Wallas or not?

drjohn71a · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:42 pm Post subject: Wallas or not?

The new C-Rangers have a heat pump, a/c option which I am considering. Having heard all the positive feedback from NW C-Brats about the Wallas, I initially thought I would order that too. Someone recently mentioned that the Wallas had problems if it was not used much. Since most of our season is hot, and the Ranger has engine heat plus the heat pump, I amwondering if installing a Wallas is worth the trouble of maintenance that might be needed since it may not be used much.

So, Do you have to clean out a Wallas if you only use it a time or two a year? Or, Can the Wallas heater be relied upon to work when you need it if it is rarely used?

Any info would be appreciated. John

Da Nag · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 1:01 pm Post subject: Re: Wallas or not?

drjohn71a · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 1:35 pm Post subject:

Thanks, Bill. There is a 2.5 KW generator which would have to run to operate the heat pump. That would only work while in the water. I am also worried about the zebra mussels getting into the water lines on the built in generator and heat pump. I had thought the Wallas to be the best overnite option, but someone posted that, if you do not use it much, it clogs.... so that is why I am second guessing that. I thought the Wallas would be nice when working on the boat on the trailer in the winter also. John

colobear · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 2:04 pm Post subject:

For what it's worth: I picked up my 22" a few months ago. It is equipped with a Webasto diesel heater and a Kenyon Butane stove. I am extremely pleased with both. I have thermostatically controlled ducted air heat and very low fuel consumption. The stove is only a single burner so on your larger boat you may want to go with a two burner setup . I had been planning on a Wallas but saw many "oops my Wallas..." postings on C-Brats so was happy when Les suggested a Webasto. Many Wallas owners have come to look at the setup at CBGT's and I think several are considering a change away from the Wallas.

drjohn71a · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 2:24 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the info, colobear. I am not sure what model of heatpump, A/C unit they are installing. I checked the Webasto site and they seem to make a wide variety. I guess you would use the 12V fan system to circulate the heat. I will keep my eyes open for their units. John

Byrdman · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 2:47 pm Post subject:

Thanks for this thread. I had the wallas on my TC24...and, it was a love/hate relationship. Had to have high clean power from batteries. Enjoyed the Klean Heat much...I mean much....did I say much more than the diesel...for ALL operations. Had issue with the "slip nut" deal on the shaft screwing up the air flow/exhaust (more than likely slipped down when on the interstate system during hauling)....and lost a LOT of the efficiency of being able to run on low setting overnight. Never saw an issue for allowing it to sit long periods...but then... the longest period may have been 4 weeks....and....I used it just about 100% of the time on each trip for something....generally a nice omelt for breakfast...or grilling something for dinners.... which could be handled by the other systems mentioned..... that might not be as "finiky" .... And...I did not like the cool down time it took for the wallas to shut all the way down and stop putting off heat... In the summer that was way more of an issue.

$2500 will puts it for sure in the "let's look around a bit" category, particuarly if it is not already on the boat.

I kinda liked the set up Joel has on SEA3PO (star wars thing)... and wish I had made the gathering to see the other set up.

SO... having said all of that...and not researched the other system talked about here... it is a definate maybe.

Looking foward to hearing/seeing other input.

thataway · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 3:31 pm Post subject:

We had the C Dory22 for 3 or 4 seasons. Each time we would fire it up and it came on perfectly--Used for about 2 weeks a year and no problems between. We used "Liquid candle wax"--a highly refined kerosene as I under stand it.

drjohn71a · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 3:56 pm Post subject:

thanks, Bob. Apparently using the more refined fuel is the answer. I also remember someone thinking that the refined fuel did not have enough 'lubricating' action, but 3-4 years without a significant problem is pretty darned good in my book! John

Grumpy · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 4:05 pm Post subject:

We have the Wallas on Kingfisher and have had nothing but trouble with it since delivery last Oct.
We obeyed ALL the finicky instructions about how to turn it on/off, used only brand new "dairy fresh" diesel as recommended by Scan Marine and still the damned thing howls like a banshee about 2 minutes after start-up.

After long discussions with Karl at Scan Marine I took it out and brought it to him. After about 2 weeks and paying for shipment, I get it back with the claim that nothing is wrong with it.

Well, it still howls, but now it has a new trick. It drips diesel and fills the cabin with a white mist which is most definitely a health and safety hazard. When I took the boat to EQ for the 20 Hr engine check I had them try it with the same results.

I have looked into it far enough to see that it is the little black impeller which is making the howling noise (which stops after about 3 minutes) and I have removed the bottom plate just enough to verify that everything is covered in a fine mist of diesel under what I assume is the burner unit. I am not going to take it apart anymore as it is still a warranty claim but this week it is going back in a box to Scan Marine and if it does not get fixed this time I will take further action with them.

In the meantime I feel obligated to ensure that everyone here knows about what can be a clear health and safety issue with this unit.

We did look at Barry (C-Cakes) system while in Bellingham and would put it in in one minute if it wasn't for thowing another $2K down the tubes on top of having just paid for a "Wallas that won't".

I am hoping that I will be pleasantly surprised but it will be a long while before I try to get cosy in an enclosed cabin with this particular Scandinavian product.

Merv in a really Grumpy mood.

katkt · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 4:43 pm Post subject:

Da Nag · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:40 pm Post subject:

drjohn71a · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:04 pm Post subject:

Here in Kansas there is alot of Klean Heat available in the winter, but hard to find in the summer. Apparently shelf life is not a problem, so some winter stocking up might be in order. John

Pat Anderson · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:47 pm Post subject:

NOT. If after our sea trial we get the C-Ranger 25, and I surely hope we do, it will have a Webasto like C-Cakes and probably a butane stove. The Wallas on our CD22 crapped out in 2003, and C-Dory & Scan Marine did replace it. But there are too many stories of the Wallas failing, most recently Bill and El's on Halcyon while they were in Alaska, but we have heard several other stories, including Merv (Grumpy) at Bellingham. They are great when they work, but they are just too darn complicated. We live in fear of snagging a wire or damaging a circuit board with our under-galley shelves because the underside of the Wallas is totally unprotected. They are very sensitive to voltage on start-up. Evidently the new design does not have a flat lid, so you can't put your pot or tea kettle on it when the lid is closed. Now, if Merv's complaint is accurate, and I see no reason to doubt it, you could have a very hard time getting Scan Marine to stand behind their product the way we have come to expect C-Dory to. The Webasto plus butane stove combo suffers none of these problems - seems like a no-brainer to me.

sportner · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:03 pm Post subject:

Well.....O.K., what model webasto and butane? And why butane and not a propane stove? And will the Webasto act as a water heater too? I've never owned a boat with either and also have an R25 on order.

Pat Anderson · Posted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:13 pm Post subject:

Don't know the particular model of the Webasto, Barry on C-Cakes can fill that in, but it is really the cat's meow. Might be a propane stove would be OK, or even better from an economy standpoint, but the little butane cylinders are sure convenient. I don't think the Webasto is a water heater - and the electric water heater on our CD25 is great but you only have hot water when you have shore power or run the generator (takes 30 - 40 minutes to heat the water), so a propane hot water heater would seem to have it all over the electric heater. In fact, on the Alaska trip, we just heated a kettle of water for dishes, was plenty of water, easier and faster.