Intermittent Engine Starting Problem

C

cgypsy

New member
I have twin Honda motors on my boat. I never had any problems starting them until this week.

I ran both engines for about an hour and then stopped for gas. When I tried to start the motor, nothing happened - the starter did not make any noise. It was almost like it was not even connected but the other motor started fine.

Once we were running for a few minutes I was able to start the engine that wouldn't start.

The same thing happened the next time I stopped and tried to start it again.

At first I thought it was a battery issue, but I'm pretty sure it is not.

I had a mechanic come over and the engine started without a problem. He looked for a loose wire but couldn't find one. After he left I started the engine without a problem.

I haven't tested out my theory yet, but I'm wondering if this only happens when the engine is warm.

Does anyone have any ideas?
 
The loose wire theory sounds likely, but hasn't shown to be true, yet.

How about the key/ starting circuit? Is there a "click" from the solenoid on the starter when you turn they key? Can you check for power when the key is turned to see if there's power to the starting solenoid? Is there power at the key switch? Do your gauges for that motor go on when the key is turned to the first detent?

How about the emergency disconnect button and circuit? Have you tried to test out it? Wiggle the Red button and clip when trying to start the motor.

This ought to get you started. Do you have a digital volt/ohm/amp meter?

Joe. :teeth :thup
 
I had the same problem with my Honda 150s. The arm that pushes the neutral safety switch in sticks. Many times I had to use a screwdriver to push the button in while Merry started the motor. I finally disabled the neutral safety switch and solved the issue. I just have to make sure the motor is in neutral before starting it.
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Joe, thank you for all the questions.

When I turn the key, the guage on the dash does move so I know there is power getting to the ignition, but I don't really hear a click.

I did wiggle the wire around the kill switch when it first happened and that didn't seem to make a difference, although it is still a possibility, but doubtful.


Can you check for power when the key is turned to see if there's power to the starting solenoid?
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I don't have any idea how to do that. Where and what is the starting solenoid?

Thank you for your suggestions.
 
The arm that pushes the neutral safety switch in sticks.
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I hope it might be as simple as that. I hate intermittent problems, but I will see if that helps.

However, I am still open to other suggestions so I have more things to try. But, now I am more motivated to go out and test it out again.

Thank you os much for the suggestion.

It started doing this 2 days ago on my way home from Friday Harbour CBGT - yes, I know it took me 10 days to get home - but it would have taken longer if my engine wasn't acting up. Now, I have a reason to go back out on the water.
 
I have no idea what a charge coil is or does. Is it possible that a damaged charge coil could cause the motor to not start when it is warm?

I have twin Honda motors. A friend - without my permission - hooked both my batteries up in parallel for some reason that I don't understand. So basically I was running two motors charging only one battery while I was out cruising for two weeks.

I have been doing a lot of reading and apparently this is very bad and will damage the charge coil if you run both motors and only one battery.
 
This is our 17th season running the 1999 year twin Honda 40’s. During this period we’ve had two occasions where the charge coils went out on one motor. Both times it was caused by having to do repetitive rpm changes while both of our two batteries were combined with the simple selector switch choice of number 1, number two, combined or off. I was told by Les at EQ, Cornet Bay that combining the batteries like I did & then having excessive uneven rpm from the motors while adjusting the rpm up & down would burn out the coils. Loss of coil only caused the motor to not be able to charge the battery, so the motors could still be started until batteries lost charge. The first time this happened to me was in 2004 at the end of a cruise from Prince Rupert, BC to SE Alaska. On the return to Prince Rupert, while coming through Venn Passage, we met many fishing boats starting a season run. While making multiple throttle adjustments smoke started pouring out of the port motor & it quit charging. The 2nd time was coming off the Gulf of Alaska in in 2007 into Pelican in rough sea conditions & again was making multiple throttle adjustments. In the twelve years since then, I still at times combine the batteries, but very careful as to when, so no charge coil failures since 2007.

Gypsy, unless you were making excessive throttle adjustments during your resent cruise, I doubt the charge coils are damaged & even is they are as long as the battery has a sufficient charge the motor should still start.

Jay
 
Gypsy, unless you were making excessive throttle adjustments during your resent cruise, I doubt the charge coils are damaged & even is they are as long as the battery has a sufficient charge the motor should still start.

Jay
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Thank you for that explanation. It is one less thing for me to worry about, but none the less, I am going to get the battery situation fixed. I'm still not sure why they were joined.

Mechanical breakdowns and maintenance on the boat are still my biggest challenges. I don't know enough about it - I know I have to learn more - but I really don't want to.

I just want the boat (and everything else) to magically run without problems (and mechanics to be honest and available) - and a self washing boat would be great too :teeth :wink
 
I had my boat overhauled last year. I told the mechanic about the neutral safety switch arm sticking and he said he would fix it. After picking up the boat and filling the gas tanks, the starboard motor wouldn't start. I thought it must be something other than the neutral safety switch because it was just repaired. I ran on one motor for a few miles before stopping to check the switch again. It was stuck in the open position again. I pushed it in and the motor started right up.

When I got home I ordered a part on Ebay that solved the problem. I unscrewed the neutral safety switch, attached the aluminum part and bent it so the button stays depressed. I haven't had any problems since.

35618-ZV5-000-Plate-Neutral-Switch-Hon-Honda-1998.jpg


35600-ZV5-003-Switch-Assy-Neutral-1998-Honda-40-hp.jpg
 
So one other thing to look at. On our 225 Honda we had a mystery one time. They motor quite while we where on the way to Friday harbor. It would restart then die with in a few minutes or some times seconds. it would not start then it would. It was like the battery switch was being turned on and off. Well after a lot of trouble shooting I found the problem. In side the casing of the main power wire to the starter from the battery the copper wire it self had seperated. You could not see it just looking at the cable. I had to feel it in side the cable. If I tuned left the cable was pushed together and the motor started. If the motor was turned right it separated the wire inside the cable and I could not start. I would get it started and every time i turned right of center it would quite. Just some thing to check.
 
Thank you so much for the tips AND THE PICTURES. I really, really appreciate the suggestions and I feel far more confident to go back out on the water.

I will be going out in a couple of days to see how it works and if I a problem again I will know what to look for.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.
 
Before I added the little aluminum piece to push the button in, I would use a flat head screwdriver and flashlight to see the button and push it. You can feel it lock into place when you push it and the motor will then start. It got to the point that I was having to do that every time I went out.
 
I just think of myself having a very expensive tow bill because I didn't know that I just had to push a button to start the engine.
 
The first time that happened to me I had to call Vessel Assist to tow us back in. I called the mechanic and when he came to the boat, both motors started right up. It wasn't until the next time it happened that I noticed the swing arm was not touching the neutral safety switch. It happened dozens of more times before I finally figured out how to fix it. Finding switches on Ebay that included the aluminum part was the answer. Once I bent them in to hold the button in place the problems stopped.
 
I called the mechanic and when he came to the boat, both motors started right up.
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That is exactly what happened to me.

However, the joy of having twin motors is that I just came home slower than I would have chosen. But, I did come home even though I wanted to stay out longer.
 
We actually had two problems at the same time. We were only a couple hundred feet outside the marina when the port motor stopped. We didn't know it at the time, but the fuel line was being pinched. When I tried to start the starboard motor I had the same symptoms you described. After waiting an hour for Vessel Assist and then being towed back to our slip, both motors started right up. The mechanic found the crimped fuel line but by then, the swing arm had gone back into place against the switch.
 
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