New 25 Owners - Single Engine?

[Jeff and Julie]

Did all three that purchased new 25's at the show go from twin engines on their 22's to single on their 25's? Just curious as to what was the deciding factor for this or maybe it is not common to have twins on a 25'?
Thanks!
Jeff and Julie

[john schuler]

I ordered a 25 cruiser at the show, also with a single 135. I have a
lot of time before it will be built. I would be interested in seeing what
other more experienced C-Dory owners are putting on there boats.

I do plan on a kicker at some time. Do any of you think that should
be sooner than later?

[Pat Anderson]

Yes, all three went from twin 40s on their 22s to a single 135 on the 25s. I can't answer for the others - but Les recommended the 135 as well matched to the 25. I believe the 135 is lighter than two 90s and has better fuel economy. Once when we broke all four blades off a Propulse composite propeller on our 22, we had to go a few miles on a single 40 - it barely did better than a kicker would have, loaded as we were it would not plane the boat. Never really used the "turn on a dime" trick (one engine in forward, the other in reverse, helm straight ahead) in a real situation. So we never realized the potential advantages of twins. Just thought we'd try the single this time - we have towing insurance for that very rare but possible situation of a break-down. Hope we never have to use it...

[Byrdman]

Out of State Purchases: Something I learned when I bought my TomCat with twin 90s... In Alabama, you pay sales tax at time of registration when getting vessel documentation numbers/stickers. You pay sales tax on the "motor on the vessel" at purchase time.. So, If I had a receipt for the vessel and one of the motors, and a second receipt for the second motor, I could have saved paying taxes of 3.5% on the second motor.. Every little bit helps... especially if you are buying a CD25 for a "pocket Trawler" that is trailerable with a 15hp kicker on it for that trawler mode of cruising.. and that 2nd motor (135/150) on a seperate invoice..

[My IRA]

The 135hp main and 15 auxiliary combination has been a sweet setup for our boat. Our target cruise speed is 20mph which the engine easily attains with plenty of power in reserve for the less desirable ocean conditions. Top speed is about 30 and average fuel economy with the Propulse prop is between 3.0 and 4.0 mpg.

[Jeff and Julie]

Thanks for the replies! More info now for when we do get to buy!!

[TyBoo]

[john schuler]

That sounds like the right answer Mike.

I will not be taking delivery tell about the end of July.
I have other things pressing this spring and early summer.
Because I'm a new boater I wanted to take a few weeks
learning and what not over in the Seattle area and mabey a
C-Dory get together or two before I bring her back to Montana.

Any advice would be helpful
l
and new
Also what is the difference between a 25 cruiser and a 25 cruise ship?


john schuler

[stevej]

Been doing a lot of thinking about repowering Shearwater this year and was wondering what the new guys on the block (new to the 25' at least) were going to do. Looks like the 135 Honda winner.
I am currently running a 115hp Yamaha 2-stroke and can cruise around 18 mph at 4000 rpm with full load of fuel, water two people and all of the misc stuff like spares, tools, fishing equipment, 15hp four stroke kicker, anchor an on and on. Top end is 27mph at 4700 rpm. As a guess I would think total weight is close to 5700 - 6000 lbs.
Basically the motor spends it's life at 80% of full throttle, conditions permitting. Things were fine on the river but on the ocean I feel a bit under powered and there are times that it would be nice to get from point A to B a little quicker, again conditions permitting. Beating the crud out the boat and crew is no fun.
One advantage of the 115 hp is it only weighs 388 lbs
Don't want the complexity or weight of twins and would like to have the option of running the motor at less than 80% of full throttle with a cruise of 22 mph or so.

The short list today would be
150 hp four stroke 475 lbs
175 hp or 200 hp Yamaha HPDI 2-stroke 475 lbs
Have not completely ruled out 200 hp four strokes but at almost 600 lbs they are quickly falling off the list.
Then there is the Honda VS Yamaha thing on the 150 four stroke
As far as reliability goes it's a coin toss
Yamaha has an edge due to better gauges a $2500 price difference and they come with controls and multi-function tach
Honda has 4.5% interest and 2 year extended warranty right now to offset the price difference
Yamaha has 3 year extended warranty on the HPDI
Decisions, decisions

When I show up at Catlamastan it might be with a new motor
stevej

[starcrafttom]

if you want light weight,less fuel, clean, power, and littel worry , I would look at the e-tecs. they now have a salt water edtion 225.

[TyBoo]

[Larry H]

Hi all,

In two of the above posts the authors wanted more horsepower to deal
with adverse sea conditions.

In my experience, the wave highth, spacing, and the number of wave trains intersecting is what controls speed in the ocean. When the seas build up, a C-Dory must slow down to operate safely. These boats cannot go "over the top" of a wave train like a deep-v hull.

I recall 'Sealife' Mike saying that he seldom is able to use full throttle in the Pacific Ocean off Ventura County in So Cal. He has a 22 angler with twin 40 Suzukis.

My own experience is that the only places I can run wide open is on smooth lakes and on smooth water in the Inside Passage.

[Chris]

Stevej...Have you tried proping your motor to let it turn up a little higher? If I remember correctly...you are on the low end of the top rpm range for that motor. Might help your performance.

[stevej]

Larry on a normal trip out halibut fishing to the chicken ranch (34 miles) I will only average about 14 mph. The average speed is limited by ocean conditions and hull design not hp like you said.
When I talk about being underpowered it relates more to a feeling of control, the ability to climb a swell and keep pace with it and what is left in reserve if more is needed.
There are days when conditions will allow me to run 18 to 20 mph (hp limited) and days when I’m lucky to average 10 mph (conditions limited)
From what I have experienced I think the 25’ is a bit more prone to pounding in rough conditions than the 22’ because of the added length and beam. Been passed by 22’ C-Dorys on a number of occasions and they do not look to be pushing the boats any harder than I am.
There are several reasons for wanting more hp
Speed is one component. Fishing off the Oregon coast is not like cruising the San Juan’s. There is always something to see but it’s no sight seeing trip. Given good conditions more speed means more time to fish or less time required to transport back and forth.
More hp means I can ride swells for longer periods of time and have increased control crossing the bar.
Less wear and tear on the motor is another factor. A larger motor requires fewer rpm to move the boat at any given speed than a smaller motor. Fewer rpm equals less wear and extended motor life.
Equal or better economy/mpg. Look at a fuel usage graph of a four stroke or hi-tech two stroke and you will see that a 200 hp motor running at 60% of max rpm will use about the same gph as a 150 hp motor running at 80% of max rpm. The new motors have a very good scale of economy and become more efficient as rpm drops.
Last but not least there is no such thing as too much power (within reasonable boundaries) in my mind. You can always throttle back to go slower but it’s very expensive to gain hp after the initial purchase has been made.

Chris you are correct that I am a bit over pitched and could drop an inch to get closer to the max rpm. Something I was going to mess with on the river this winter but have not had the chance yet.

stevej

[Sea Angel]

Stevej,
Nice comparison of options. I have a CD25 with twin 90 HONDAs. These babies place abt 800#s on the stern, plus- the SS props.

The weight is spread out, but still there. The CD will jump when those 4 blade props grab. Here on the lower Ches. Bay, we too have some challenging WX.

After all this it pains me have a second thought abt twins. My main reason is and has been safety for cruising and towing. I have run the HONDA 135/150s and they have by far the smoothest transmission of anything I have experienced. They are almost like an automatic.. so smooth from FWD to REV. The 150 would otherwise be my choice.

Just a slow note from the right coast .

73s