Boat service

[rogerbum]

Is it just me or does something seem fundamentally wrong with almost all boat service places (and for that matter most businesses involved with boating)? If I need work done on my car, I call in and make an appointment. I show up at the appointment and leave my car in the AM. Usually by 10AM maybe earlier, I get a call with an estimate and I'm told how long it will take. Usually the work is done that day - maybe it takes a day or two longer if parts have to be obtained. Something major, like body work is usually done within a week or two. Regardless, I get a fairly accurate estimate of how long it will take and the job is done on time and on budget.

Contrast that to work on my boat -- let say I need 100 hr service done. I call the various vendors and most say "We can't tell you exactly how long it will take. We're 2-3 weeks out right now, we don't do appointments, you have to bring your boat down to get in the queue." So, you bring your boat down and 2-3 weeks later, you've heard nothing, so you give them a call. Either they haven't yet started on it, or parts of some sort are on order or the one person who actually knows anything is out at lunch etc. Usually days, sometimes weeks, pass and eventually many phone calls later you get the boat back and you get to repeat the cycle sometime again in the future. I'm not complaining about any specific vendor, I have this kind of thing happen with every vendor I've used to date. It seems endemic to the industry - maybe people who get involved with the marine industry do so because they can't stand schedules or working in a hurry - I don't know. However, it seems to me that once someone figures out how to run a marine service shop more like an auto service shop - e.g. with timely service and rapid turnaround, they'll make a good bit of $'s.

Just ranting as it's been about a month since I dropped my boat off for the following service -
• 100 hour service on the engines (twin Honda 40hp)
• replace idle cable on port side engine
• check all other cables for cracks and replace if necessary
• check impellers and replace if necessary
• check all fuel lines and replace as necessary
• disassemble and re-seal any through-hulls below the water line (in particular, the depth sounder transducer).
• Clean and grease all steering related components
• Replace fuel filter
• Replace batteries

and I still have no idea when it will be done or how much it will cost. Of course, I have to make the phone calls to get any info as the service is not proactive in this regard.

[starcrafttom]

The Susan E is due for her 600 hour service and I called cathy at E.Q. harbour services. she says "yeah sure be here in the morning on the 28th" and it will take four to five hours. I will go beach fishing or smelting for awhile, then pick it up and if its before lunch I will go out for black mouth for a while.

So roger whats the problem?? I know what you are talking about because I have been thru the same thing with other shops and thats why I do my own maintaince. Its just the valve timing and carbs that have me sending it into les this time. Its a tow and half a day but I have the time right now so why not. I have another thing that gets me going. i have a doctor appointment later this week, 6,000,000,000 hour tune up. They tell me the appointment is at 3:15 but be there at 3:00. so the appointment is at 3:00 right? no its at 3:15 just be there at 3:00. What???????

[thataway]

I certainly agree with Roger--and this is one of the reasons I tend to do most of my own work, when I can.

One of the issues with boats is stock of items. Car dealers and even the shade tree mechanic have a parts supply available within a few hours--or maybe a day or two at the most--mostly local dealer, Auto zone or NAPA.

The boat dealer carries very few parts--the flooring is not worth the costs since there are so many different boats/motors etc. There are relitatively few boats (although some towns have as many boats as cars).

Boating in many areas is seasonal--and there are huge demands during the season. Auto demands are pretty much predictable and steady thru the year.

[TyBoo]

[ffheap]

I think you have a good reason to bitch. The boat business has, in the past, been notorious for not doing promised work on time, or pushing you out in the future for work to be done.

I have had two incidents where this has happened with my 22' C-Dory.

1. I purchased a new 70 HP Yamaha four stroke from a dealer. At the time the engine was put on, the work was done very fast, like less than a week. But some of the related work was sloppy. They added a new battery switch with screws sticking out inside the a locker. When I told them I thought it was sloppy work, they could not understand why I was mad. Then when I took the engine back in the fall for oil change etc. so it would cover my warranty, they said I had to come back in three weeks. I took it to a certified mechanic and he did the oil change and other work while I waited.

2. The second incidence, I had to have a shelf added. Work promised in June, done in August. Same SOS.

What you have to do is ask around for who is good, and who is not for mechanical work. As for fiberglass work, if you can not get it done by the boat show season (this week in Boston) have the job done next year.

There are a lot of good boat people out there. It takes time to find them.

You should get some good answers from this thread.

Fred

[rogerbum]

Mike and Jim.
I agree with the seasonal nature of the business causing problems. Even up here in the PacNW, the business is somewhat seasonal. However, I have the same issues when I try to get service off season as in season. It seems like there is never a time when things are fast.

As far as parts goes though... I understand that there are a number of different boat motors out there but it seems to me that a least for outboards were talking about far few different types of boat engines than car engines. If I look around in say the Seattle area, there's a heck of a lot of boats and the majority of the those with outboards are from 3-4 different manufacturers. While the overall outboard market is smaller than the car market, the overall complexity in terms of makes, models etc. is much higher for cars - and for cars as noted above, there's a parts shop around nearly every corner. I can think of a dozen auto parts stores within 10 miles of my house and I'm sure there are many more I don't know of. Yet, I don't know of a single place that regularly stocks a variety of boat engine parts in the city of Seattle. It just seems to be that the parts should be fairly available in a city on the water of the size of Seattle. It also seems to me that many things could be scheduled in advance and that at least certain jobs could be predicted to take a certain amount of time.

[Dreamer]

Roger, I feel for you brother.. I have been there many times. After a 30 year career in Auto Service, it was so hard to get used to the laid-back, no schedule, no accountability type of service offered by most boat shops. I tried to instill a little professionalism in their act but it was fruitless.

All I can sugest is a firm attitude with benchmarks (as in Iraq). I am not shy about going to the owner with comments.

[Sea Wolf]

Roger-

Far be it from me to be an apologist for the boating industry, but I can point out a few differences that I think contribute to this disparity between service practices in the auto and marine industries.

Here are some contributing factors that help generate this difference:

1. The auto service industry is regulated by the state, which helps develop uniformity. Here in California, the Bureau of Automotive Repair investigates claims of excessive costs, unnecessary repairs, fraud, etc., etc. This helps tighten up the ship.

2. The automotive service industry is dealing with people's cars, which are essential in our daily activity. People cannnot and will not tolerate slow work. By contrast, most boating is recreational, and a more laid back scheduling approach works. We need the car this afternoon, the boat next weekend.

3. The automotive service industry is much more competitive than the marine service industry. There are many more competitors all the way from dealers to small shops, and this results in more competive pricing for services. You do definitely have more options when searching for automotive service as compared to marine service. Competition includes the ability to deliver on time as well at a tolerable price.

4. Where appoinments are made in the marine service shops, many people make appointments that are never kept, probably because the boat is not essential to daily life. Knowing this, many shops will not make appointments, and revert to the que system, which also allows them to progress through the work at their own pace.

5. Parts sources are usually much further away from service shops in the marine industry, which drags service work out as they wait for UPS/Fed Ex/DHL/etc. No 23 year old gals driving around in mini-pick ups delivering parts within the hour with a cute smile and welcome female figure around the shop!

I'm sure there are more factors, but these are some that come to mind right now. Larry H, with his professional mechanic's background, may be able to add to this list.

Joe.

[dotnmarty]

I have always felt that being prompt is an aspect of professional service of equal importance to technical competence. At this point, and in this place, I have surrendered. Now I take my boat in in late fall or winter and just consider it free storage.

[Sea Wolf]

[Cutty Sark]

Oh great, now you got me worried how long my boat is going to be sitting at Sea Ray in fife, I just dropped mine off for some engine services and warranty work as well. When I had my defiance, I had I-90 marine do my services on my suzuki's and they were pretty fast no more than a week and it was done. I got the same deal when I dropped off my boat, the guy had no idea how much for the engine services. I had to have a little warranty work done, but next time I might try I-90 again if mine ends up taking weeks, on top of that fife is a long ways from kenmore. Good luck.

Sark

[Jazzmanic]

Sorry guys. We've never had any problems with our service at Master Marine in Mount Vernon, servicing our Suzuki's. Sark, you can also try them. There's no problem making an appointment and the work always gets done based on there estimate.

Sorry you're having so many problems Roger.

Peter

[dotnmarty]

Joe- Nice. I'm gonna let that pass and chalk it up to the trip to Barstow.

[JamesTXSD]

It's not just boats. We found that same attitude in the RV industry. Often, you are a captive audience. I will not go back to anyplace that gives me lousy service - in terms of the actual work done, the amount of time to get it done, or the general attitude. It's my money and I'll spend it where I feel I get my money's worth. Of course, there is that first time anywhere when you have to find out how the shop operates.

And the rub: when a shop is good, word gets around... more work comes their way... backing up their schedule (since most service places are reluctant to put on more staff in case it's a "temporary" influx of work)... kind of the Peter Principle as applied to the service industry.

That's why I could never understand why you have to have a boat into a service place "first thing in the morning" (the definition of which differs by service attitude), when they KNOW they aren't going to even look at it until later that day. I DETEST having my time wasted (you can make more $$$, you can't make more time). When we were working, we did everything by appointment; if a client without an appointment showed up, we'd do our best to accomodate them, but not make a client with an appointment ever have to wait. It only ever took one time in without an appointment for a client to learn it is in their best interest to schedule a time. It also allowed us to be MUCH more efficient. Now, with a service industry, there are always surprises (like why won't that damn bolt come off????) that take additional time. Tougher to schedule, but not impossible.

There is a small shop in our home town that mainly does work on outboards. I waited (and participated) while the young guy did our 200 hour service before we left on this trip. Still, there was more time wasted than I could have ever tolerated in our business.

When you find a shop that gives good service, reward them with your business. When you deal with a shop that doesn't give good service, don't go back. One customer may not make a difference... but one + one + one + one.

I used to present seminars on business and giving good customer service in our industry - this topic really strikes a nerve with me. Good luck on getting your work done... promptly and to your satisfaction.

Best wishes,
Jim B.

[dotnmarty]