine" in her. I hope I never have to depend on it after this episode. So when and if anyone has a problem they should know that the company, Yanmar is unreachable.
 
I would file separate complaints against each party with your State Attorney General Office or State Consumer Complaints Department and against the Dealer, Ranger,Yanmar, etc in the US state where they filed for incorporation. Most have web forms to complete and is better than email b/c they will issue a tracking number. I would also file with Better Business Bureau. As a side story, I filed a complaint against WINMAR Windows part of Jeld-Wen in Canada with the BBB in US and Canada and they contacted them and assisted in getting a new window and payment for installment. At the same, I googled email addresses for as many Jeld-Wen and Winmar corporate folks that I could find and emailed them the problems.
Document all actions and make printouts. Then if not resolved, there are a boatlaod of attorneys who specilized in this area.
Be sure to state the number of days of lost of use and your time. Itemized each item with date and time taken to complete.
This will be very helpful to the courts showing lost time of usage and which one(s) didnt compete their job. In theory, you can receive compensation from each one. I would insist on a replacement engine. I would consult with attorney as soon as possible. It is free and supplies additional documentation.

mc2w

BTW Yes FEDEX and DHL ship to and from Japan. Maybe others.
 
They might try to stop future support and warranty as part of the deal. That is a no go. They are liabile for the current and future warranty. Be sure to get it in writing. Basically you will have 2 separate warranties if and when the issue is resolved.
I would printout the CBrats postings and also save to your PC.
Select File, Save As...., Complete Web Page

BTW I got Jen Weld to issue a new 10 year warranty on thereplacment windows. 3 bad windows! They are supposed to be premium product.
 
Thanks Brent
I've been trying to hold off on this type of action but of course if nothing happens soon it will be my only avenue.Thanks
Dick von Roth
 
FGRVONROTH":1982p560 said:
Thanks Brent
I've been trying to hold off on this type of action but of course if nothing happens soon it will be my only avenue.Thanks
Dick von Roth
Click to expand...

I completly understand. I should have started the topics witha FYI and didnt mean to be preaching the law.

If it is a wide spread problems or issues, then maybe there is a class action suit you can sign after reading and understanding it.
 
wow Here is one class action suit.

http://www.yanmarsettlement.com/

On March 13, 2007, the Superior Court of Fulton County, Georgia gave preliminary approval to a class action settlement in litigation entitled AK El Oso, LLC et al. v. Yanmar Marine USA Corporation et al.,Civil Action No. 2005-CV-102150. If you are a current or former owner of one of the Yanmar engines involved in the class action, there may be benefits available to you under the settlement and your rights may be affected.

The Class consists of all persons or entities who as of March 15, 2007, are current or former owners of Yanmar 6LP or 6LPA series engines manufactured by Yanmar between September 1996 and February 1, 2002, specifically including those which a) have a model designation of 6LP-STE, 6LP-STZE, 6LPA-STE, 6LPA-STZE, 6LPA-STP or 6LPA-STZP and b) bear a serial number in the range of 50101-53988 or M50001-51195. Excluded from the class are (a) those persons who prior to the date of this Notice have resolved claims with Yanmar regarding an Engine, as defined in the Settlement Agreement, relating to a Covered Engine Failure, as defined in the Settlement Agreement, and (b) any judges, referees, or special masters presiding over any aspect of this litigation and their immediate family members.

If you are a class member, you should read the Notice of Class Action available on the Case Documents Tab. Other documents regarding the Settlement are also available on the Case Documents Tab.
 
If you are prepared and have enough documentation, then most folks are reasonable and you proceed directly to the fine art of the compromise. Sometimes folks need an extra jolt of coffee to get things moving to the next level. Or sometimes folks come into work being a knot head and someone reminds them that we are in the business for the long term and also reminds them who is the Customer.

Good luck! and nice boat!
 
Dick -

I'm crossing my fingers, but it looks like you may be in for a long haul on this. I assume your engine is more recent than those specified in the class-action suit, unless it has been sitting on the shelf for several years.

Isn't it interesting that, with all your contacts and discussions, no one seems to have mentioned the recent pending class action suit?! Like no one in the industry is aware of this . . . ????

I read through the class-action documents rather quickly, so I may have missed some of the details, However, except for the initial plaintiffs who received $25K each, it seems to me that the main benefit to class members is an extended warranty from Yanmar. With the exception of a 60-day response time for them to decide whether a claim is valid (thus giving them the opportunity to appeal to a 'Special Master', further delaying the process), there is little in the docs to indicate how quickly a plaintiff might expect repairs to be accomplished. And I didn't see any means to compensate the boat owner for down time. It was not a real confidence builder to read the judge saying that one of the benefits of the current settlement was to avoid the possibility of years of future litigation.

An extended warranty is a whole lot better than nothing. OTOH, what good is an extended warranty from a company that cannot manage (or chooses not) to stock common gasket sets in the U.S.???

Furthermore, Yanmar specifically denies any wrongdoing, or even any recognition or admission that there is now, or ever was, any problem with their valves. Assuming that your engine is more recent than those listed, and appears to have a similar problem, it sounds like Yanmar is still manufacturing engines with the same ongoing problems. For example, I didn't see anything in the docs to indicate that engine designs have been "improved". In fact, quite the opposite, since that would be an acknowledgment by Yanmar that a 'real' problem actually existed.

I wonder what this does for boat mfgs trying to extol the virtues of the Yanmar engine in their new boats? I know if I were considering a R-25 right now I'd certainly put the brakes on . . .

Good luck . . . we all feel for you. What a waste of a boating season! Please keep us posted.

iggy
 
Dick - you may already have this information but

Yanmar’s US Corporate office is in Illinois

Address:
Yanmar America Corporation
951 Corporate Grove Drive
Buffalo Grove, IL 60089-4508
Phone: (847) 541-1900
Fax: (847) 541-2161

The following web address is a complaint/help form to fill out.
http://www.yanmar.com/contact/marine.asp

________
Dave dlt.gif
 
Dick - if you call the corporate office in the US, insist that you talk to the top dog of the US division. If you are able to, you will have a good chance of getting a new engine.

________
Dave dlt.gif
 
The class action suit also gives the name and address of Yanmar's consul in this case for a contact point. It might well be worth your while to contact her. I really hate to see things like this escalated to a legal level. But there is also a reasonable expectation of the use of a product.

Just be glad you don't have a Luhrs 41/44. There are a bunch of folks who are trying to get their money (3/4 of a million each) back on these boats because of alleged design and construction flaws...
 
I spoke with John at Ranger tugs last night and he told me that he had been in touch with somebody who is"important" at Yanmar and they told him I would be in the water by this weekend. I called John this morning to get the name of the person who was calming this to be the case, John of course was most helpful and told me that his contact at Yanmar would call me back today. As the day went on John called me to see if had recieved a call from anyone from Yanmar and of course I had to tell him no. I think this happened 3 times and each time he said he would call him back to get him to call me. It is now 6 PM EST and still no call. I figured this would happen because I made it clear to John I wanted to know just how they planned to get me in the water by the weekend, and I can only assume it was just another stall tactic and they had no plan, and so far from their lack of response I figure I'm right. Just want to keep everybody reading my post up to date on what they can expect if they need service on their Yanmar product.NOTHING.
I would like to say once again everyone at Ranger has done everything to try to help and the people at Ranger are now seeing the lack of support their vendor delivers. I guess the clock is ticking before I bring my lawyer into the picture.
I'll post tomorrow to keep you all updated, and thanks for yout support!
Dick von Roth
 
Just want to keep everybody reading my post up to date on what they can expect if they need service on their Yanmar product.NOTHING.
Click to expand...

How disappointing! It sounds like Ranger is going the extra mile, for all the good that is going to do.

Can someone explain to me the advantages of a class action suit that provides plaintiffs with an 'extended warranty'. In the words of the immortal Archie Bunker, "Whoop-de-doo!" Now instead of a short warranty in which nothing gets fixed, I have a long warranty in which nothing gets fixed.

I hate to be too cynical here, but I have been included in several class action suits relevant to computer hardware and software, and a few other consumer products. A typical result is as follows:

1. The defendant has clearly been negligent, and multiple thousands of plaintiffs have been damaged. Let's say one million 'class members' are 'damaged' to the extent of $100 each. The defendant probably does not admit any fault, but they are on the hook for $100M to 'put this behind us'.

2. After jumping through a lot of hoops, class members may receive a voucher for $50 toward their next purchase, for example, on their next $1,500 computer. (Assuming they do not misplace the paperwork in the intervening year or two, or they don't need a new computer before the offer expires.)

3. The defendant company has just created a huge continuing market for themselves! If 20% of the plaintiffs take 'advantage' of this settlement, they have just sold 200,000 more computers! And they have decreased their profit from $500 per unit to $450 per unit. (Insert crocodile tears . . . )

4. A few principal class members may receive a significant settlement ($5,000?) as compensation for their efforts.

5. Plaintiffs lawyers receive compensation for legal fees and expenses, for hundreds of hours over several years, often in the neighborhood of $10M - $20M.

Whoop-de-doo! Now when I receive such notices I spend a few minutes skimming through the arcane legalistic multi-page descriptions, and then toss it in the round file. At best, I'm likely to make $5 per hour for the time it's going to take to jump through all the hoops.

(I particularly appreciate the offers related to 'faulty batteries sold between March 1 and December 31, 2004. If you purchased such batteries, you are entitled to compensation . . . . " Yeah, let me look up all my battery receipts from 2005! And we're not talking about deep cycle marine batteries here; we're talking about AA NiMH's. Give me a friggin' break.)

Pardon my cynicism, but of course, the lawyers still get their $10M . . .

I hope you're in the water and enjoying your boat this coming weekend. I'll hold my breath and hope I don't turn blue.

iggy
 
Phone Tag Strategy:

Perhaps you should suggest to Ranger the next time he is on the phone to his important contact at Yanmar that he sets up a conference call with you, RIGHT NOW. That will at least eliminate the 'He said he'd call you today' routine.

Also, I'd strongly recommend taping all phone conversations (Radio Shack), for 'quality control'. They do it all the time, so turn-about should be fair play. Be sure to tell them you are doing this, so you don't get your a-- in a sling later, or even lose the opportunity of admitting the tapes in a subsequent law suit.

iggy
 
Pardom my ignorance. I expect Ranger would have new engines in stock since they are building new boats. Why cant they RandR it at the factory? or new one to VT?
 
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