Anchor Deck Pipe or Windless?

TyBoo · Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 9:52 pm Post subject:

Gentlemen -

If you only need the added pressure when the tang is pushed out by the bulky splice, perhaps something as simple as a rubber bumper attached to the deck will work. If it is against the finger with minimal pressure all the time, it would exert resistive force as the splice pushes the finger out. Much the same as a guy's shoe.

To avoid the extra hole in the deck, you might even be able to attach the bumper to a strip of SS sheet metal slipped between the windlass head and the deck with a hole that one of the mounting studs would go through.

If you really wanted to get fancy, you could mount the bumper on an eccentric stud so the starting contact pressure could be adjusted.

I love this discussion. It drives me crazy that I don't have one of those things to run out and look at!

Sea Wolf · Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:03 pm Post subject:

Mike- Thanks for the great ideas! No wonder you're considred such a genius at improvising such simple, straightforward solutions to mechanical problems! We'll take these into consideration and give 'em some real thought! Thanks!! Joe.

Mighty Bite · Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 12:55 am Post subject:

Mike,

There is definitely no shortage of good ideas in that fertile gray matter in your attic. Good thoughts on the Quick windlass.

Has anyone used 7/16" rope on the Quick 500 and if so what were the results. I tried the 3/8" just because I had it available and thats a non-starter. The 1/2" is fine but the
7/16, if it worked seamlessly, would let me add some length to the rode. Always looking for the edge.

Depending on who I talked to at Marisafe, I've gotten, " 1/2" only, and 7/16" is perfectly ok. hmmmmm. I'm hesitant to spring for the 7/16" without some first hand knowledge of the results.

Alyssa Jean · Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 8:43 am Post subject:

My next purchase this winter for the Anna Leigh is a windlass. The money is in the bank. I now have 300 feet of 7/16 rode and 24 feet of 1/4 chain. What windlass choices do I have for sucessful use of the 7/16? Don't really want to start over with 1/2.

MOOSE · Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 10:22 am Post subject:

Mike, you are absolutely on the right track. All that is needed (I think) is a little extra pressure on the splice. The trick is to rig something up to avoid another hole in the deck. That's why I have considered a strip of spring steel bolted to the windlass housing at one end and lying parallel to the finger which then would apply additional pressure only when needed.

For those contemplating a windlass purchase, however, I do not want to give anyone the impression that this is not a fine piece of equipment. I recommend the Aires highly. This is just a little bug that needs to be worked out, and I'm sure that it is within our collective capabilities to do so.
Al

TyBoo · Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 7:37 pm Post subject:

Al -

I didn't see your previous post, I guess - or it didn't click. Your spring steel idea sounds great. It would hardly be noticed, and should do the trick. There you got it!

I tend to agree with you on the warranty voiding aspect, too. If an little extra spring tension against the line will wear the thing out, it's not long for the world, anyway, and I scarcely think a manufacturer would have a problem with it.

Ain't boats fun?

Sea Wolf · Posted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 11:59 pm Post subject:

Al and Mike-

While I'm going to wait awhile myself to see if my new, more supple polyester rope to chain splice passes naturally through the unmodified or assisted windlass workings, I also am thinking the spring steel additional finger is the simplest and most obvious solution if additional mechanical help is needed.

The stainless spring will have the following advantages:

1. It's simple and easy to build. No complex parts to fabricate, maintain, or operate. We all can build one without a machine shop, etc.

2. The shape can be changed by bending as needed.

3. The tension can be adjusted, also by bending.

4. Tension can also be applied (if necessary) along a larger area of the curve.

5. The shape will conform to the windlass shape and the addition will be largely hidden.

6. The spring need not push excessively on the existing finger all the time, saving wear and tear on it and extending it's life.

7. The spring can be mounted along side of the windlass, without drilling holes in it's base. Mike's right, it could be slip mounted under the edge of the base, but there's a gasket seal there that, I , personally don't want to compromise for the sake of preventing water intrusion.

What I'd prefer to do is to mount in along side and somewhat to the front of the finger so that it could push on the finger when it's displaced by the larger splice and then also continue around the windlass to help the splice further mesh with the teeth of the gypsy.

I'd make the device in two parts, a 90 degree based bracket to mount through the deck on the bottom, with the spring mounted to the vertical portion. This would allow the base to be made of any of a number of standard grades of stainless, while the replaceable spring would have to be made of a suitable stainless spring alloy. Acorn nuts on the inside of the spring mounting would prevent snags. The through deck machine screws could be #14's and the spring screws # 12's, as a guess.
Round off and finish all bracket and spring corners, and bend the front (leading edge) of the spring back (open) to prevent snagging.

This sounds like a lot of fun! Working on it is one of the best parts of owning a boat, at least for some of us. Now I'm going to have to go out and start rounding up the parts and playing with the fabrication, even though I 'll hold off on installing it until I'm sure it's needed on my boat.

Thanks for all your help in thing this through! Merry Christmas All!

MOOSE · Posted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 2:53 pm Post subject:

Mike,
Since I work in a paper mill also, where would I be most likely to find a small strip of stainless spring steel? I looked in McMaster-Carr and they have it; I just don't need 193'.
TX and Merry Christmas
Al

TyBoo · Posted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 2:56 pm Post subject:

TyBoo · Posted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 3:12 pm Post subject:

MOOSE · Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 3:17 pm Post subject:

doctor blades - perfeck!

Mighty Bite · Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:28 am Post subject:

I put an Aires Quick 500 vertical windlass on my CD this past summer and Sea Wolf is right, it is a nice piece of gear.

I also took note of the specifications on Marisafe's web site and was aware that it clearly listed as recommended rope diameter: 3/8"-1/2" (10-12mm). I was using 600' of 3/8" rode and and pulling it with a buoy and ring setup. The 3/8" is totally unaceptable fodder for this windlass. I talked with Marisafe today and at 3:25pm they removed their rope spec from the spec sheet and replaced it with 1/2"....period. So unequivocally the rope size is now set in stone for this windlass.

As Sea Wolf mentioned, they are recommending the polyester rope instead of the nylon. They also use a tapered back splice for the rope to chain union which they say will absolutely work with no problems. I assume this is what you got on yours Joe, and hope it is the long term fix.

I intend to enlarge the locker space a little by moving the bulkhead aft a few inches to allow a little more rode.
If I can squeeze in 300 to 400 feet I'll settle for that.

Sea Wolf · Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2004 1:05 pm Post subject:

Mark- Glad to hear you've gotten Marisafe to clean up the confusion on the rope size issue. Sounds like we've got a handle on this issue and the correct fix! My new polyester rode and tapered splice seems to work fine, but I've only been able to use it a few times due to weather considerations and the holiday season, so will have to wait and see how the tests of time and wear-in work out. The splice does seem more supple and is softening up even more with use, so we seem to be going in the right direction.

Here's an idea for you to consider: You could take out an "insurance policy" now against having to install a locker drain later when it would be more difficult. If you cut the old bulkhead out to enlarge the rode locker, it would be a GREAT TIME to install a drain (as opposed to working down at the bottom of a hole later!). Because of the "double wall" nature of this area, the problems of sealing up the passageway would be much easier with the rear locker wall removed. I'd use the Perko fuel vent Mike did on the Tyboo I, which can be sealed with gaskets and sealant at both ends against the walls. He removed the internal screen for better drainage and also to prevent blockage by small particles from the rode. I'd install it, then plug it with a rubber stopper and leave it plugged until usage (water retention and/or condensation problems in the cabin) indicated it needed to be opened. Limited use and warm weather down here in California allow me to not need a drain, but you operate in a much cooler area up in Fairbanks than I do. Just a suggestion to consider. Hope this is helpful and doesn't burden you with undue complications. Great hearing from you! Stay warm in the -20- to -30 degree weather up there! Joe

Mighty Bite · Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2004 6:16 pm Post subject:

Hi Sea Wolf,

Yep, we've got the rode size resolved. Marisafe seemed pretty confident that their recommended rode would work without any hitches (no pun intended). I'm under the impression that they performed the marriage ceremony
(ie: rope to chain w/tapered splice) for you?

Good thought on the rode locker drain, but I already installed the "Tyboo Custom Fuel Vent Drain" in the rode locker, sans screen, and it looks like it belongs there.

-32 below yesterday and I won't be in the water until probably May so I have a little time to work with on getting my rode made up.

Thanks,

Sea Wolf · Posted: Wed Jan 07, 2004 6:39 pm Post subject:

MARK- Yes, Steve Paley at Marisafe arranged to have 200' of new polyester rode taper-spliced to my 15' of 1/4" chain for about $100, including return shipping. The 200' + 15' just about fill the locker up level. If you have the 300' or 400' of rope, you have to stuff it up there and figure out how much to move the wall back. Let me know how it works out! Good Luck!! Joe.