Porta Potti restrictions in Canadian waters

Old Jim · Last edited by Old Jim on Tue Jul 25, 2006 3:58 pm; edited 1 time in total

According to the Office of Boating Safety at Transport Canada, portable toilets are illegal in Ontario waters. I have two questions:

1. Is this the case in all Canadian waters?

2. How do C Brats with porta pottis deal with this issue?

Thanks for your help.

Jim
Hopeful CD owner in the research stage.

lloyds · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 1:22 pm Post subject:

I used mine extensively in BC and no one said a thing. But I did notice there are virtually no emptying facilities on the docks. No pump out stations, nothing. But that makes sense, there is virtually no secondary sewage treatment in BC. Even Victoria and Vancouver dump right into the sound. Salinity has been a long standing approved method of treating waste. There are some restrictions in the RV parks about what holding tank chemicals you use. I think they try to discourage any with formaldahyde.

wailedcentipede · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 1:34 pm Post subject:

it was on our news last nite, all waters. i would think the porta-pottie is all right you just have to head into a marina to dump them .. i'm on the west coast my first thought was our provencial capital in Victory... the city has a pipe line dumping raw sewage into Jaun Defuca strait .. soooo you dump off Victory or a shore station .. Laughing

Ron on Meander · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 2:01 pm Post subject:

Porta Potties are fine in BC waters. Currently there are only restrictions on dumping in certain designated areas. I.E anchorages and harbours. As of September new regulations will be enacted that prohibit all dumping of raw untreated sewage from pleasure boats in any coastal waters less than 3 NM from shore. The biggest problem we will have in following the new rules is the small number of pump out stations there are available. Especially north of Nanaimo. Hopefully with the new rules the number of pump stations will increase rapidly.

Larry H · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 2:16 pm Post subject:

I have read that boats are not allowed to even have a porta pottie in the Province of Ontario.

So what are we supposed to do when transiting Ontario's waters? Do we box up the pottie and ship it home? Crook

Do we use a bucket as a substitute? Angry

More importantly, are we supposed to just 'hold it in' till we get to Quebec? Embarrased

People who gotta go wanna know!! Disgust

drjohn71a · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 2:59 pm Post subject:

'Love that line, Larry.... "...just hold it in 'til we get to Quebec?"
John

lloyds · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 3:05 pm Post subject:

"people who gotta go, wanna know" is pretty good too. I did not realize Vancouver finally came on line completely with secondary treatment. That had always been a major point of contention in puget sound.

MOOSE · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 4:08 pm Post subject:

I am aware of this supposed prohibition, but we boat in Ontario 90% of the time and it has never been raised as an issue in any of the inspections we have had by enforcement personnel of various persuasions. I suspect that, despite the letter of what may be the law, a reasonable person would soon conclude that a porta-potti is better than the alternative.
Al

Not For Hire · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 4:32 pm Post subject:

In Ontario and in several other western lakes porta pottis are not allowed. Now the boat qualifies if it has no toilet or if it has a fixed toilet with pump out fitting on deck. So you quailfy if you leave the pp at home. You qualify if you plumb it in. What happens if you do nothing or if you break it apart and store it? Depends on the circumstances and personalities involved. Some inspectors seem to ignore this. Some are diverted if you show evidence of proper disposal (see article below). Some could be having a bad day and you could have the pp confiscated and pay a fine. Most would not do this to such a cute boat flying the Maple Leaf as a courtesy.

And despite what DoD says you can drink Lake Superior water. I think he is just jealous because his boating waters are so warm.

http://www.tc.gc.ca/BoatingSafety/facts/foreign.htm

Quoting from this site:

* "Portable toilets are illegal on Ontario waters. The owner of a pleasure craft shall ensure that each toilet and the holding tank(s) is/are installed so that;
* The toilet and equipment are connected in such a manner that the equipment receives all toilet waste from the toilet.
* Equipment designed for the storage of human excrement is provided with a deck fitting and such connecting piping as is necessary for the removal of toilet waste by shore-based pumping equipment.
* No means of removal of toilet waste is provided other than the means mentioned above.
* All parts of the system for removal of toilet waste are congruent with one another and the boat."

A crusing magazine suggests:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
For trailer sailors, we advise setting up:

1. A means of securing the portipotti firmly within the vessel (Mine is screwed in place with brackets supplied by the manufacturer … Thetford in my case)
2. A deck-mounted pump-out. This is via a pump-out fitting that screws onto the portipotti in place of the main top cap.
3. A vent line through the hull just below the rub-rail. This also attaches to the fitting that replaces the top cap.

Having said this, we have not heard of this issue being a problem with previous visitors from south of the border. Some prior cruisers have paid to dump their portipotti at a marina waste disposal, and kept the receipt as evidence of their environmental responsibility.
We all want to keep the water clean.
It's where we will be swimming tomorrow, right?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
And From Power Boating Canada Magazine

The most controversial of the regulations governing pleasure craft in Canada is, of course, the ban on Porta-Potti types of marine toilets that are designed to be emptied into toilets on shore. This portable unit consists of two parts. One is a holding tank that seals off and can readily be transported without danger of spillage. It is specifically designed for recreational use in campers, motorhomes and cruisers. It was used extensively in all three until the government decided to ban them from all boats in Canada.

The reason given was they didn't trust boaters not to empty them overboard when nobody was looking. This decision, which certainly seems remarkably selective, has cost skippers thousands of dollars.

Why any boater in his right mind would dump raw sewage into the lake that he is cruising on, swimming in and fishing in is quite beyond understanding. But you had better abide by it or pay a fine. So here is an excerpt from the Canadian Coast Guard's "Safe Boating Guide."

The following is a list of areas in which boats are required to have holding tanks and cannot pump sewage overboard: all waters in Ontario; in Manitoba, the Assiniboine River in the city of Winnipeg, the Red River and Shoal Lake; in B.C., Shuswap, Mara and Okanagan lakes. (Top)

For other boating waters in Canada the regulations are unclear. Even the Coast Guard guide mentions that a number of additional waterways are being considered for restrictions. The rest of Canada, presumably, requires at least a macerator/chlorinator but this is not spelled out in the guide.

Skippers of small pleasure craft in Canada have every right to be indignant when they cruise by a pipe spewing filth from a local industry or waterway. Or if they see a weir or a dam on one of their canals frothing at the mouth from detergent being dumped into the stream.

It has been estimated that one percent of the total pollution in our waterways comes from pleasure craft, with 10 percent from cottagers who line the banks. The rest, and by far the largest amount, comes from industries and farms. But these last major polluters are virtually above the law, far too strong politically to expect to be charged unless in extreme cases, such as when people died in Grassy Narrows in Ontario from by-products of local paper mills. If you want to know more about that, just drop me a line. (Editor's note: The author won the Canadian Kortright Magazine Writing Award for his series on water pollution in Canada.)

It appears that boaters in Ontario, and also those boating on selected waters in the rest of Canada, must accept a special role in the fight against water pollution despite that they represent a very small part of the problem, but must play the government game. The fact that we regard our lakes and rivers as a recreational resource rather than a sewer means that we must lead the fight for cleaner waterways.

So what of the multitude of boats that are too small, or simply unsuitable, for the installation of a holding tank system? Skippers should do a little research before a cruise to locate public toilets in the area and guests should be warned to "go" before they leave the dock.

And, of course, what you do when swimming from the boat is strictly between you and the fishes.

>>>>>>>>>>

Hope they get rid of this nonsensical restriction.

Regards,

Not For Hire · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 4:37 pm Post subject:

While I was making my long post Al put up the best summary. Leave it alone and be prepared to blarney your way thru any inspection.

Good travel to Ontario checklist link

http://www.trailersailors.org/cruises-refs&links.html

Hey Al how is the Baystar working out? Still good?

Regards,

Bearbait · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 4:54 pm Post subject:

I imagine Home Depot will sell a bunch of those nice big orange buckets.

Pat Anderson · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 8:26 pm Post subject:

I certainly don't know what the "real" BC regulations are currently, I assume Ron on Meander knows whereof he speaks, and the fact of the matter is, outside of the several posted "no discharge" zones, dilution is the solution...

MOOSE · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 9:18 pm Post subject:

Blueback · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 10:36 pm Post subject:

I was going to write and defend or clarify the Canadian Westcoast logic, Victoria vis a vis the porta-potti, but Ron and Pat did a very able job and they are well versed on the regs. it would seem.
PS. Victoria day's are numbered, as the BC Gov has told them to clean up their act or else.
Long live the PP-- long live freedom for the bowels of the ship-er boat.
Good health practices and common sense must prevail which of course means no dumping at anchor or in confined waters. Tidal currents that are flushing and mixing the water is the preferred site to dump the little devil. Just think about it, if Victoria goes to secondary treatment, how many PP will it take to reach back to their level of pollution.
Blues thoughts

Byrdman · Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 10:48 pm Post subject:

Wow... In Canada now...and spent time standing on the bridge that is in "My Big Fat Greek Wedding", ...the name of the bridge exscapes me..but, was watching the water police really inspecting not so much the boats...but the waters around the boats....looking for "things"/and "Stuff" floating around the boats.... I thought fuel leaks...but this topic puts a new thought in my mind. I may go back down and talk with them in the morning while Sherryl is in the conference for the day... Hummm

But... I have seen a few of these around... It does look like it mounts securely to your tow vehicle....and I guess we could get 2" receivers put on our swim platforms... and it is well "vented"...just hit the throttle...

Mr. Green