CO Detector

[Bill.Secure]

I've disconnected my CO detector for the moment and am attempting to contact technical support at Fireboy, the vendor. It was manifesting a fault condition that would not go away. It was also quite warm to touch on the outside of the case and some of the internal components were actually hot to touch. The plastic on top of the case was somewhat brown from the heat.

It draws 200ma/400ma for non-alarm/alarm conditions. I was quite surprised at the current draw, the heat and that it was connected to the main cabin bus without being fused. Strikes me as very wrong but maybe CO detectors are wired differently.

This model has been discontinued and the replacement model draws very much less current. I'm very reluctant to install the same model again.


Bill
Edgewater, MD

[gljjr]

My only experience with CO detectors was in my mom's RV. They had wired it into the main propane line and you had to have the thing on in order to run the fridge. Worst setup I've ever seen. It used a huge amount of power and made the batteries on the RV die within 2 days! We cursed that thing for years.

[thataway]

I am not all that thrilled with the conventional C O detectors--they are often not sensitative enough (dumbed down because of too many "false alarms to fire depts), many "wear out" in 2 to 3 years. Many do not alert until at 60 PPM, and full alert at 100 PPM--way too high. One of the best is the AeroMedix 1070. The ware house was damaged by an ice storm last winter, and they are just now shipping--these are designed for airplanes. However there are lots of similarities in boats (I know that they are not "recommended for boats"). This appears to be because of the high humidity environment--and the manufacturer's concern about potential corrosion. If kept dry, this remains the best choice.

Next best is the Kidde Nighthawk 900-0089 and a little cheaper is the Kiddie Nighthawk 900-0146. The digital read out, with separate batteries are a real plus.

The high drain CO detectors are a real pain, and often are disconnected, thus of no value! CO is a real concern and a good detector is essential. If these are now comming standard on the boats (may be a requirement for ABYC)--and all of a sudden batteries are found drained a week or so later!

Remember that Carbon monoxide replaces oxygen in hemoglobin. The level can rise very slowly over a peroid of time and be lethal, even without setting off a detector with a high threshold. The Carbon monoxide is cummulative, and the disassociation from the hemoglobin is very slow.

[ffheap]

Hi Folks,

I am using a battery operated Kidde, the same type I use in my Inn. It cost about $16.00, and uses AA Batteries. I put it under the steering wheel so as to by fairly far from the engine, but near the sleeping area.

The Fire Department said that by next year, if the Commonwealth of Massachusetts gets its act together, all CO Alarm will have to be hard wired. They may not be available if that happens.

Fred

[Ashley Lynn]

While reworking the battery charger connections on my 07 22 cruiser (all three charger outputs were connected to the #1 battery). I removed the cables from the positive battery terminal and then reconnected the two 5/5 amp connections (10 amp will connect to the #2 battery).

The co detector started screetching and the red alarm was illuminated.
The screetching finally ceased but the red led is still illuminated.
I tried the reset button to no avail....I disconnected then reconnected the power jumper on the unit itself and still have the alarm....is the unit shot?

Any ideas?

Learning more everyday!!

[BrentB]

[Bill.Secure]

I had the same problem with the battery charger. The ten and the five were crimped together and the other five went to a second battery. I've never exactly understood the ramifications of that having been done but the Guest tech rep said it may not have been done long enough to do damage. I don't know whether it might have damaged the charger, a battery or nothing. I know the factory sforwarded to production staff two e-mails on the subject I sent them (the second being undersized fuses, fives instead of the fifteens cited in the manual). Wonder if it damaged my CO unit as well.


Bill
Edgewater

[thataway]

Bob,
The battery charger should not have damaged the CO detector, unless there was a high voltage spike--but assume it is shot--and get the factory to send you a new one.

Home heating inspectors/workers have very sensitative CO detection instruments which start reading at 5 Parts a million. Most home units will not read until 100 PPM! This is way too high for a boat. You can get in serious problems with 60 PPM. For example a health web site states:
"For healthy adults, CO becomes toxic when it reaches a level higher than 50 ppm (parts per million) with continuous exposure over an eight hour period.." This is far closer to the reality for boaters who might have a chronic exposure to CO. Interestingly EPA/OSHA give The U.S. National Ambient Air Quality Standards for outdoor air are 9 ppm (40,000 micrograms per meter cubed) for 8 hours, and 35 ppm for 1 hour. Yet the alarms are set at 100 PPM!


A government web site states: "Health effects from exposure to CO levels of approximately 1 to 70 ppm are uncertain, but most people will not experience any symptoms. Some heart patients might experience an increase in chest pain. As CO levels increase and remain above 70 ppm,"

This is wrong--lower levels over a long peroid of time (cummulative) will give symptons and can even cause death.

Further in the web site the further statement is made: "CO detectors/alarms always have been and still are designed to alarm before potentially life-threatening levels of CO are reached. The UL standard 2034 (1998 revision) has stricter requirements that the detector/alarm must meet before it can sound. As a result, the possibility of nuisance alarms is decreased."

Again, bad information. The old standard was lower, and because paramedic units complained about "false negatives" the alarm level was changed upward to 100 PPM.

Thus I recommend the digital read outs: the cheapest is the Kiddie Nighthawk 900-0146--but it doesn't alarm until the new standard 100 PPM. The CO experts will alarm at lower levels.

Also "Test buttons" only test the electrical circuit--do not test the chemical sensor strip. Replace old CO detectors/alarms every 2 to 3 years. Have at least one detector which will read out digital PPM. Put it near the helm, and near your head when sleeping. (two places).

I have seen some deaths both in boaters and other "outdoors" people from Carbon monoxide--and this is very easy to prevent.

[Doryman]

[thataway]

Warren, That is a very good question.
The AeroMedix site says that the units are good for 5 plus years, at a "cost" of about $20 a year. Yet at another part of the site, the unit is only waranteed for a year. Further it indicates that sensors may fail in a year or so...

There is a very interesting article at: http://home.att.net/~f1race43/aeromed.htm. The AIM 935 is no longer manufactured--leaving the AeroMedix as the only sensitative low level meter available at an affordiable price (the flukes and other gas meters are much more expensive).

There used to be a single sample CO test kit. I cannot find this in the US currently. There are large and mixed gas cylinders, but these are as expensive as the moniter and are not practical for a single user. (These expose the electrochemical sensor to a known concentration of gas). When I was in Practice in Long Beach CA, I had several patients with chronic CO poisoning (blood levels elevated). We tested their cars and livng quarters and found levels in the 10 to 15 PPM. Just driving on the freeways will raise the CO levels. One could find out the distance from an auto exhaust which caused a certain level--and then test under these same conditions, it would be a rough measure.

There are electrochemical sensor strips available at $15 to $25 and perhaps one could self install, if the company does not offer this service.