First post - potential new owner

[matt_unique]

I've owned a 19' Bayliner since I bought it new in 2000. The boat has been a tank but I plan to move up in Feb 08. I'm starting my research now and so far I like the C-Dory products.

I read several posts about the balsa core which was my first concern. I don't think wood belongs near the water but non wood boats are much more expensive.

I keep my boat on a mooring in Massachusetts from April to November. I mostly use my boat to dive with a few overnighters now and then. I go out in all kinds of conditions and I'm often loaded heavy with gear.

I'm interested in the C-22 Cruiser with twins. I was at a boat show recently where they had a C-22 Angler. The cabin was definitely not big enough for my needs. I'm curious to see the cruiser cabin to compare. I'm impressed with some of the modifications done by other owners. Particularly the owner who created a bunk bed. I would want the ability to sleep 4 adults.

I'm curious how the C-22 will handle decent seas. I know it depends on several factors but I'm curious how the C-22 would compare to my 18 degree deadrise on my cuddy cabin.

Also, is the fuse box mounted differently on the C-22 compared to the C-25?

Thanks for the information.

[Larry H]

Matt,

The balsa use in the core of the boat is not like wood. It is sealed inside layers of fiberglass and hasn't been a problem. The boat is a fiberglass boat with balsa core.

Four adults overnight in a 22 cruiser is probably too many.
Also, there is not seating for 4 adults when underway.

Many of our members operate their 22's offshore, including fishing 30 to 50 miles off the Oregon coast.

[Alasgun]

You have 2- 22ftrs and a 25 ftr in your neighborhood for sale according to our boats for sale ad. That 25 caused quite a ruckus recently with a lot of attention being drawn to the crack in the transom. Personally, I would not shy away from this boat for that reason but it sure has been for sale quite a while. We sleep 4 adults in our 25 but one of us is on the floor, which is usually me. We find this boat most comfortable with no more than 3 adults on anything other than day trips.
Mike on Huda Thunkit

[Luna C]

Check out my photos, I have an extra seat over the galley. Also, when the table is down, up to four can be seated on the port side. I often haul six or more. Only sleep three though!

[Yellowstone]

Captain Matt - the 22' cruiser will take more seas than you will ever wish to be in - regarding balsa wood, remember the cork bobbers you used as a kid fishing - hard to water soak - the balsa core is covered with thick layers of fiberglass - even if you punctured the outside of the hull to the balsa core, there is no where for the water to go - in terms of rotting I've never heard of that happening with a C- Dory
Yellowstone

[Byrdman]

Hey Matt! Welcome about the C-Brat community/cult.

You have to make up you mind on some things with your boat. Where do you want the room of a 22' boat? Under the hardtop, or in the cockpit. Myself, I like larger cockpits, due to the fact that this lets you as the owner set up a larger area of "flexible space" for differant types of uses.

I 1st went to the factory site as to print me some line drawings for some dementions, but only one of the 3 hulls I was going to address had a line drawing. The 22 Cruiser has a line drawing. Neither the 22 Angler or 25 Cruiser have line drawings.....but I feel sure you could print out a 22 Cruiser, make a few copies, and just drop in measurements provided by other owners on this site, or your dealership.

Not sure why the factory does not have line drawings on the factory page anymore?

Any who.... As you can tell, most of us have exstensive aft canvas jobs. This gives more "indoor" area when you want it, take it down, or fold it back/forward, and you have outdoor area.

You want 2 things from this boat that I pick up from your post....to sleep 4 folks on a 22' boat, and to use as a dive platform....both of which take a considerable amount of room/space.

I do not think you want your guest to sleep outdoors or your tanks and gear indoors...other than for storage for security when away from the boat.

You may be best suited to make some newspaper templets and lay them out in your den/garage/yard....gym floor...or where ever you have room. Then, set the tanks down, lay out 4 sleeping bags.

My thought here is I think for your use...the Angler you did not like may be the best suited to use as a dive boat and sleep 4...sometimes. Air matress' in the floor of the cockpit with sleeping bags will fit (maybe) in a 22 Angler....they will not on a 22 cruiser. Now, if you are willing to chop out the interior of a CD22 Cruiser, and basically have an empty cabin to start over with....then it may work in that interior 6'4" long, basically 6' wide area.....as to make a bunk bed FOR ADULTS...not grand children, to sleep 2 in the cabin area, and two in the V-berth, with the gear stowed in the cockpit. Or...for less chop work...just reverse it... Sleep 2 on air matress in the cockpit, 2 in the V-berth, and gear in the cabin area....or tossed about the boat. You can store things on the roof...and you will more than likely have to putting 4 adults and gear on a 22 foot boat.

Just some thoughts.... and the 22' boat is larger than that 18' boat....but take what you want to do, try it on the 18....and see what would transition into either of the 22. The cockpit area is not that large on a 25 for sleeping two adults....so....major cut/chop work needed...

Or...hold your breath a bit... Tom Latham, COO of C-Dory is stating that there are a few new models over the near horizon.... and who knows....they may have a 25/26' Angler version....

Budget will play largely in this whole gig. What ya wanting to spend?

[matt_unique]

Thanks for the replies.

My priority is space inside the cabin. During the cold temps I like to stay warm and dry and during the summer I like to stay out of the sun. 9 times out of 10, I will use the boat with 2 other dive buddies. We head out for the day to dive then have lunch in a protected cove. We dive in everything less than Gale Force winds. I can't wait to have a boat where I can dive, surface, then get inside a cabin to relax. The canvas on my current boat does not really cut it. Canvas is great to extend covered space but I look forward to not having canvas on the next boat.

I would prefer the C-25 for sure but it's not a financial reality. I'm trying to figure out if I can make the C-22 work. I liked the idea of a rack bunk to sleep the 4th person and the idea of a seat above the galley. If the galley is countersunk on the new models it seems you could easily make some wood covers and get some cushions for a 4th seat. I can't recall from pictures if the faucet is also below the counter...if no, how do you address that when making the 4th seat above the galley?

I know boat selection is all about priorities, and no one boat covers all of them. I love the idea of a swim platform with a heavy duty X-mas tree dive ladder. I realize I would not have this option with twins. I noticed some owners had found a way to install a mini platform but I can't imagine that could support the weight of me in double tanks. For those who have installed the mini platform, are you limited with port side steering?

I'm curious about the fuse box. On the C-22 Angler I looked at, I noticed the fuse box was basically wide open in the v-berth with a canvas cover. I don't recall the same on the C-25. Is the fuse box mounted differently on the C-25? Perhaps I just did not notice if it was mounted in the same way as the C-22.

Lastly, the C-22 I looked at did not have a level floor and there were no scuppers. Scuppers are a high priority for me. The sales rep at the recent boat show said the next model C-22 coming out would have a level floor. I was not sure if this also meant the C-22 would get scuppers. Any information on this item would be much appreciated.

Thanks for the help. These sites are the best selling and quality control tools for any product.

[Larry H]

The cockpit floor in the 22 is below the water line so there cannot be scuppers. A bilge pump is fitted aft, between the fuel tanks. In the 22, the cockpit floor is the bottom of the boat. The bottom is cored and about 2+in thick, but there is no bilge below the floor.

[matt_unique]

[starcrafttom]

the level floor is only two inches thick at most and does not allow for scuppers but does drian to the rear pump much better then the old floor

[thataway]

Balsa Core: if properly done it is an excellent method of boat construction. It has a bad rap because in some cases it (and other core materials) were used with insufficient glass. If a hole is put in the balsa core, the balsa must be routed out around the hole, ( bend coat hanger on a drill will do this), then epoxy paste put in the place of the removed core, and the hole redrilled or sanded to the correct size with all epoxy surrounding the hole/fitting. The C Dory has enough glass and good adhesion that there has been no problem with the core in the bottom.

Seaworthness. The boat will go at planing speeds in flat water. As seas steepen up you have to drop to a semi planing speed, which starts at 8 to 10 knots. Because of the semi dory hull it remains very sea worthy up to all speeds. I understand your concern about non self bailing cocpits. But the reality is that the C Dory gets very little water in the cockpit and the pump handles that. Some of the larger boats are self bailing--and have the cockpit floors much higher. This raises the center of gravity of the boat.

Compare the 18 degree with the semi dory--the 18 degree is only fair in 2 to 3 foot seas (it will pound)--the C Dory will pound in 3 foot seas unless you slow down. If you want to get away from pounding in heavy seas then either a cat or real deep V--like a contender--or ORCA. A Parker is also a popular dive boat.

The mini step will hold you and your tanks with no problem. I don't see why you cannot put a standard diving ladder on this step with some modifications for the bracket--I suspect that some have done this.

I would think that a bench seat on the port side with upper back which hinged up or made into a pipe berth would work for the sleeping and sitting--but then you give away the table and dinette.

On the other hand, talk with Bob Searles (Dive Cat) about his experience and multiple divers on the larger Tom Cat 255. Divers and their gear take up a lot of room...Especially if you have multiple tanks.

[flagold]

Capt. Matt

As much as I love my C-Dory, if you're going to buy a 22 to dive with multiple divers -- PASS! The CD-22 is a lot of things, but dive boat it is not. Yes, you can dive from it, but as a dedicated dive boat it will not cut it. I've owned and operated 3 dedicated dive boats and done numerous underwater operations (working underwater) -- you need the "dive cat" as suggested above, a C-Dory is sufficient if you're only going to be diving every now and again. To little room and storage in the back, unstable with a side ladder and multiple tanks, not enough room for a diver in full gear clambering up the stern, and probably more reasons as well. Hookah, it's passable, but again, only now and then.

Great boat -- just not a dive boat. A Parker cabin boat might be just the ticket for heavy dive operations.

[matt_unique]

My preference would be a Callan C-62, ha ha, but I can't afford that. No doubt an Orca Cat would be high on the list if I had over 100K to spend on the boat.

The C-22 is my budget unfortunately. I currently dive with 3 and weekend with my 18' cuddy cabin so certainly any upgrade will be an improvement. I'm at the research phase to see what boat will cover the majority of my priorities.

The Parkers are great boats for diving but too spartan for much else.

Thanks for the information.

[Plan C]

Matt

For seaworthiness on your coast, you should talk with Fred Heap, who goes back and forth to Nantucket in a 22 Angler, for a number of years. I'd put faith in whatever he says. Unfortunately I don't have his email address, but someone here will.

Dave