Kayak storage on a 22 Cruiser

surfbird · Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 5:50 pm Post subject:

I tried the Thule Crossroad (aka 450) and although they are a much preferable attachment method than the rain gutter attachment version, it did not have a high enough profile for the crossbar to clear the roof. I also took a look at the Yakima Lowrider (also a rail attachment), but it is approximately the same dimensions as the Thule, so I don't think it will work for my boat either.

I have an 2007 22 Cruiser with roof rails that are below the peak of the roof. Sounds like you didn't have the same problem with the Thule rack as I did - could we have different roof rail systems?

Also, I should note that although I think the gutter system will work just fine, I have not load tested it on the water. I'd be more than happy to give it a test run and post the results along with some photos.

Jim

C-WEED · Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:36 pm Post subject:

For less than $50 in wood, brass screws and a little house paint I made a proto type rack that can do it all. It turned out to be quite durable and retains the salty look. And the color matches the boat. The canoe in the pics (bottom pg 2) is an 18 footer. The deck doubles as a sun deck (something I miss in the dory), a fishing platform and in a pinch a sleeping spot. I made it so that the center of the deck will rest on the center of the roof to spread out the load stress. It can carry anything within reason you can hoist up there. The deck also serves as a safari top (just like a Land Rover) shielding the cabin underneath from the hot southern sun.

I cut a channel in the two forward side rails. This allows it to balance on the two metal roof rails. Then just use band clamps (4 -5 per side) to hold it on. That is why the cutouts are in the deck. To reach the band clamps hidden to the inside. The whole thing pops on and off in minutes with NO holes drilled in the boat.

jlastofka

On my setup the Yakima metal hook that's supposed to grab under the rain gutter is instead hooked under the C-Dory roof rails. By putting a wood spacer between the bottom of the plastic Yakima tower and its rubber pad I end up with the rubber pad and tower pressing down against the roof of the C-Dory and the metal Yakima straps pulling up against the C-Dory rails.

This is exactly the same loading condition the racks would see if they were on a car. As a result, it works fine. I still want to make something custom, because I expect salt water to eventually ruin the Yakima hardware, but I'm certainly in no rush.

When a previous poster asked Yakima about the arrangement, the factory probably envisioned the user trying to do something the rack wasn't designed for, and they of course gave the standard "we can't recommend it" answer (I'm supposing here). Again, the way I'm doing it, the rack sees the same situation as it would on a car, and it's as happy as a rack can be....

I haven't looked to see what Yakima's selling nowadays, though. It could be different.

Jeff

helesh · Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 10:18 pm Post subject:

Lots of good ideas for racks here. I guess I'm more interested in how you load to these racks while on the water. I'm especially interested in how it works with an arch. Maybe I'm overthinking it but I'm looking at loading two 17' fiberglass kayaks without going to shore. Currently I pull the kayak across the cockpit, step up onto a box/cooler and then lift/swing them directly onto a pad on the roof of the c-dory. Thoughts?
Les

SeaSpray · Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 1:40 am Post subject:

Hi Les,

The way I load my kayak and dink is from the bow. I can lift the bow of my kayak with a bow line, then grab the boat and pull it up onto and across the bow rail. With the kayak across the bowrail I can grab the cockpit coming and lift the kayak and swing it around onto the front rack. I then slide it back to the radar arch.

Same with the dink. I pull up the bow and then lift the dink across the bow rail. Then lift the bow upside-down onto the front rack and slide it back to the arch.

I have done this at anchor many times and only fallen in once (just kidding).

Steve

helesh · Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:36 am Post subject:

Steve
Thanks. That was what I was wondering. I'll give it a try next time out. Would a set of hully rollers on the bow rail make the pull easier do you think or just get in the way and look ugly?
Les

C-Pelican · Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:44 am Post subject:

I am very glad this thread was revived. Lots of great ideas, but with my roof and the flood-light, radar dome and two antennas on top, I think the Yakima is my choice.
I also like, as one man said here, the idea of attaching rod holders to it.

SeaSpray · Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:34 pm Post subject:

Hi Les,

I think hurly rollers on the bowrail would not work out. I pull the kayak up while standing just where the bowrail comes down to the deck. With my fiberglass kayak I try not to let the kayak slide against the boat but with my plastic kayak it is not such a big deal.

Once I ge the kayak up high enough to reach the cockpit I have better control. I then either lift the whole kayak or slide the bow on the bowrail until I get the kayak across the bowrail. I can then rest a second and position myself for the next move.

I then either lift the kayak off the rail and turn the stern aft and side it on the rack or I let the bow rest somewhat on the bow rail as I turn the kayak and then slide onto the rack.

My fiberglass kayaks are fairly light (40lbs or less) and my plastic kayak is probably almost 50lbs. My dink is also less than 40lbs. If you have a heavy sit on top plastic kayak you could be looking at over 60lbs. I am not a real muscled person so I try to be very careful about how I lift and move when doing this.

Steve

mark&diana · Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:42 pm Post subject:

I have been looking for a better system to either carry my Kayak (17 foot Perception Eclipse) or Dinghy and like the look of the Thule Crossroad (450) - but am concerned about one of the comments above that it doesn't have a high enough profile to clear the roof -

Has anyone installed a Thule on a TomCat 255?

Thanks!

helesh · Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:45 pm Post subject:

Steve
Thanks for that description, I can see (and feel) exactly what you are doing. My boats are glass and relatively light but they are longer than most. I'm almost looking forward to giving it a try! Very Happy

Thanks again
Les

tpbrady · Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 2:06 am Post subject:

To help me get the kayak up on the bow rails, in addition to the bow rope I tie a rope between the bow and stern and use it to pull the kayak up until I can reach the cockpit. I am still pondering how to get a double up there.

C-Pelican · Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 5:11 pm Post subject:

Jim,

Just about ready to order the 1A raingutters and accessories.

It seems it will be close to hitting the roof racks that run parallel from bow to stern, but will give it a try.

Do you mount the kayak straight on the two perpendicular support bars or did you buy some of the kayak saddle mounts or holy rollers?

Lastly, the stern-most support bar...did you mount it as far back on the cabin top as possible to sort of lean the kayak on as you lifted the other end to hoist it on up the cabin top?

Steve,
I think I will try your bow rail kayak pick-up maneuver next time; sounds good.

Thanks for your time,
Jeff

surfbird · Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 11:15 pm Post subject:

Jeff,

I wonder if this might work for you:

www.rackattack.com/product-pages/product-pdf/yakima-boatloader-instructions.pdf

By attaching a bowline to the kayak a single person could lift the bow up to rest on extended bar, tie off with the bowline, bring stern of kayak up to rack and then back to bow to slide kayak completely on rack...
It may also be the ticket to easily getting the kayak off the rack and into the water.
Of course, the process would be greatly facilitated with two people...

I don't have a kayak, but if I did I would much rather do the loading / offloading from the side versus bow or cockpit where there is not much room to work and too many things to step over. Just thinking out loud...

I took some photos of the Yak rack on my boat and I will get them into my folder after a short break from the computer....

Jim

C-Pelican · Posted: Fri May 02, 2008 11:07 am Post subject:

Jim,

Thanks for the pictures, they really helped me out.
For one thing, I was imagining the mounts hooking to the very edges of the cabin top, not the parallel hand rails on top. That's why I wondered if they were "tall enough" to rise above those very same roof rails your towers are mounted on!
My roof rails are the older wooden ones and I already wonder if the towers would work with them?

Also, I have a radar dome and light on top in the centerline of my roof so I would need the bars to extend out to the edges of the cabin sides. Measuring last night, that would mean the 78" length bars.

Can one presume to put the molded plastic kayak sit-on-top on the outside edges of the support bars insted of bewtween the two towers, and still have the strength necessary to support them?

JEFF JLASTOFKA,

Did you also mount your towers to the parallel roof rails vs the outside edge of the cabin roof?
Are your roof rails also metal?
Does it look like Jims pictures in his album?

Just when I thought I had found an answer to my problems.... I get a curve ball, lol.

One gentleman here though had an idea with the vertical support in the stern that may rescue me yet, if the towers do not fit on my wooden hand rails.

Thanks,
Jeff

jlastofka · Posted: Fri May 02, 2008 3:48 pm Post subject: Real rain gutter racks

Aha. I looked at Jim's pictures, as suggested, and I see that he used REAL raingutter mounts, and mine are really rooftop mounts with hooks that would reach under the rooftop next to where the door closes and seals with a weather strip. I may have confused others with my terminology.

I think I might like the real raingutter mount even better, but mine are working fine and they were surplus in the garage anyway.

Again, mine are similar to the ones pictured in Jim's album, but mine have flat bottoms with rubber pads and they sit flat on the raised fiberglass roof just inboard of the metal handrails, which are mounted through the lower part of the roof. The metal straps from the Yakima rack reach down under the handrails and pull up from underneath. I put a wooden block between the plastic Yakima tower and its rubber pad.

If I were buying a new setup I'd probably get the actual raingutter mounts. It looks like they work without needing the wood shim blocks. I won't bother now, because I want to make an entirely new roof rack setup to integrate Radar, kayak mount, running light, etc. Maybe even a light duty davit crane gizmo for kayak lifting.

Jeff