cd-19 questions

[GDeiss]

After reading as much as I can find in print or on the web I've come to the conclusion that a C-Dory is what I'd like to buy. I've also (more or less) concluded that the cd-19 is the best choice for me. I need to seat four people, and the cd-16 is just too small to do that, and the cd-22, while big enough, doesn't seem to be able to do it nicely. I also can't justify the extra $$ for a cd-22, and don't think I'd need the bulkhead and galley.

Unfortunately, there's not much out there about the cd-19; not too many people seem to own them, or if they do, they don't write about them. Even C-Dory's own literature is either confusing or downright in error about it's features. The brochure that EQ Marine sent me allows that it has a full dash, but elsewhere says that people can sit on the edge of the v-berth, ala the cd-16. This only seems possible if the dash is not full. It also says that the deck extends about 5' from the back of the seats to the motor well, and then a few paragraphs later list 4'6" for the same space. The picture on the front shows seats that don't seem to be the swiveling pedestal ones mentioned on the back. Finally, the outlines shown of the boat (top and side) are definetely for the cd-22, not the cd-19. There are other inconsistencies, but you get the idea.

It's apparent after reading all C-Dory literature that the cd-19 brochure is a hodge-podge of data from the cd-16 and cd-22 by someone who was not terribly discriminating about what to include or modify. Hopefully the boat is better constructed than the brochure that describes it!

That said, is the cd-19 a good boat for four people to spend comfortable time in? I know they're relatively new in the C-Dory lineup, so finding one used is not a likely proposition. This makes a used cd-22 attractive, but then I'm back to seating four comfortably.

Finally, my wife insists that I ask the following question. Can a C-Dory be rigged to pull a person around on an innertube or whatever those zip-around-the lake floaty devices are called?

Thanks ,

Greg

[Rock-C]

Hi Greg
Welcome to the pub. All C-Dorys are well built boats. The 19 seems to be a fairly new model. Not a lot of them out there yet. There have been postings here about handling problems that have been easily resolved with the addition of trim tabs. I'm sure Bill of Da Nag will join in soon as he recently upgraded from a 19' to a 22'. I recommend you take a good look at the 22' cruiser. Not only do they have more room and an enclosed cabin, there are a lot more available on the used boat market. We have a 90 hp Honda on our 22' cruiser and have pulled people on tubes and wake boards. We love our boat and look forward to meeting other C-Dory owners at some of the gatherings. Good luck on your boat search

[Chuck S]

Greg --

The 19 Angler is still a low production boat and you can get whatever seating you want, provided you order it from the factory. The seats + pads is one version, seats + seats is the other. I like the all seat version.

There's a full dash on all of these that I'm aware of, only the 16 Cruiser has the 1/4 dash. We can seat 3 in ours and 4 in a pinch, but the extra 3' on the 19 is well used.

We can pull a "Tube" easily with the 16 Cruiser, so there'll be no problem with the 19 assuming you don't put a 25 HP motor on it .

-- Chuck

[Sea Wolf]

GDeiss-

You're very smart to look carefully before jumping into this new CD-19 model. When I first saw one, I couldn't figure out why anyone would give up the solid rear bulkhead's protection, the galley, the dinette, and the extra three feet of precious space that we who have CD-22's find so useful.

The original design of the 19 was, I believe, prompted by the need to provide an open fishing boat with easy access in and out of a partially covered forward seating area for 3-4 adults. C-Dory had been making a shortened cabin version of the 22 called the Angler, but cabin seating in that one was again limited to about three people by the short cabin length.
They dropped production of the Angler several years back, then brought the 19 out as a replacement.

One problem encountered in the 19 that was not anticipated, was that the shorted hull was unstable at planing speeds, porpoising such that owners were forced to add trim tabs to hold the bow down for a stable ride. All the new 19's now come equipped with trim tabs from the factory.

I think they're still unsettled themselves at the factory about how they want to fit the 19 into the product line and how best todesign the boat to do it, so the promotional literature is sketchy, contradictory, and incomplete.

Before you buy the 19, be sure you are willing to deal with not having the galley and dinette. If you and your wife want to cruise, cook in, and stay over night in the boat, buy a 22 Cruiser.

You can special order a CD-22 Cruiser with internal conversions which add seats at the expense of giving up either the dinette or galley. My guess is that these are mostly bought by charter fishermen and set up for fishing up to four adults. You still have to buy and pay for a new boat, price-wise.

A much less expensive way to accomplish the above would be to buy a used 22 Cruiser and change the seating arrangment around inside to acomodate all four adults. For balance purposes, however, you have to have 2 on each side of the boat, more or less, so things get a little complicated since you can't simply take out the dinette (leaving in the galley intact), and seat three on the dinette side on an enlarged bench seat.

Much easier yet would be to leave the used Cruiser's layout alone and add a fourth portable or fold-down seat in the aisle. Take out the refrigerator, add shelves underneath in the space under the helmsman's seat, and add a hinged seat bedside the helm seat that swings up from where the refrigerator's door was, with a two part folding and locking support strut coming from the starboard edge of the isle up to the outside (port) side of the folding chair. Add a hinged back to this chair, and you're home free. My boat's up at the lake, so I can't be sure this would work without getting some dimensions to verify the space availability, but it would be a lot simpler than some of the alternatives. Even a fourth seat can be created from a properly selected folding chair model that would simplify things even further, and the fourth person't placement could be anywhere along the aisle, making them the "moving ballast" or "trim" crew member. Of course, setting outside is often possible when the weather is cooperative.


Enough of my speculating! Bill Geiss (sp?), or Bill Da Nag, our Head Neard, in charger of website operations, bought one of the first 19's and can better describe the exact pros and cons of the 19, and why he and his wife, Dana, are now switching over to the CD-22 Cruiser. I'm still trying to figure out how to put our 38 foot motorhome on a barge platform and tow it with my CD-22 Cruiser, so as to have all the (feminine) comforts of home "aboard" for my wife!!!

Hope this helps! Joe.

Welcome to C-Dory World! Joe.

[Les Lampman]

Hi Greg,

The CD19 is not a 4-person boat; any more than an extended cab pickup is a 4-person vehicle (with buckets forward). That doesn't mean you can't get four folks in there but it's really a 2+2 design. If you choose to have four full seats you will find that the forward seats must be pushed forward on their tracks (which makes the helm position really tight unless you're very small) and the aft seat all the way back to keep the person in the forward seat and the one in the aft seat from having their heads collide. And, when the rear seats are all the way aft there is very little cockpit space (a couple of feet to the motorwell).

A boat under 20' long is required by law to have full level and upright floatation; this affects the CD19 in a way that it does not the CD22. Even though the hulls share the same parentage in order to get full floatation in the 19 a fair amount of space must be allocated for the foam since there isn't anywhere for it to go in the floor (as on a lot of boats). That means the side decks alongside the cockpit are quite a bit wider than on the CD22 and this further reduces the space available in the cockpit.

The loss of three feet out of the center of the boat (as compared to the CD22) also affects the balance of the boat since from the helm seat forward the layout is the same. This moves the balance point of the boat quite a bit further aft then on the CD22; the CD19 does not tolerate a lot of weight in the stern very well (I recommend going with a Suzuki or Johnson 70hp 4-stroke to keep the weight down, especially if you're adding a kicker). A couple of extra folks in the rear seat amplifies the aft balance situation.

The CD19 functions well as a compact 2-person boat with a nice size v-berth (on which it is almost impossible to sit, I don't know where that came from) with room to accommodate 2 extra folks on an occassional basis. With four aboard there is no "moving around" room so everyone needs to stay in their seat if someone needs to get somewhere else in the boat.

This is not to imply the boat is not nice; I'd be telling you the same thing if you needed to carry four adults and were looking at a sports car with a tiny rear seat (the traditional 2+2).

I think you'd be much happier (room-wise) with a CD22 Sport Cruiser or a CD22 Cruiser with alternate seating (the factory offers several layouts).

[Pat Anderson]

I was going to mention the 22' sport cruiser option if seating four is your first priority, I see Les beat me to it. It all depends on what you want to do. The stock 22' cruiser with dinette and galley pretty much seats only three, but for cruising the standard 22's hard rear bulkhead, galley with Wallas, and dinette (especially with Barber Chair of one design or another) is really the cat's meow. You give up a LOT to get that fourth person seated...We have a folding stool for the occasional fourth person, but it is not really satisfactory, too much of a pain to use it and it takes up too much room the rest of the time.

[Da Nag]

Hi Greg, welcome to the site!

I was somewhat of a science experiment; I got the first 19 Angler, and spent a lot of time with C-Dory and my local dealer working out the kinks.

The bad news - there were quite a few of them.

The good news - C-Dory customer service got a great workout (they passed with flying colors) and everything worked out fine in the end. From what I can see, the problems I encountered have been addressed by C-Dory, and if your heart is set on one and you've done your research, I think you'll love it.

Speaking of research, over the last couple of years I've written quite a bit about my 19 - here are a few places to check things out:

- Click the Search link in these forums - just enter "19", and you'll get lot's of posts.

- A bunch of pics and rigging options at my personal site. Link is here.

- I posted quite a bit at the old C-Dog site, and a few at the new C-Dog site. If you search there, enter "Da_Nag" in the search engines, and you'll see my posts.

Now..."my humble opinion" time. Treat it as such...

At this point in time, I don't think it's the "right boat" for most people. Primarily, because I believe the 22 is superior in most ways, and there are so many nice used 22's available cheaper than you can get a new 19. Once 19's start showing up in numbers on the used market, then cost might be more of a factor in choosing between the two. If you are only looking at new boats, than cost is certainly a consideration.

Without a doubt, the 22 is a better riding vessel. Even though I eventually got my 19 balanced and trimmed, it gets up on plane at a higher speed than the 22; low speed handling is much better on the 22.

The open back and quick access to your fishing equipment makes for a nice vessel to fish from. However, if fishing were my primary concern, I think I'd opt for an older and cheaper 22 Angler; having fished on one a few times, that massive cockpit is really nice.

The enclosed cabin of the 22's (except the Sport Cruiser) is a big plus. It's nice to be able to have a conversation with your guests while underway, without raising your voice. Also a big advantage in colder weather, somewhat of a disadvantage when things get hot.

And finally, I'll echo what others said earlier; the 19 is NOT a four person boat. Two is perfect, three is a crowd, no matter what interior arrangement you get. If carrying four folks is a major consideration (and you don't mind giving up many of the amenities of the 22 Cruiser), the Sport Cruiser can comfortably seat four.

Good luck on your decision, and feel free to post back with more questions.

[GDeiss]

Thanks to all for your replies. No matter how I look at things I keep coming back to the cd-22. One of these days I'll actually have to see one! We hope to make the Lake Roosevelt weekend, so should get something close to an overdose then!

Greg