DITCH BAG

[El and Bill]

We have recently received some e-mail about what to carry in a ditch bag should our boat sink when cruising in remote areas. So, this is what we carry in a small waterproof bag that snaps around my waist in rough weather.

For Survival: 3 Main Things: Fire, Shelter, Signal

Fire: water proof matches in waterproof match case. (Some folks carry 2 Bic lighters or a magnesium lighter)
Fire: wax paper, cotton balls in Vaseline in pill case -- all in small paper bag

Shelter: In case of sinking, we carry 2 lg black plastic bags, space blanket, space blanket bivy, rope, knife

Signal: signal mirror (glass), whistle, handheld GPS (to give exact location), handheld marine radio ( to contact passing or searching boats)

1st Aid: kit, also Tylenol, latex gloves, bug repellent, Neosporin, water purifier tablets

Prevention: publish your plan, GPS w/ spare batteries, flashlight, cell phone (at top of mountains), VHF radio, compass, small sheet aluminum foil to use as cook pot to make snow into water or boil water to purify. You can live (probably for three weeks) without food, but only three or so days without water. Plenty of spare batteries.

Notes: if boat is still visible from air (like on shore), stay near the boat. Plane can see that easier than people. Also, might get provisions and other stuff from boat, if accessible. Try to set up shelter, fire for drying clothes and signalling as quickly as possible -- preferably while sun is up, since hypothermia sets in super fast – uncontrollable shivering is all you’ll feel before slipping into altered mental state; use dead dry branches at bottom of trees still attached; turn off cell phone if no coverage – can call at mountain tops; wear hat at night to keep warm – if no hat use clothing (e.g., underwear); get wood for night early – then get 10x that amount and you might make it to morning, stay hydrated. We don't carry any clothes in ditch bag -- too bulky.

To make water still if in a dry area, dig 3’x3’ hole, put aluminum foil shaped as container at bottom, put large black plastic bag over top and weight edges, put small stone in middle over pot, condensation from below will occur and drip into the pot. Make 2 or more stills. In snow, don’t eat it – melt it with fire using aluminum foil pot.

Signal – fire at night, lots of smoke in the day! Call every hour on VHF, listen five minutes, turn off.

These are the clothes we wear in cold water cruising, cotton is worst for warmth – no blue jeans ever. Use smart wool or polypro thermals for 1st layer, fleece 2nd layer, shell for 3rd layer. This is the ideal for wearing, although often don't have the shell on in cold rough water if we have the stove on.

Our ditch bag is a small, waterproof bag that snaps around our waist -- whenever we wear life jackets in the boat, in really rough weather, I have it strapped on. Otherwise it is under dinette table, easily accessible.

Any other ideas?

[thataway]

We carry similar to Bill and El--but with several additions--
We each carry a persona GPS enabled EPRIB on our person when cruising. Remember the difference beteen the outcome on Mount Hood in the last few weeks. Those with the EPRIB were found alive very rapidly. Those with only a cell phone died. We each have a personal strobe/light. We each have a submersiable VHF.

The VHF, Flashlight, Strobe and GPS are all operated on AA batteries and we carry 12 extra AA batteries.

We carry a Gerber multipurpose tool, a full sevice Swiss army knife, Flares, Smoke signal and sea dye. Also a 3 x 4 piece of red plastic. We also carry some monel wire, a small pair of Vise Grips, a multip purpose screw driver and small cresent wrench.

We have a whistle and small air horn. The compass is a hand bearing compass, readable from the top and side. (Hocky puck type)

Also there is a small roll of duct tape, 1/8" lline, fishing line, sinkers, hooks and a few simple lures. Our space blankets are quite small but large enough to cover each of us.

We have all of this in a single waterproof bag, easily carried. We have a separate ditch bag, with solar still, multiple parachute flares, hand held flares more smoke etc--also keep a 5 gallon can of water near the dinghy in case we have to leave the boat. Agree with Bill water is essential! Also so is warmth. Often if we take a dinghy trip we will also take more clothes--with sweat shirts, sweat pants, light weight plastic foul weather gear a cap and heavy sox all in another waterproof bag.

[Steve Grover]

Thank you for posting this page. This is the first post I have printed for review. I have the bag and have wondered what I might put in it. I have most of this stuff except the small hand held GPS.
Thanks again.

[johnf]

El, Bill & Bob,

Thanks for sharing...been thinking about this lately so the timing is excellent.

Been wondering about the bag itself...does it have velcro so it is easily opened when in cold water? Don't want everything else to spill out but want to get what is needed as needed...flare gun, flare, personal epirb, vhf, etc...

Any recommendations? Been looking here and there for a bag.

Thanks,

Crazy John Frazey

[thataway]

The bag we have is old--probably at least 20 years and has a scrim in the clear plastic--but it is similar to any number of clear dry bags:
Sealine, Seebag--9" x 17".
http://www.seallinegear.com/dry_bags.asp?Action=SeeBag&Category=DryBags (also shows how it seals in the link)

The top has heavier plastic which seals and then rolls over, there are clips which close the tope of the bag and ours has a shoulder strap.

The clear bag allows one to see what is present in the bag. Ours has never leaked and has taken plenty of abuse.

The second bag we have is a rapid ditch bag by ACR--it came with our ACR EPRIBS. We have a larger bag, which is opaque for extra clothing we take in the dinghy--it is similar to the clear bag, but larger and a bit sturdier; like: the Sea Line Baja bag 40.

[jstates]

I have been carrying a ditch bag sea kayaking - and am bringing the ideas over to the CDORY - from kayaking and teaching survival and mountaineering in the past.

In addition to many of the items mentioned previously - inside the waterproof ditch bag I put a Nalgene -see thru one liter water bottle-for things that might require extra dryness for storage - like spare Knife, matches, compass, Tyelnol #3, parachute cord - lighters, long metal sharpening tool [chisel] [, lots of batteries, mini mag with LED instead of traditional filiment bulb - and leatherman tool. A lightweight tightly folded space blanket will also fit.

The one liter bottle will be helpful for collecting and carrying fresh water once on land - and I also carry a small bottle of Iodine crystals available at REI [in the past] You fill the small bottle containing the iodine cyrstals with a couple of oz of water - shake well then pour off the water [not the remaining crystals] into the one liter bottle to purify the fresh water that might be collected once on shore. Developing dysentery in the wild can have fatal consequences if the dehydration is not corrected. One small bottle of iodine crystals will be enough for 100's of liters of water- use temperature guide on the iodine bottle - let water sit a longer time if it is colder. Water filters are nice - on mountaineering expeditions we would filter then use iodine.

My favorite fire starter is bicycle innertube - shake off the water if its wet - not much will stick then light it - a 2 inch by 4" piece will usually start most kindling - just don't breath the toxic fumes.

My other favorite survival tool [in the ditch bag] is one of the larger buck hunting knives - its most useful for building a wet day fire [meaning all wood is wet on the outside] - I have been using the same one for 20+years [teaching wet weather fire building techniques] to split the edges off of and eventually the whole piece of wood up to 6 " in diameter -- turn the log on end - lay the knife across what ever width is necessary so 2 inches of the blade hang over then hammer it down thru to the dry wood with another stick - works best with 3-4 " diameter wood. Wet day fires should be practiced - you may only get one chance with cold hands, and wet gear before hypothermia takes over. This technique will break many other knives.


You can also purchase a key chain saw - basically a coil of sharpened wire with 1 inch ring at each end - you can make a temporary bow saw with it that will at least help cut into a piece of wood that will be dry inside.

I agree with the comments on wool - its the best - for wet and durability and less odor than synthetics. No cotton. Use the pile for my second layer. We put on our Gortex drysuits before crossing back from San Juan Fishermans bay across a very rough Rosario straight over Christmas break. Because of the breathability they are very comfortable - the rubber collar can be made more comfortable by using 3/4 inch plastic tubing in a ring - to keep the collar from compressing - its easy to remove quickly if things get serious. I plan to continue to carry the dry suits on all trips.


Outside of the ditch bag in general -
All clothing and sleeping bags are stored in the waterproof kayaking / canoing dry bags that are very durable - There is a great new Pelican case that will hold a notebook computer and accessories.

Thanks for all the ideas in the forum - especially the tips from members before Christmas about crossing Rosario to the North thru obstruction pass and North of Cypress and Guemes. Glad we didn't need our ditch bag.

Jim on Endurance

[ffheap]

Hi Folks,

A great idea, but I want to be a devil's advocate and put another idea in this discussion. If you check the trend on flotation, you will see my comment on increasing flotation, rather than doing away with it.

A "ditch bag" says that if our boat gets in trouble, that we are going to leave the boat. If you read the book, FASTNET FORCE 10, by John Rousmaniere, you will find out that many people who left their sinking boats died in the life rafts, and many people who stuck with the ship, even swamped, lived.

The general feeling is that you should stay with the ship until you are rescued. If we have proper flotation, a personal EBERP attached to your inflatable life jacket, that help will come. In our little "yachts" the key may be in having plenty of flotation so out boat will keep floating until help arrives.

Just one man's idea.

Fred

[thataway]

In some ways Fred is correct, and that is the way I set up my ocean crossing boats--to stay with them. See my comment about abandoned boats not sinking. But there are times when you have a distress or emergency and need all of the tools available for survival. We carry the ditch bag in the dinghy all of the time (and it goes with us as we walk about towns etc).
We also carry it in the RV. The Ditch bag organizes everything you need in one place and you can grab it.

For example two cases in the last year--one a Carolina Classic on an open stretch of the ICW, brand new boat on the way to a Florida boat show, had a seal on the shaft fail, the boat filled with water, the engine hatch was opened and a wave appparently swamped and sank the boat.
The two crew did not have a chance to get their lifejackets, ditch bag and died. If they had the ditch bag right with them, they would have survived most likely (reason for personal EPRIB).

Contrast a similar sized boat a couple of weeks ago, which caught on fire and sank in less than 45 minutes. These folks had a ditch bag, and life raft. The radioed a MayDay and set off the EPRIB--all survived.

Get the ditch bag! It can save your life.

[Doryman]

Re: EPIRBs. I mentioned to a friend that I was thinking of getting one for my life jacket and she commented that they are very good for helping rescuers find your cold, lifeless body.

But I think there is an element of truth to that. If you go in the drink, particularly in the PNW, your life expectancy is probably measured in minutes -- certainly not in the length of time it would take the Coast Guard to pick up your EPIRB signal and home in on it.

Warren

[thataway]

Warren,
For the PNW I suspect you will want an exposure suit if you want to jump in the water. On the other hand, I was riding the reversing salt water falls in my dinghy in the evening--and helped some other folks get their boat out of a pinch and let the tide get away from me. I had the ditch bag and clothing. Called Marie on the VHF and said I was OK but would just stay in the lake until the tide reversed (8 hours)--grabbed some more warm clothes, the space blanket and the plastic and stayed the night--in the AM came on out on the high tide.

In the "All Lit Up" case (boat burned and was abandoned in a few minutes) the CG had contacted the wife within less than 10 minutes of the activation time--and had a boat on the way within 15 minutes. Now without an exposure suite--that may not be enough--but a raft, dinghy or exposure suit is essential in the cold water. We carried wet suits--did not get exposure suits--today we probably would get exposure dry suits.

[johnf]

Thanks for the ideas and discussion...getting many ideas.

Appreciate all the help. Hope no one here has to use the items but we should always be prepared.

John

[mikeporterinmd]

Anyone have a sense for how reliable the distress calling feature
on channel 70 is going to be? Anyone hear stories of people using
it and it working?

Anyone using DSC in general?

Mike

[Doryman]

[doc]

I suspect that an incident in our Inside Passage would as likely as not end up with a beached (rocked) boat, which may or may not stay put, accessible or intact. We carry full survival gear, including redundant essentials for fire, signal, food, shelter and fire arms to keep us going until we can rescue ourselves or help arrives. The desire or ability to stay with a distressed vessel depends upon many variables. Floatation or not, we prefer to be prepared for as many variables as we can. We use a ditch bag that is not raided or used for any other purpose and we keep it ready to go and handy at all times including trips ashore. We came to a conclusion that if and when we ever need it, we'll not have a lot of time to think and gather because things will be happening fast, the water will be rough, it may be dark and we will almost certainly be wet and cold.

[Doryman]